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Author Topic:   What is an "Ex Believer", anyway?
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 115 of 123 (826659)
01-06-2018 10:36 AM
Reply to: Message 114 by Faith
01-06-2018 3:17 AM


Re: How you got there
Faith writes:
Of course I am wondering if such an experience is crucial in the perseverance of the saints.
We had a great thread, Born Again which had a lively discussion between believers, non-believers, ex-believers and reality-based believers ...the only thing missing was our member Faith and you, Aussie. I was perusing this thread for any further ideas and insights regarding the phrase.
One thing is certain, reading my own posts. Something surely happened to me.
Also note that jar, whom I consider to be a rational Christian, has never had a born again experience yet remauins a believer.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
Paul was probably SO soaked in prayer nobody else has ever equaled him.~Faith

This message is a reply to:
 Message 114 by Faith, posted 01-06-2018 3:17 AM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 116 by jar, posted 01-06-2018 10:38 AM Phat has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 117 of 123 (826688)
01-07-2018 10:15 AM
Reply to: Message 116 by jar
01-06-2018 10:38 AM


What To Believe In
I believe that philosophically declaring that GOD, if GOD exists cant be omniscient without being evil, is also potentially destructive and a delusion.
Granted the Bible describes such a God, according to your plain reasoning. Why a majority of apologists don't see your conclusion is puzzling at best.
If our human definition of God places limits and conditions on His character, it would appear that we are limiting belief not only in Him but in focusing the emphasis on ourselves and our responsibilities rather than our eternal destiny.
Not necessarily criticising this mode of belief but only exposing it for what it is.
After all, what is it that we are believing in, why are some of us running from this belief, and why are others so vehemently defending it?

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
Paul was probably SO soaked in prayer nobody else has ever equaled him.~Faith

This message is a reply to:
 Message 116 by jar, posted 01-06-2018 10:38 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 118 by jar, posted 01-07-2018 10:25 AM Phat has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 119 of 123 (826690)
01-07-2018 10:45 AM
Reply to: Message 118 by jar
01-07-2018 10:25 AM


Re: What To Believe In
OK, you have a point. You (and Aussie) have to understand things from my perspective, however. It's not that I want a get out of hell free card. Personally, I believe that hell, if hell exists was simply created for beings that cant or won't change their mind. Your Pastor used to say hell? fuggedaboudit! and I think this is a wise approach as long as one does not mistake ultimate responsibility for ultimate freedom. It's easy to run, jump, play and explore a vast and wondrous universe as a responsible adult when one is healthy, but when one encounters illnesses and conditions for which there is no hope, a strong belief in an answer and a solution is often the necessary result.
And it gets down to asking the question of whether the belief and hope is hollow or whether it has substance. Reality suggests that medical science can only do so much. Reality suggests that I can only do so much. Reality does not suggest God, but Belief does.
What did Voltaire mean when he said that "if God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him"?

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
Paul was probably SO soaked in prayer nobody else has ever equaled him.~Faith

This message is a reply to:
 Message 118 by jar, posted 01-07-2018 10:25 AM jar has not replied

  
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