Message 342 of 606 (828842)
02-25-2018 5:54 AM
Reply to: Message 341 by Phat
02-25-2018 4:43 AM
Re: Advice on Supplements
Phat responds to me:
While I trust your analysis, I question whether it is indeed a scam.
You did not just say that, did you?
You trust physical chemistry saying that what they claim is impossible, and yet it might not be a scam?
They went before Congress in a hearing.
Because Congress is filled with scientists and are capable of making a determination on a scientific question?
Harry Reasoner gave them a favorable review.
Because Harry Reasoner is a scientist?
Because the plural of "anecdote" is "data"?
No claims have ever been made by the Doc nor his sons.... it's the people who use the product that tout its claims.
And that doesn't make it a scam?
First, your claim that "No claims have ever been made by the Doc nor his sons" is simply not true. From their own website:
|This CAW micelle causes the formation of “a catalyst that alters the structure of water, making water behave in a manner that heretofore has not been reported in the literature” as stated by Dr. Willard.|
The micelle is an extremely small, very high energy particle with a powerful negative magnetic field. When added to ordinary water, it causes a change in the “ordinary” water molecules that can be likened to the difference between diamonds and graphite — both being made of carbon but with differing molecular structures. This new water molecule structure serves as a catalyst that seems to accelerate and enhance the body’s natural processes. Both Dr. Willard’s Water® and ordinary water consist of H2O molecules but the structure makes all the difference!
That is laughably stupid. It is impossible to do this. You will note that I over-emphasized one of the claims:
What is a "negative magnetic field"? Are they claiming they have managed to create magnetic monopoles? You see, this is one of the great mysteries of science: Certain interpretations of magnetic theory indicate that there should be magnetic monopoles just as there are electrical ones.
That is, there is a particle that carries an electric charge in a certain type: The electron. It carries a negative electric charge. No positive.
But there's also a particle that carries the opposite electric charge: The proton. It carries a positive electric charge. You put them near each other and you can generate an electric field. If an object has an electric dipole (like, for example, a water molecule), you can physically cut the object such that the positive charge is in one place and the negative charge is in another.
There are electric monopoles.
Well, there is a magnetic field, too. As we've all seen in grade school, you can put a piece of paper over a bar magnet and sprinkle iron filings on it and you can physically see the lines of magnetic force that flow from the north pole to the south pole.
But if you cut that magnet in half, you don't get a "north" magnet and a "south" magnet. Instead, you get two magnets, each with a north and south.
It turns out you can't actually physically separate out magnetism. Gauss' Law for Magnetism (del-dot-B = 0) indicates that there can't be any magnetic monopoles. Certain aspects of QM and string theory suggest the possibility of such, so it would be a huge discovery if someone had figured out a way to create just a south magnetic field (presuming that's what is meant by "negative magnetic field"). Because from what we can directly observe, that is physically impossible.
Especially by doing so chemically.
In short, there is no such thing as a "negative magnetic field." You can't create a magnetic field without having both a south and a north pole.
Or is he saying that his magic micelles violate the right-hand rule? That is, you can generate a magnetic field by moving an electric charge. This is how electromagnets work: You wrap a copper wire around an object that can hold a magnetic field (like an iron bar). When you run an electric current through the wire, the object will become magnetized. Turn off the current and the magnetic field disappears.
The direction of the magnetic field is determined by the direction of the current flowing by the right-hand rule: Hold your right hand out and make a "thumbs-up" gesture. If the direction your thumb is pointing is the direction the current is flowing, then the direction of your curled fingers is the direction of the magnetic field. For example, if you have your thumb pointing up, the field is going counter-clockwise as seen from above. Turn your hand over so that the current is flowing down, and the magnetic field will be flowing clockwise as seen from above.
Is he saying that he's created an electrical current that follows a left-hand rule? That would quite literally break physics as we know it and we need to give this man a Nobel Prize.
And that doesn't even begin to get into the nonsense of the phrase "high energy particle." You know what a "high energy particle" is?
But the thing about this is that you can't "contain" it. It's not like you can bottle radiation. That "high energy" means it is moving...until it hits something. At that point, it loses some of its energy...it be radiated away as heat. And that assumes it doesn't damage what it hit (which is why alpha radiation is dangerous). So there is no possible way that these micelles are "high energy."
And then there's the stupidity of the comparison with graphite and diamond.
The reason graphite and diamond are different is because they are both solid. Thus, there is a crystalline structure to examine. And indeed, graphite has a different crystalline structure (layered, planar either hexagonal or rhombohedral) than diamond (face-centered cubic). But the reason that works is because these are both solids and the atoms within the crystal structure do not move.
Liquids, on the other hand, have the atoms moving all over the place. Now, water is infamous for its hydrogen bonding, but that isn't enough to keep the individual water molecules in place. It's why liquids spread out to fill their container. There is no "structure" to alter.
We've already covered the fact that you can't change the bond angle and since there is no other "molecular structure" (outside of a phase change, but then you're talking about ice or steam, not water), this is quite literally nothing but a load of nonsense dressed up with scientific words that they're hoping you don't know anything about but will just accept out of your ignorance.
But wait, what do they say it can do? Again, from their own website:
|Dr. Willard’s Water® is not a nutrient, but a vehicle by which nutrients are carried throughout the body’s cells, and by which waste is carried away from the cells with water as a means of transportation. Animal research has shown that Dr. Willard’s Water® significantly increases the body’s ability to fully absorb essential vitamins and nutrients!|
Dr. Willard’s Water® has been tested and analyzed by many reputable laboratories and universities all around the world. While the reasons behind how Dr. Willard’s Water® actually works remains somewhat of a mystery, the amazing effects of ingesting Dr. Willard’s Water® are well documented.
So much for idea that they don't make any claims. They even have the fake studies to prove it!
But wait, there's more:
|When preparing your bottles of water, popsicles, smoothies or other ways to hydrate, don’t forget to add Willard Water! A small amount of this FDA-approved, patented formula that contains a water micelle catalyst can make big changes to your health!|
Through a multitude of studies and tests in universities and labs around the world, it was proven that Willard Water® plays a big role in making the vitamins, nutrients and antioxidants we get through our diet more bioavailable. What that means is that our bodies are able to absorb more of these health-boosting ingredients while more eliminating of the toxins that make us age and get sick. Additionally, our formula increases enzyme activity and strengthens the immune system!
So once again, the idea that the good doctor or his son don't make any claims is trivially proven false.
This isn't a bunch of yahoos using this product off-label. They are actively selling this for the specific reasons claimed.
And everything about their claims are false.
Ergo, a scam.
And like I said before, at worst it is a harmless placebo.
NO! It is not "a harmless placebo"! It is scamming you out of your money. You are ingesting god knows what in that "CAW micelle." They are playing on your gullibility and by doing so, setting you up for the next scam to come your way.
This is not "harmless."
So my jury is still out on whether or not it is actually no better than ordinary water.
We're back to me blinking again.
You trust physical chemistry saying that what they claim is impossible, and yet the "jury is out"?
Edited by Rrhain, : Fixing typo and a double-negative
Thank you for your submission to Science. Your paper was reviewed by a jury of seventh graders so that they could look for balance and to allow them to make up their own minds. We are sorry to say that they found your paper "bogus," specifically describing the section on the laboratory work "boring." We regret that we will be unable to publish your work at this time.
Minds are like parachutes. Just because you've lost yours doesn't mean you can use mine.
|This message is a reply to:|
| ||Message 341 by Phat, posted 02-25-2018 4:43 AM|| ||Phat has acknowledged this reply|