Religion or Science - How do they compare?

Nice attempt to excuse evil. But that's what you always do when problems with Protestants are pointed out.

Yeah, that's because at EvC everybody denies the evils I've pointed out, the really really bad evils, and instead makes a huge big deal about some bad Protestants, or even a mere slipup by a good Protestant, while accusing me of being a bigot for telling the truth. Protestantism as a movement is nothing at all like Catholicism or Islam, its doctrines are all peaceable unlike theirs, but the Liberal Nazis here have to pretend it is. Yes, liberalism is really today's Nazism. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Yes of course trying to bring the Native Americans into the modern world was as bad as democide, righto. The Liberal Nazis say so. I agree it wasn't a good thing to do, at least not the way they did it, but genocide? Truly twisted liberal Nazi propaganda.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Well Faith, destroying a culture, forbidding a religion, no allowing a peoples to speak their own language, destroying their sacred sites, making them change their names, dress, hair style and ethnically cleaning vast areas of the nation are genocide.

And there is probably the whitehot core of Liberal Nazism, smearing a parson who has described simple facts as if I'd advocated some kind of violence. Typical evil Nazi style smear campaign.

First I think you are exaggerating due to your anti-Christian agenda, and I know you have no perspective whatever in any case, but Native American religions like all heathen religions are of the devil. I agree that a lot of that was wrong and nobody should be treated like that, but genocide it is not. Time all you Liberal Nazis were called out for what you really are.

First Faith, stop lying. STOP LYING!I am a Christian, and I have no anti-Christian bias. You lying about me changes nothing.Second, even if you believed that the Native Religions were of the devil (an utterly stupid thing for you to say) it still does not justify genocide.

Absolutely, but so has nationalism, greed , lust for power etc. Actually I would say that when the Bible is used as justification for evil there is actually another motivation such as the ones I named behind it. In other words those atrocities, including those in the Bible, would have been justified by something else. Even the stories in the OT can be seen as lust for power and control over neighbouring tribes. Yes, but slavery was not the same as we think of slavery from more modern history and in the case of the Jews was not usually race based. In many ways it was similar to what a paid employee is today. Also, if you read the short book in the Bible called Philemon you can see that Paul writes a letter to Philemon asking that he treat his slave Onesimus as no longer a slave, but more than a slave, a beloved brother, especially to me, but how much more to you, both in the flesh and in the Lord. (Philemon 1:16) Firstly it doesn’t say that women can’t teach men and when you read through the NT there are numerous cases of women holding authoritative positions in the early church. Also, Paul is part of his culture, but after he talks about wives submitting to husbands he goes on to say that husbands are to love their wives as Christ loved the church and gave up his life for it. In other words a husband is to put his wife’s interest above his own. I think that is true in some cases in the bible but I don’t think that is always true. I do believe that God, with His still small voice or Holy Spirit, does speak into our hearts and I believe that to be the case in many of the writers of the OT. In the NT the picture of morality is based on the life and teachings of Jesus which I believe to be the embodiment of the moral nature of God. If that is correct then the moral values of the NT writers are based more upon Jesus than they are upon their own understanding. Just look at how Paul’s moral values were changed by his encounter with Jesus. But there is a criteria given to us by the Bible which fundamentalist Christians such as Faith ignore. The Gospel John starts out by telling us that in Jesus the Word, wisdom or nature of God became flesh, namely in Jesus. The question then is why do we give that statement credibility? I give it credibility because I believe that God resurrected Jesus into a life that is associated with, but distinct from the life that was taken from Him on the cross. God confirmed Jesus’ life and teaching. Taking that as a given, (which I am fully aware you don’t), then I can read through the OT where it has God commanding genocide and public stoning and be able to confidently say that those commands were not of God but of very fallible humans. I’m not so sure that I agree with the last statement. I think in many ways that we are just as self centered as we ever were but it just looks different. However, we have no real evidence that our evolved set of social and moral standards are the result of an evolutionary process set in place by intelligence or by mindless processes.
In order to accept the concept of an actual right and wrong ,then we pretty much have to accept that something beyond ourselves is a basis for that fact. If our understanding of right and wrong is simply evolved from mindlessness then there is no universal right and wrong and our views are then based on what seems to work best for us now. In the future we may come to the conclusion that it is morally right to commit genocide because our tribe needs the resources of some other tribe and that becomes our moral imperative.BTW. Your approach reminds me a lot of Chris Hitchens who in general I thought asked all the right questions, and in a lot of cases sounded more Christ like than a lot of Christians.

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And there is probably the whitehot core of Liberal Nazism, smearing a parson who has described simple facts as if I'd advocated some kind of violence

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And there we have your evil exposed. I didn’t say anything about advocating violence. I said that you provided examples of anti-semitism. And you did.Moreover you only call them facts because they come from the Bible. The Barabbas story in particular is almost certainly a fiction. So we have anti-semitism in the Bible.Calling me a Nazi - when you are defending genocide - is just a typical example of your vile and hypocritical lying.So much for the benefit of the doubt!

Anti Semitism requires 1) lying and 2) some implied or direct threat of harm. I gave true facts and already objected to Luther's advice for punishment against the Jews. And you do not get to say something in the Bible is a fiction, or call it genocide. That does make you a Liberal Nazi.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Anti Semitism requires 1) lying and 2) some implied or direct threat harm.

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Stop making things up.

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I gave true facts

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That you think they are true does not make them true.

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And you do not get to say something in the Bible is a fiction, or call it genocide. That does make you a Liberal Nazi

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Faith I understand that you are an evil lying slanderer. But contrary to your silly opinion that does not give you the right or the power to silence the truth.

Of course we have the evidence, you've been shown it many times. You might prefer to forget it but the evidence is there. We absolutely do not. You can believe something different but please stop making these silly claims on behalf of others. There is no universal right and wrong, morality does change over time and between societies. You can see that in the bible itself. The actual evidence tells us the exact opposite - as our societies evolve empathy and compassion for others increases at a nation level. I'd show you the charts but you'd just block them fom your mind and make the same claims in a month's time.

Just because you don't believe them doesn't make them false. They are established Biblical facts and facts are not anti-Semitism. It takes at least a lie and a threat of harm to be anti-Semitism.You are the one silencing the truth. Just another Liberal Nazi.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Just because you don't believe them doesn't make them false.

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The fact that their truth is very much in question should prevent any honest person from relying on them as facts. If you want to establish that they are facts, I am willing to discuss the evidence. Are you ?

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They are established Biblical facts and facts are not anti-Semitism. It takes at least a lie and a threat of harm to be anti-Semitism.

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They aren’t established as facts. It neither requires a lie or a threat of harm to be anti-semitism. Prejudice against or hostility to Jews is quite adequate and you are expressing both. And let us not forget that you are raising these facts as excuses for Luther’s anti-semitism which did indeed encourage harm to the Jews.

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You are the one silencing the truth. Just another Liberal Nazi.

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Yes, we know that you are a raging hypocrite as well as a liar and a slanderer.

Their truth has not been questioned by millennia of people who believe them. Only by Liberal Nazis in recent times.