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Author | Topic: The Trump Presidency | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Percy Member Posts: 22480 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 4.8 |
caffeine writes: There's no meaningful difference in a war between Cro-Magnons beating each other over the heads with clubs over prime hunting grounds and modern armies clashing over oil fields. The specifics and details are inconsequential compared to the overriding repeating patterns.
Well that's just silly. Is there any difference between Trump and Obama? They're both Presidents and they both speak - what does it really matter if there are different words? Is there any difference between Trump and Obama, you ask? It depends on the category. Is the category people? They're both people. Is the category people who have served as president? They both fit. Is the category political party? They're both different. Is the category scumbags? One is, one isn't. In my example the category was wars over access to resources, a recurring theme throughout history.
If your only point was that there will always be conflict, then it's not a response to the original article, since I very much he was arguing anything so obvious. No, my point wasn't that there will always be conflict (though I do think there will never be an end to war). My point was that history, contrary to the claim in the article (What Trump does and doesn't have in common with Hitler), does continually repeat itself. Wars over access to resources was just an example of a recurring pattern of history.
'People engaging in conflict' is not a pattern;... I would disagree that wars over resources are not a recurring pattern throughout human history, but more generally, that there are patterns throughout history is not a novel or fringe idea but is widely held. The phrase "patterns of history" is familiar to everyone. Check out historic recurrence over at Wikipedia. Type "patterns of history" or "history repeating itself" in to Google.
...and the specifics and details are enormously consequential. The specifics and details are what decide whether this or that conflict will erupt into a shooting war or not; and if so how that war plays out and what are it's consequences. Is it a short, sharp affair; a decades-long conflict; localised, global? These things matter. I of course agree.
You may see no meaningful difference between two people getting into a fistfight and a global nuclear apocalypse, but you would understand if no one else agrees with you. I wasn't taking that position, but if I did then I would disagree with me, too. --Percy
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Pressie Member Posts: 2103 From: Pretoria, SA Joined: |
To me the funniest one yet is Trump wanting to change the libel laws in the US (very difficult to change).He's the Am President who's lied the most about people, ever. Does he even realise that if he manages to to do it he would be the first one serving many years in some penetentiary, or has to pay more than the 7 billion he claimed to have?
Edited by Pressie, : No reason given. Edited by Pressie, : No reason given.
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ramoss Member (Idle past 634 days) Posts: 3228 Joined:
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
quote: Trump tweeted a denial of having made the above statement. However Illinois Senator Dick Durbin, who was in an Oval Office meeting Thursday when the President called them "s---hole countries has confirmed that the President did use vulgar language to describe the countries from whom he wanted no immigration. Durbin noted that Graham confronted the president about his remarks. What I find amusing is that folks are defending these remarks even as Trump denies having made them. Beyond the racism and jingoism behind Trump's remarks, I think we should point out how misguided they are from a practical view. Generally speaking, why would we expect folks from Norway to immigrate here when on average they have it just as good at home, and by at least some measures better than here. By and large, the reasons for immigration here are twofold. 1) Better their situation financially, politically or both. 2) Reunite family members. Guess what that means? Not many Norwegians and a few more Nicaraguans are going to request to come here. Strip away the racist language, which Trump's denial attempts to do, and what's left is a racist immigration policy. And apparently, folks in Trump's base are more than willing to defend Trump's words on that basis. Namely objecting to the "browning of America". ABE: I did not intend to modify my original remarks, but instead to respond to them. A couple of GOP senators have indicated that they "do not recall" Trump making those remarks. But Lindsey Graham has confirmed that the reports "are basically accurate". At this point. I'm convinced that Trump is now lying. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door! We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World. Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith
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jar Member (Idle past 416 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Edmund Duffy was an editorial cartoonist with the Baltimore Sun at the same time as H.L. Mencken yet so many of his cartoons done in the 30s seem so pertinent today.
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Coragyps Member (Idle past 756 days) Posts: 5553 From: Snyder, Texas, USA Joined: |
I’ll bet $100 that Mr Trump includes Mr Shah’s ancestral country in his list of shitholes.
I wonder if Heard Island is looking for immigrants for a 3-year stay?
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NoNukes Inactive Member
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Trump refuses to visit the opening of a new embassy building in Britain because, well, Obama.
President Trump cancels London visit over 'bad' embassy deal | CNN Politics
quote: Of course this is total crap given that the decision to move the embassy from the old location was made in 2008 by the Bush administration.
quote: I suspect that the real reason for Trump not to visit has to do with the reception he is going to receive. Unlike the situation when Trump visits China or some other countries were dissent is going to be suppressed, Trump can likely expect a combination of boos and cheers with the possibility that the former are more prevalent. Trump has yet to make a state visit.
quote: Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) I was thinking as long as I have my hands up they’re not going to shoot me. This is what I’m thinking they’re not going to shoot me. Wow, was I wrong. -- Charles Kinsey We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World. Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith |
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Phat Member Posts: 18310 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1
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Trump Denies Using Vulgar Slur; Top Democrat Says He Said It
I have a theory, which I may have mentioned before. Trump is purposefully being as newsworthy and controversial (yes and stupid and racist) as possible in order to distract the public from the actual Republican Agenda and to lure public opinion into focus on him exclusively. Any other explanation couldn't begin to describe his errant behavior.Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Paul was probably SO soaked in prayer nobody else has ever equaled him.~Faith
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Percy Member Posts: 22480 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 4.8
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Phat writes: I have a theory, which I may have mentioned before. Trump is purposefully being as newsworthy and controversial (yes and stupid and racist) as possible in order to distract the public from the actual Republican Agenda and to lure public opinion into focus on him exclusively. Any other explanation couldn't begin to describe his errant behavior. There's an old aphorism (looking it up it apparently has a name, Hanlon's razor) that goes:
quote: Trump is impulsive, ignorant, manipulative , bullying, arrogant, narcissistic and a pathological liar - these are the primary qualities that render him incompetent and unfit for the office of president by a magnitude unsurpassed by any previous president, including his entirely appropriate (for him) hero, Andrew Jackson. These qualities rule the expressions of his defective character, which include misogynism, homophobia, bigotry, white supremacy, racism, xenophobia and greed. --Percy Edited by Percy, : Fix grammar.
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jar Member (Idle past 416 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
And remember, no President except maybe Ronald Reagan had a greater disregard for the Rule of Law and the US Constitution as well as a greater love for Genocide than Andrew Jackson.
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Percy Member Posts: 22480 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 4.8 |
Interesting week for Trump, ever by the standards of the previous week when the Fire and Fury book came out. I didn't have time to post about these during the week, so here's a summary:
Here's a link to the New York Times webpage enumerating Trump lies through last November: New York Times Trump Lies Page The Washington post has its own lies page, but you need a subscription to view it with Javascript: Washington Post Trump Lies Page --Percy
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Percy Member Posts: 22480 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 4.8 |
A "former White House official" was quoted in The Hill (Trump allies see 's***hole' controversy as overblown) as saying:
quote: About that last sentence, I do not think it true that "more Americans speak like President Trump than speak like Jim Acosta." I think it would be more accurate to say that the more uneducated, racist, bigoted and xenophobic someone is, the more likely they are to speak like Trump. --Percy
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
About that last sentence, I do not think it true that "more Americans speak like President Trump than speak like Jim Acosta." I agree with you Percy. But making the story all about Trump's language is just a deflection that many of Trump's supporters are employing. As disgusting as his language is, the real point is the nature of immigration policy that Trump and his supporters are insisting on. Trump's language and his desire to deport Haitians and not accept African immigrants because they are not "Norwegian enough" are both abominable, but the latter seems to something close to mainstream among Trump supporters and many members of Congress. It actually turns out that Nigerian immigrants are among the most successful highly educated immigrants among all folks who come here. If you want to have a merit-based immigration system, which is what folks claim they want, then such a policy would NOT start with barring folks from a shithole continent. Secondly, the reason a 'chain migration' policy was put in place was to reunite more folks with their families. Sounds pretty humane to me, and apparently, that was okay when more folks were coming here from Germany and Norway. But now, god forbid that Jose wants his brother Julio to come to America. Thirdly, who is going to request to immigrate here anyway? Folks who already have it great at home? Yes, folks who want to come here are in problematic countries, but is that news? What are those words on the Statue of Liberty again? Locker room language is the least thing wrong with what Trump said. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door! We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World. Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith
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caffeine Member (Idle past 1046 days) Posts: 1800 From: Prague, Czech Republic Joined:
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Not sure if this is getting as much play on the other side of the Atlantic, but Trump recently appointed a new ambassador to the Netherlands.
He was a controversial choice from the first because, despite being of Dutch ancestry, he ha publically promoted the view popular in some circles that Europe has already succumbed to Islamic fundamentalism. He was caught out in a deeply embarrassing interview with a Dutch journalist, who asked him about his claims that politicians in the Netherlands were being set on fire by Islamic fundamentalists. He claimed this was fake news, and upon being presented with video evidence, denied that he had called it fake news (a few minutes before). The poor chap is being hit in the face with the fact that such gaslighting techniques do not work when everything you say is being recorded. He had his first press conference in Holland recently. A journalist asked him to either back up his claims or retract them. He announced that he did not want to revisit the issue. A second journalist asked him to either back up his claims or retract them. He tried to ignore the question. A third journalist asked him to either back up his claims or retract them. It gets very painful to watch, I find this all a bit puzzling. Is this ideology trumping policy? Is it an intentional distraction from more important issues? Is it a misguided belief that the PVV represent the Dutch and Hoekstra would therefore find a happier reception?
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
Not sure if this is getting as much play on the other side of the Atlantic, but Trump recently appointed a new ambassador to the Netherlands. Somebody posted an article about it here.
Is this ideology trumping policy? Is it an intentional distraction from more important issues? Nothing is deemed more important than letting the folks at home know that you are putting another country second. Because that seems to be the way to put America first. At least Trump has gotten around to appointing a diplomat for your country. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door! We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World. Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith
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