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Author
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Topic: Genesis "kinds" may be Nested Hierarchies.
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 85 of 218 (823094)
11-06-2017 1:25 AM
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Reply to: Message 78 by Coragyps
10-27-2017 12:22 PM
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Thank you for that information. There are mescaline-producing plants in Peru. Anyways, Darwin was so out-of-it when he consumed too much hallucinogen, he couldn't remember which country he was in.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 78 by Coragyps, posted 10-27-2017 12:22 PM | | Coragyps has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 87 by ringo, posted 11-06-2017 11:21 AM | | Dredge has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 90 of 218 (823646)
11-15-2017 2:34 AM
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Reply to: Message 86 by RAZD
11-06-2017 7:21 AM
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Re: platypus nested hierarchy
RAZD writes: Teeth are very valuable evidence
You make a valid point - I'd forgotten about how Nebraska Man was invented on the basis of one pig's tooth. That episode demonstrated that the standards of evolution science are of the highest quality.
quote: wiki: Tienolophos: Teinolophos trusleri was a prehistoric species of monotreme, or egg-laying mammal. It is known from a lower jawbone found in Flat Rocks, Victoria, Australia. It lived during the Aptian age of the Lower Cretaceous. The holotype is a partial left dentary known as NMV P208231. An age of approximately 123 million years makes this the earliest known monotreme. The lower molar is broadly similar in morphology to the m2 of Steropodon. The trigonid is compressed and the talonid has no basin. The dentary is about one sixth the size of Steropodon's, and wear facets indicate an "orthal" occlusion with the upper molars. The construction of the lower jaw differs from existing monotremes. Among the contrasts are the condyle, which is well above the tooth row (instead of at about the same height); and the ascending ramus, which is also higher. Also different is that Teinolophos probably had a strong bite. A unique feature for known toothed monotremes is that the trigonid is tall, while the talonid is set much lower. This is more like the general mammalian arrangement. The molar is double-rooted, which is plesiomorphic when compared to ornithorhynchids, but is a shared characteristic with Steropodon and Kollikodon. Subsequent monotreme molars are multi-rooted. I knew that ... learnt it all in primary school.
The fossils show exactly the intermediate stages we would expect from evolution and stages that are illogical for any "special creation" concepts.
I take your point. If you took the skeletons of all creatures in the world today, you could line them up to form lots of imaginary "evolutionary sequences". All you need to "join the dots" is a bit of imagination. You can play the same meaningless game with fossils. Edited by Dredge, : No reason given.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 86 by RAZD, posted 11-06-2017 7:21 AM | | RAZD has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 91 of 218 (823647)
11-15-2017 2:39 AM
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Reply to: Message 88 by Taq
11-06-2017 3:15 PM
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Taq writes: How is the observed phylogeny a myth? Not all ancestors are observed: "The extreme rarity of transitional forms in the fossil record persists as the trade secret of paleontology. The evolutionary trees that adorn our textbooks have data only at the tips and nodes of their branches; the rest is inference, however reasonable, not the evidence of fossils." S. J. Gould, "Evolutions Erratic Pace", Natural History, vol. 86, (1987) p.14. "... does [the lack of fossil evidence] permit us to invent a tale of continuity in most or all cases? I submit, although it may only reflect my lack of imagination, that the answer is No" - S. J. Gould.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 88 by Taq, posted 11-06-2017 3:15 PM | | Taq has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 94 by Pressie, posted 11-15-2017 3:51 AM | | Dredge has replied | | | Message 99 by Taq, posted 11-15-2017 4:05 PM | | Dredge has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 92 of 218 (823648)
11-15-2017 2:44 AM
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Reply to: Message 70 by jar
10-27-2017 6:45 AM
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jar writes: the Fact of Evolution It is a fact that all life on earth evolved from unicellular organisms?
Both the fact of Evolution as well as the fact that the Theory of Evolution is the only explanation that has ever been presented or tested are both supported by the majority of the recognized Christian faiths. Only the Christian Cult of Ignorance & Dishonesty deny those two facts. A million wrongs don't make a right.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 70 by jar, posted 10-27-2017 6:45 AM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 96 by jar, posted 11-15-2017 7:02 AM | | Dredge has not replied | | | Message 100 by Taq, posted 11-15-2017 4:06 PM | | Dredge has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 104 of 218 (824290)
11-26-2017 6:37 AM
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Reply to: Message 98 by RAZD
11-15-2017 2:36 PM
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Re: platypus nested hierarchy
They have to arrive at a nested hierarchies otherwise evolution falls to pieces - and that would be like losing one's religion or getting kicked out of the cult. Edited by Dredge, : No reason given.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 98 by RAZD, posted 11-15-2017 2:36 PM | | RAZD has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 110 by Tangle, posted 11-26-2017 11:03 AM | | Dredge has not replied | | | Message 122 by RAZD, posted 11-28-2017 7:51 AM | | Dredge has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 105 of 218 (824292)
11-26-2017 6:40 AM
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Reply to: Message 99 by Taq
11-15-2017 4:05 PM
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Real trees have real branches - not assumed or imaginary ones.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 99 by Taq, posted 11-15-2017 4:05 PM | | Taq has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 106 of 218 (824295)
11-26-2017 6:44 AM
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Reply to: Message 100 by Taq
11-15-2017 4:06 PM
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Taq writes: You have yet to say a right thing about phylogenetics, so what does that tell you?
... that I'm stupid and ignorant?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 100 by Taq, posted 11-15-2017 4:06 PM | | Taq has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 107 by jar, posted 11-26-2017 6:47 AM | | Dredge has not replied | | | Message 114 by Pressie, posted 11-27-2017 6:13 AM | | Dredge has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 108 of 218 (824297)
11-26-2017 6:49 AM
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Reply to: Message 101 by JonF
11-15-2017 4:21 PM
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Re: platypus nested hierarchy
The rationale for arranging them in that order is to make it look like the general theory of evolution is true - as is the wont of atheist "scientists".
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 101 by JonF, posted 11-15-2017 4:21 PM | | JonF has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 139 by Taq, posted 11-30-2017 11:11 AM | | Dredge has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 109 of 218 (824299)
11-26-2017 6:54 AM
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Reply to: Message 101 by JonF
11-15-2017 4:21 PM
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Re: platypus nested hierarchy
The rationale for arranging them that way is to make the atheist arranger feel better about his quasi-religious belief in evolution. Never underestimate the power of self-delusion.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 101 by JonF, posted 11-15-2017 4:21 PM | | JonF has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 111 by JonF, posted 11-26-2017 1:38 PM | | Dredge has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 112 of 218 (824330)
11-27-2017 5:11 AM
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Reply to: Message 111 by JonF
11-26-2017 1:38 PM
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Re: platypus nested hierarchy
I can't produce any nested hiearchies at all coz there are too many gaps that can't be accounted for.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 111 by JonF, posted 11-26-2017 1:38 PM | | JonF has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 117 of 218 (824403)
11-28-2017 3:17 AM
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Reply to: Message 94 by Pressie
11-15-2017 3:51 AM
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You have barked up the wrong tree twice in this one post. Your first Gould quote has nothing to do with my Gould quote. Your second Gould quote refers to Yung Erfers - I is not a Yung Erfer, but an Old Erfer. (Yung Erfers hate my beliefs in an old earth and a previous creation and some or them might even want to kill me to death ... or at least torture me for several days.) In short, your attempt to out-Gould-quote me, while admirable, has failed.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 94 by Pressie, posted 11-15-2017 3:51 AM | | Pressie has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 121 by Pressie, posted 11-28-2017 4:51 AM | | Dredge has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 118 of 218 (824404)
11-28-2017 3:21 AM
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Reply to: Message 93 by Tangle
11-15-2017 2:58 AM
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Re: platypus nested hierarchy
The Nebraska Man tooth was "severely weathered". In keeping with the highest standards of science, Nebraska Man was invented on the basis of one old weathered tooth. ... which reminds me ... Did you know that in 1872, an attempt was made to elect Charles Darwin to the Zoological section of the French Institute, but he was rejected - on account of the theories proposed in his books being seen as "not science, but a mass of assertions and absolutely gratuitous hypotheses, often evidently fallacious."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 93 by Tangle, posted 11-15-2017 2:58 AM | | Tangle has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 120 by Tangle, posted 11-28-2017 4:47 AM | | Dredge has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 119 of 218 (824405)
11-28-2017 3:24 AM
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Reply to: Message 103 by dwise1
11-16-2017 10:34 AM
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Re: platypus nested hierarchy
quote:
In his objections to evolution, he included the evolution of wings. Now, wings are modified forelimbs, but in his "objection" he had wings being additional limbs such that the end result would be like the popular image of angels with legs, arms, and wings. I questioned that on the spot and he realized his mistake.
—dwise1
Er, yeah; that's ... deep. When you say, "wings are modified forelimbs", is that anything like how the wings on flying pigs are modified ribs? What I mean is, wings are not "modified forelimbs" anymore than Tooth fairies are modified butterflies. And do you realise that in order for a lizard to fly, it needs much going on than just the acquisition of wings? Have you ever considered the possibility that your forelimbs-to-wings theory is just a silly and childish story that has no basis in fact? Edited by Dredge, : No reason given. Edited by Dredge, : No reason given.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 103 by dwise1, posted 11-16-2017 10:34 AM | | dwise1 has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 125 by ringo, posted 11-28-2017 11:09 AM | | Dredge has not replied | | | Message 127 by dwise1, posted 11-28-2017 3:33 PM | | Dredge has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 134 of 218 (824531)
11-30-2017 4:24 AM
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Reply to: Message 120 by Tangle
11-28-2017 4:47 AM
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Re: platypus nested hierarchy
Tangle writes: And your point is what?
My point is, not only was Nebraska Man fabricated on the basis of one tooth, that tooth was very weathered and thus hard to identify. Junk science built on junk evidence, in other words.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 120 by Tangle, posted 11-28-2017 4:47 AM | | Tangle has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 92 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 142 of 218 (824802)
12-03-2017 6:47 PM
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Reply to: Message 139 by Taq
11-30-2017 11:11 AM
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Re: platypus nested hierarchy
A cat fossil and a dog fossil could be imagined as transitional. Nothing to do with reality, however.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 139 by Taq, posted 11-30-2017 11:11 AM | | Taq has replied |
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