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Author Topic:   Motley Flood Thread (formerly Historical Science Mystification of Public)
dwise1
Member
Posts: 3237
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


Message 736 of 877 (835211)
06-19-2018 4:42 PM
Reply to: Message 728 by Faith
06-19-2018 3:25 PM


Re: Strata eroded or deformed in blocks proves Geo Column / Time Scale over and done with
... the differences between them requiring incremental changes that could not possibly happn on the trial and error basis that would have to lead from one to the other.

What the hell are you babbling about? What "trial and error basis"? You appear to be trying to talk about evolution, but failing miserably at it. You fail because you have no clue what you are talking about.

Unfortunately, her abject ignorance does not keep Pope Faith from pontificating endlessly on subjects that she knows nothing about.

Faith, please go to a library and learn something! Ignorance does not work, so you must stop relying on it. Yes, I do realize that your religion requires to carefully keep and guard your ignorance, but that is because it is a false religion that cannot survive simple truths. That kind of a false religion is not worth living in abject ignorance.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 728 by Faith, posted 06-19-2018 3:25 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 742 by Faith, posted 06-19-2018 9:07 PM dwise1 has responded

    
foreveryoung
Member (Idle past 99 days)
Posts: 901
Joined: 12-26-2011


Message 737 of 877 (835215)
06-19-2018 7:33 PM


Faith

Is the existence of a global flood four thousand years ago and a six day creation absolutely vital for the idea of God to be valid?


Replies to this message:
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edge
Member
Posts: 4451
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002
Member Rating: 4.3


Message 738 of 877 (835216)
06-19-2018 8:38 PM
Reply to: Message 732 by Faith
06-19-2018 3:50 PM


Re: subjective interpretation
There is no evidence left of the perfection of the original Creation, I'm assuming it. What I actually see is wreckage, period.

My, what a ray of sunshine you are today!

Undoubtedly, this wreckage has completely destroyed all of your evidence! How convenient for you! You should rejoice!

Edited by edge, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 732 by Faith, posted 06-19-2018 3:50 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
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edge
Member
Posts: 4451
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002
Member Rating: 4.3


Message 739 of 877 (835217)
06-19-2018 8:42 PM
Reply to: Message 725 by ringo
06-19-2018 2:11 PM


Re: subjective interpretation
God did it, so in your world death must be a good thing.

Especially when you consider that God also destroyed the evidence by wrecking the world.

Wait ... is that good or bad ... ?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 725 by ringo, posted 06-19-2018 2:11 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 30481
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 740 of 877 (835218)
06-19-2018 8:58 PM
Reply to: Message 738 by edge
06-19-2018 8:38 PM


Re: subjective interpretation
No evidence left of the original Creation, alas, unless someone else might be able to piece it together from the ruins, though I can't, but there is plenty of evidence of the Flood itself.

I thought perhaps if you quietly pondered the work you do you might also see the wreckage I'm talking about.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


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Faith
Member
Posts: 30481
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 741 of 877 (835219)
06-19-2018 8:59 PM
Reply to: Message 737 by foreveryoung
06-19-2018 7:33 PM


Yes.
This message is a reply to:
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Faith
Member
Posts: 30481
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 742 of 877 (835220)
06-19-2018 9:07 PM
Reply to: Message 736 by dwise1
06-19-2018 4:42 PM


Re: Strata eroded or deformed in blocks proves Geo Column / Time Scale over and done with
Surely it is clear that to get from one species to another would require lots and lots of transitionals and lots and lots and lots of trial and error before the right combinations show up, and this would have to happen increment by increment. You don't get from a two chambered reptilian ear design to the three chambered mammalian ear in which the parts are in different positions from the mammalian ear unless the genetic design is already present but it isn't, so it would have to be formed by genetic trial and error increment by increment. Isn't that what makes all those millions upon millions of years necessary? Otherwise variations that are built in happen in a matter of generations. I notice you don't bother to describe the process you must think is more efficient.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 736 by dwise1, posted 06-19-2018 4:42 PM dwise1 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 769 by dwise1, posted 06-20-2018 6:04 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 30481
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 743 of 877 (835221)
06-19-2018 9:12 PM
Reply to: Message 735 by jar
06-19-2018 4:09 PM


Re: evidence based reasoning
Most of the fossil things you mention are explainable on the Flood model and those that aren't will be eventually.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 735 by jar, posted 06-19-2018 4:09 PM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 744 by edge, posted 06-19-2018 10:14 PM Faith has responded
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edge
Member
Posts: 4451
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002
Member Rating: 4.3


Message 744 of 877 (835222)
06-19-2018 10:14 PM
Reply to: Message 743 by Faith
06-19-2018 9:12 PM


Re: evidence based reasoning
Most of the fossil things you mention are explainable on the Flood model and those that aren't will be eventually.

The fludde model does not explain the most basic thing about the fossil record: the order of fossils through time.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 743 by Faith, posted 06-19-2018 9:12 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 806 by Faith, posted 06-23-2018 11:38 AM edge has not yet responded

  
Pollux
Member
Posts: 239
Joined: 11-13-2011


Message 745 of 877 (835225)
06-20-2018 1:40 AM
Reply to: Message 674 by Faith
06-17-2018 3:52 PM


Tectonic bashing and crashing
Hi Faith

You place the major amount of tectonic motion toward the end of the Flood, and this would include the associated vulcanism, so lets consider what is involved. There are very many active, dormant and extinct volcanoes in the western Americas which have to be built by both tectonic uplift and also by volcanic deposit. Large volcanic eruptions make their presence felt well away from the actual volcano. For instance Tambora in 1816 caused weather effects and famines across the Northern hemisphere in producing about 30 cubic Km of ejecta. Toba, the biggest in recent geologic time - 74000 years ago and 1200 cubic km - sent its ash over India and is measurable in Africa in Lake Malawi cores at about 42 metres deep (which is where it would be expected after carbon dating the upper layers to 50000 at 28 metres.) There is nothing comparable above it. Incidentally there are human artefacts above and below the ash in India.

To build the American volcanoes alone without the world-wide ones requires orders of magnitude more ejecta. Surely this should have left an obvious layer ABOVE the Grand canyon layers. Where is it? Alternatively, what would your Flood hypothesis predict we should see?

Then we can add in the problem of literally 10s if not 100s of millions cubic km of flood basalts which have to be produced without poisoning poor Noah and his so carefully preserved menagerie from the associated gases.

Edited by Pollux, : grammar


This message is a reply to:
 Message 674 by Faith, posted 06-17-2018 3:52 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
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 Message 749 by Faith, posted 06-20-2018 4:43 AM Pollux has responded

    
Minnemooseus
Member
Posts: 3688
From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior)
Joined: 11-11-2001
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 746 of 877 (835226)
06-20-2018 2:15 AM
Reply to: Message 732 by Faith
06-19-2018 3:50 PM


Seems the flood only affected the air breathing life that needed saving by the ark
There is no evidence left of the perfection of the original Creation, I'm assuming it. What I actually see is wreckage, period.

And the strata certainly are evidence of the Flood.

It has struck me that the Biblical narrative makes to mention of the flood affecting anything other than drowning all the air breathers except those on the ark.

After submerging the land areas for about a year, the waters receded and everything was again ready for the ark survivors. No consideration of the devastation that would have happened to all plant life, among other things.

Even if the extreme remodeling of the lands as Faith envisions had not happened, the land surfaces would still be unsuitable for sustaining the ark survivors.

Moose


This message is a reply to:
 Message 732 by Faith, posted 06-19-2018 3:50 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 750 by Faith, posted 06-20-2018 5:02 AM Minnemooseus has not yet responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 14634
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 747 of 877 (835227)
06-20-2018 2:49 AM
Reply to: Message 745 by Pollux
06-20-2018 1:40 AM


Re: Tectonic bashing and crashing
Thatís before we deal with the fact that the Cardenas lava erupted through the surface while the sediments of the Dox formation were still being deposited.

The Grand Canyon Supergroup just keeps on contradicting Faith.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 745 by Pollux, posted 06-20-2018 1:40 AM Pollux has not yet responded

    
jar
Member
Posts: 30934
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 748 of 877 (835230)
06-20-2018 4:05 AM
Reply to: Message 743 by Faith
06-19-2018 9:12 PM


Re: evidence based reasoning
Bullshit Faith.

None of the things I mentioned are eplained by any flood model and you simply continuing to repeat utter falsehoods.

No flood model explains the sorting found in reality.


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios † † My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 743 by Faith, posted 06-19-2018 9:12 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 30481
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 749 of 877 (835231)
06-20-2018 4:43 AM
Reply to: Message 745 by Pollux
06-20-2018 1:40 AM


Re: Tectonic bashing and crashing
Volcanic ash above the Grand Canyon would have probably settled on the Flood water which was in the first stages of receding, and/or been washed away with the strata above the Grand Canyon which were at least two miles deep. In fact most of the volcanoes would probably have occurred under water or at least their contents would have landed in the water and been carried away as it receded. Something like that.

Please understand that my theories about the Flood are a work in progress, but I do continue to like my current idea about the timing of the continental split with the receding of the Flood. I'm sure there were many things going on that can't be guessed at. One thing that might have had a dampening effect on the worldwide effects of the volcanism is the ice age which most likely immediately followed the Flood, something to do with warmer oceans and colder land mass according to some creationist source I read.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 745 by Pollux, posted 06-20-2018 1:40 AM Pollux has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 794 by Pollux, posted 06-21-2018 7:59 AM Faith has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 30481
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 750 of 877 (835232)
06-20-2018 5:02 AM
Reply to: Message 746 by Minnemooseus
06-20-2018 2:15 AM


Re: Seems the flood only affected the air breathing life that needed saving by the ark
t has struck me that the Biblical narrative makes to mention of the flood affecting anything other than drowning all the air breathers except those on the ark.

After submerging the land areas for about a year, the waters receded and everything was again ready for the ark survivors. No consideration of the devastation that would have happened to all plant life, among other things.

Even if the extreme remodeling of the lands as Faith envisions had not happened, the land surfaces would still be unsuitable for sustaining the ark survivors.

The Bible doesn't describe a lot of things that we are left to figure out from the scant clues it gives. I've pondered this situation a bit. I figure plenty of plant life, seeds and so on, were carried on the ark, and that the plants on the land, being pre-Flood, would have been extremely hardy and vigorous as all life was in the original world, human beings living many hundreds of years for instance. So it's possible that much of the plant life could have survived the Flood, believe it or not, and seeds could have germinated much more rapidly. There would also probably have been enough food on the ark to sustain them all for some period of time while plants got reestablished. Noah had a vineyard shortly after the ark landed. Anyway the first growing things would have had great vigor compared to plants today. Every living thing today is a very weak version of what it was originally created to be. The devastated environment would have taken a toll on all animal and plant life, some right away no doubt, the ice age beig a factor in that, but others taking a few hundred years, and there would have been a great loss of genetic diversity in all living things as well, not to mention the DNA damage due to mutations that would have been increasing -- not enough to make a huge difference for quite some time, but by now the difference is upon us.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
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