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Author Topic:   Evangelical Switch from Pro-choice to Anti-abortion
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(2)
Message 299 of 441 (837742)
08-08-2018 12:06 PM
Reply to: Message 272 by LamarkNewAge
08-07-2018 1:28 PM


Re: I think the issue might have to do with allowing a premature birth.
LamarkNewAge writes:
The issue here seems to be having a doctor simply remove the baby prematurely, as opposed to using surgical tools to dismember it.
The issue is who decides. The medical staff need to decide what can be done and the woman needs to decide what should be done without interference from every Tom, Dick and Harry who has an opinion.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 272 by LamarkNewAge, posted 08-07-2018 1:28 PM LamarkNewAge has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 300 of 441 (837743)
08-08-2018 12:09 PM
Reply to: Message 273 by Tangle
08-07-2018 2:19 PM


Re: If abortion is understood to be ending a human life, THEN we can talk alternatives
Tangle writes:
And, of course, the law already does.
There is no such thing as "the" law. It varies. There is nothing absolute about it.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 273 by Tangle, posted 08-07-2018 2:19 PM Tangle has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 302 by Tangle, posted 08-08-2018 12:30 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 305 of 441 (837749)
08-08-2018 1:06 PM
Reply to: Message 302 by Tangle
08-08-2018 12:30 PM


Re: If abortion is understood to be ending a human life, THEN we can talk alternatives
Tangle writes:
Sure there is, if you drink drive you'll lose your licence.
Did you deliberately pick a bad example? Drunk driving laws vary widely from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, just like abortion laws. There is no universal agreement.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 302 by Tangle, posted 08-08-2018 12:30 PM Tangle has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 306 by Tangle, posted 08-08-2018 1:09 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 308 of 441 (837752)
08-08-2018 1:36 PM
Reply to: Message 306 by Tangle
08-08-2018 1:09 PM


Re: If abortion is understood to be ending a human life, THEN we can talk alternatives
Tangle writes:
Any place you go the law there is absolute and real.
And different. Don't lose the plot here. We're talking about when a fetus becomes human and when terminating it constitutes "harm". There is no universal agreement on that. There isn't. There really isn't. Even you should be able to see that right here in this very thread.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 306 by Tangle, posted 08-08-2018 1:09 PM Tangle has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 327 of 441 (837811)
08-09-2018 2:48 PM
Reply to: Message 326 by Faith
08-09-2018 2:41 PM


Re: If abortion is understood to be ending a human life, THEN we can talk alternatives
Faith writes:
Murder has always been an elective procedure in civilized nations.
I thought you agreed to stop calling it murder.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 326 by Faith, posted 08-09-2018 2:41 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 328 by Faith, posted 08-09-2018 2:49 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 329 of 441 (837814)
08-09-2018 2:56 PM
Reply to: Message 328 by Faith
08-09-2018 2:49 PM


Re: If abortion is understood to be ending a human life, THEN we can talk alternatives
Faith writes:
Sometimes it is murder and needs to be called murder to wake some people up.
So "sometimes" you're in favour of executing or imprisoning the woman.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 328 by Faith, posted 08-09-2018 2:49 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 330 by Faith, posted 08-09-2018 3:21 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 332 of 441 (837818)
08-09-2018 3:40 PM
Reply to: Message 330 by Faith
08-09-2018 3:21 PM


Re: If abortion is understood to be ending a human life, THEN we can talk alternatives
Faith writes:
Not interested in the semantics of the issue.
Don't care if you're interested. If you keep making the same mistake, I'm going to keep calling you on it.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 330 by Faith, posted 08-09-2018 3:21 PM Faith has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 352 of 441 (837959)
08-11-2018 11:58 AM
Reply to: Message 351 by Faith
08-11-2018 2:21 AM


Re: If abortion is understood to be ending a human life, THEN we can talk alternatives
Faith writes:
... the point at which it becomes alive and human....
That's two points. Alive is <= human but beyond that there's a lot of ambiguity.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 351 by Faith, posted 08-11-2018 2:21 AM Faith has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 390 of 441 (838124)
08-14-2018 11:46 AM
Reply to: Message 389 by Faith
08-14-2018 10:45 AM


Re: If abortion is understood to be ending a human life, THEN we can talk alternatives
Faith writes:
It is never at any point something OTHER than a human being....
I'll point out once again, just for completeness, not out of any hope that you will ever understand: That idea has NOT been accepted by ANYBODY until quite recently. The Jews didn't believe it. The early Christians didn't believe it. Evangelical Christians didn't believe it.
It only became fashionable in some circles when abortions became safe and available.
I'm not saying that abortions suddenly became right or wrong. I'm just saying that the idea that the fetus is human is NOT the logic, it is NOT the science and it is NOT the theology.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 389 by Faith, posted 08-14-2018 10:45 AM Faith has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 407 of 441 (838165)
08-14-2018 9:42 PM
Reply to: Message 398 by Faith
08-14-2018 2:18 PM


Re: If abortion is understood to be ending a human life, THEN we can talk alternatives
Faith writes:
I haven't called it a "human being," I've been calling it a human life.
I rather like that distinction. I might start using it myself.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 398 by Faith, posted 08-14-2018 2:18 PM Faith has not replied

  
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