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Author Topic:   The Atheist Experience
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 20 of 283 (839600)
09-10-2018 8:50 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by Tangle
09-10-2018 3:58 PM


Re: In Brief
Tangled writes:
But you don't know god. And you can't know god. Quite apart from the fact that the thing you call god doesn't exist, there is no way you could know a supernatural being if it did.
Scripture tells us that eternal life is knowing God, so if we have eternal life, meaning if we are saved we do know God. That's the whole point of being saved, to recover the communication with God that was lost at the Fall, when Adam and Eve disobeyed God and lost their spiritual connection with Him.
John 17:3 writes:
And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

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 Message 28 by Taq, posted 09-11-2018 12:09 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 21 of 283 (839604)
09-10-2018 10:34 PM
Reply to: Message 19 by Hyroglyphx
09-10-2018 5:59 PM


Re: In Brief
Looking back at my time in Christianity, I see how restless my mind was. It is utterly exhausting to be a Christian (at least one that actually attempts to live out their faith in earnest). There is no "peace" in it... just constant self-flagellation.
I have a hard time grasping this idea. It sounds like "works-righteousness" or legalism, rather than salvation by faith. There are plenty of struggles in the Christian life, some of them due to misunderstanding it, some due to our own sin problems, some due to spiritual warfare with the satanic hordes, and some due to conflicts with the world with which we find ourselves increasingly at odds as we grow; and probably other causes I'm not thinking of. But I would think that once one has "tasted" God ("Oh taste as see that the Lord is good") nothing on earth could possibly compete.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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 Message 31 by Hyroglyphx, posted 09-12-2018 3:22 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 30 of 283 (839620)
09-11-2018 1:25 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by Taq
09-11-2018 12:09 PM


Re: In Brief
hy many atheists remain unconvinced is that these are claims made by humans. Scripture was written by humans.
And when atheists do get converted it's often when they've come to recognize that they were wrong about this.

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 Message 35 by Taq, posted 09-12-2018 6:06 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 32 of 283 (839659)
09-12-2018 6:34 AM
Reply to: Message 31 by Hyroglyphx
09-12-2018 3:22 AM


Re: In Brief
I couldn't care less about "meaning." If it isn't true it's worthless, and of course I believe it to be true.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 34 of 283 (839667)
09-12-2018 4:19 PM
Reply to: Message 33 by Phat
09-12-2018 3:24 PM


Re: In Brief
If it's true it's true, Phat, it's true for everybody, there is no such thing as truth for some but not others. There's also plenty of evidence: the Bible is evidence. Still, God has to open people's eyes.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 40 of 283 (839731)
09-14-2018 3:02 AM
Reply to: Message 35 by Taq
09-12-2018 6:06 PM


Re: In Brief
And when atheists do get converted it's often when they've come to recognize that they were wrong about this.
Atheists do convert to religions all of the time, and religious people deconvert to atheism all of the time. I really don't see how you can read anything into this.
What I said is true: when they convert it's often because they've come to recognize that the Bible is not man-made.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 67 of 283 (839793)
09-16-2018 9:33 AM
Reply to: Message 66 by Tangle
09-16-2018 2:18 AM


Re: What differences between Christianity and Atheism
Agnosticism is a linguistic invention designed to obfuscate a lack of belief so as to make it acceptable in polite Victorian company. There are believers and non-believers, those that say they're agnostic, by definition, are not believers.
Sort of, and that's how they are viewed in Christian theology too: your are an atheist if you aren't a believer, period. But I think some people are truly on the fence, not having any clear reason to believe but not being quite ready to throw away the idea altogether either.

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 Message 66 by Tangle, posted 09-16-2018 2:18 AM Tangle has replied

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


(7)
Message 77 of 283 (839858)
09-17-2018 8:19 AM
Reply to: Message 76 by Tangle
09-17-2018 2:50 AM


Re: What differences between Christianity and Atheism
Tangle writes:
nwr writes:
There can be degrees of belief.
If you believe a just a little tiny bit you're not agnostic, you're still a believer.
You're being awfully strict for no good reason that I can see. If someone really doesn't feel there's much ground for belief but doesn't want to give up on it completely so holds on to the possibility, I think that could fairly be described as agnosticism: he's saying he doesn't know, can't prove it one way or the other, won't commit to all-out atheism but also not to religion either.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 84 of 283 (839881)
09-17-2018 4:38 PM
Reply to: Message 83 by Tangle
09-17-2018 3:45 PM


Re: Holding On To Rationality At All Costs
That's an awfully underhanded remark, Tangle, and totally false anyway.

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 Message 83 by Tangle, posted 09-17-2018 3:45 PM Tangle has replied

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 Message 85 by Tangle, posted 09-17-2018 6:11 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 86 of 283 (839894)
09-18-2018 6:17 AM
Reply to: Message 85 by Tangle
09-17-2018 6:11 PM


Re: Holding On To Rationality At All Costs
Phat is no more irrational than you or anyone else here. He says some things I consider to be pretty confused at times but that doesn't mean he himself is irrational.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 85 by Tangle, posted 09-17-2018 6:11 PM Tangle has replied

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 Message 87 by Tangle, posted 09-18-2018 9:02 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 89 of 283 (839913)
09-18-2018 2:20 PM
Reply to: Message 87 by Tangle
09-18-2018 9:02 AM


Re: Holding On To Rationality At All Costs
You're not the best judge of what is rational and what isn't Faith.
I bet I'd pass an objective test of rationality higher than most here. But if it's designed just to debunk religious belief, which is all you mean anyway, that's something else.

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 Message 90 by Tangle, posted 09-18-2018 3:43 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 91 of 283 (839917)
09-18-2018 3:58 PM
Reply to: Message 90 by Tangle
09-18-2018 3:43 PM


Re: Holding On To Rationality At All Costs
No money, just a pat on the back. Find the test first.

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 Message 90 by Tangle, posted 09-18-2018 3:43 PM Tangle has replied

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 Message 92 by Tangle, posted 09-18-2018 4:37 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 93 of 283 (839921)
09-18-2018 4:48 PM
Reply to: Message 92 by Tangle
09-18-2018 4:37 PM


Re: Holding On To Rationality At All Costs
Find a test. I found a few that aren't very apropos but I'm continuing to look.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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 Message 95 by Phat, posted 09-19-2018 1:33 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 94 of 283 (839923)
09-18-2018 10:15 PM
Reply to: Message 92 by Tangle
09-18-2018 4:37 PM


Re: Holding On To Rationality At All Costs
Look, I know that confirmation bias involves ignoring the information that DOESN'T fit the perceived pattern. The thing is the pattern isn't resting on an exclusive collection of information but a preponderance of incidents with the same theme that occurred exactly on that theme, exactly, precisely, not two sentences away. I was getting lots of those. The theme is NOT that common and I haven't had one occur since. Which of course in itself suggests the whole thing was an illusion, but it was quite a collection of related images, seeming beyond chance.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : j
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 97 of 283 (839939)
09-19-2018 1:09 PM
Reply to: Message 96 by Phat
09-19-2018 10:42 AM


Re: Holding On To Rationality At All Costs
You do have a point in regards to subjective evidenced beliefs and how we do have a personal stake in them. It may well be that no believer can totally throw it all away in order to think critically. I try, but I won't simply let go of my strongly held beliefs in order to arrive at some possible truth which I don't trust nor feel comfortable with.
If you believe the Bible is God's inspired word to us, you don't treat it as man-made by subjecting it to the kind of thinking you'd subject any man-made doctrine to. It is given to us to learn from, period. Everything else you can dissect and criticize, but not God's word.

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