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Author Topic:   Being offended.
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8527
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.4


Message 196 of 444 (845900)
12-21-2018 7:45 PM
Reply to: Message 193 by riVeRraT
12-21-2018 6:40 PM


Re: No one?
It's becoming more and more of a conversation.
As well it should.
This, along with the NAZIs, needs to be openly discussed on the national stage for all to see. Only an informed society can best determine how to react to political opinion whether that be NAZI hate speech or limiting the First Amendment to, somehow, limit speech we just don't like. We can only know the vile philosophy of the NAZI by hearing their hate speech. By legislating speech we drive it underground where it will fester and burn. At least in the open other movements in society can constantly throw water on hate groups.
Hopefully this society can realize that if we can limit the hate speech of the NAZIs we can limit the very uncomfortable speech of Black Lives Matter and Planned Parenthood, as well. And the poor christians with their persecution complex ... is not saying Merry Christmas a form of hate speech? More than a few christian legislator's, especially at the state and local level, may not disagree.
One of the big experiments in this country is to make the freedom of speech, and the demonstrations of opposition to what is said, absolute. Well, as absolute as we can without allowing them to incite immediate violent action.
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 193 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 6:40 PM riVeRraT has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 203 by Faith, posted 12-28-2018 1:46 PM AZPaul3 has seen this message but not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17825
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


(2)
Message 197 of 444 (845903)
12-22-2018 12:34 AM
Reply to: Message 190 by riVeRraT
12-21-2018 6:31 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
quote:
Well duh. Just don't go making laws about your idea of bigotry.
That’s funny because your main concern seems to be about silencing any mention of bigotry on the right.
quote:
I already have.
No, you haven’t.
quote:
And there always will be. Racism was on decline from the 70s until Obama took office. It's hardly the problem it was, and the people fighting against it are pussies compared to fighting for it back when it wasn't popular to do so. I know because I have fought against it my whole life. Being against racism in the 70s and 80s was a lot different than today. It's a joke what I see today. Hardly worth the press it gets.
No, I don’t think that’s true. I think that there was a lot of racism there. The hate of a Black man winning the Presidency just made a lot of it more obvious.
quote:
I do.
You certainly haven’t discussed that. Trump stirring up hate against Mexicans is worrying because of the potential for harm - broadly considered - against anyone perceived as Mexican in the US. Offence is hardly the real issue.
quote:
I do. Stop using it as some kind of justification. 2 wrongs do not make a right
You don’t try to discuss the faults of the right. You try to bully me into silence over them with your lies and your hate and your false accusations. And calling for honest discussion rather than political propaganda is hardly claiming that two wrongs make a right.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 190 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 6:31 PM riVeRraT has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17825
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 198 of 444 (845904)
12-22-2018 12:39 AM
Reply to: Message 191 by riVeRraT
12-21-2018 6:34 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
quote:
You really didn't address any of my points with fact. You are just name calling, what you do best and why you aren't taken seriously by me.
Your sole point was to falsely attack me with your hypocritical lies. None of them supported by fact.
Now certainly you may run away because your nasty bullying tactics don’t work, but the very fact that you had to resort to them shows that you take me very seriously.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 191 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 6:34 PM riVeRraT has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17825
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


(1)
Message 199 of 444 (845905)
12-22-2018 12:42 AM
Reply to: Message 192 by riVeRraT
12-21-2018 6:35 PM


quote:
And again.
I think the fact that you can’t show anywhere that you were genuinely spreading love is proof enough. It’s pretty easy to find examples of hate in your posts here - but not love..

This message is a reply to:
 Message 192 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 6:35 PM riVeRraT has not replied

  
riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 436 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 200 of 444 (845916)
12-22-2018 3:26 PM
Reply to: Message 156 by Stile
12-21-2018 11:54 AM


Re: Respectful Offense
What does any of this have to do with the idea of teaching people not to be offended is better? Are you so in the dark that you don't see what is happening everyday? Are you just asking me these questions because you are avoiding the topic and you are just trying to find something to nit-pick about that has nothing to do with the topic? It's really not hard to use google.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 156 by Stile, posted 12-21-2018 11:54 AM Stile has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 211 by Stile, posted 12-30-2018 11:17 AM riVeRraT has not replied

  
riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 436 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 201 of 444 (845917)
12-22-2018 3:32 PM
Reply to: Message 188 by Percy
12-21-2018 5:06 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
Well put.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1465 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 202 of 444 (846094)
12-28-2018 1:42 PM
Reply to: Message 187 by AZPaul3
12-21-2018 3:39 PM


Re: No one?
We hear often how right-wing demagogues are so hounded on a school campus that they cannot give their talk and are thus denied their "right to free speech".
I submit that this IS the right of free speech in action. Free from government interference but with the full force of social opposition in all its glaring glory. You have a right to speak without being thrown in jail. You have no right to speak free from social backlash and opposition, even disruptive opposition
I see. So one has freedom of speech even if Antifa is beating your audience to a pulp and spraying mace in their faces, to the point that the speaker has to be hurried out the back door and never gets to speak at all. That's freedom of speech according to the Left I guess.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 187 by AZPaul3, posted 12-21-2018 3:39 PM AZPaul3 has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 208 by Dr Adequate, posted 12-29-2018 8:29 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1465 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 203 of 444 (846095)
12-28-2018 1:46 PM
Reply to: Message 196 by AZPaul3
12-21-2018 7:45 PM


Re: No one?
One of the big experiments in this country is to make the freedom of speech, and the demonstrations of opposition to what is said, absolute. Well, as absolute as we can without allowing them to incite immediate violent action.
Antifa's method IS violent action. They beat people up.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 196 by AZPaul3, posted 12-21-2018 7:45 PM AZPaul3 has seen this message but not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1465 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 204 of 444 (846096)
12-28-2018 1:58 PM
Reply to: Message 189 by GDR
12-21-2018 6:16 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
Again, anyone can become a terrorist.
You are ignoring my one simple point: The written documents of Islam directly address the reader with commands to murder infidels. That does not exist in the Bible or in any other religion that I know of. Some total ignoramus who thinks he's to obey commands addressed to the Israelites 3500 years ago is a ridiculous comparison. And besides, how many Christians do you know who have taken such a command from the Bible and shot up a crowd or drove into a crowd or did a suicide bombing as if commanded to do so?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 189 by GDR, posted 12-21-2018 6:16 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 205 by vimesey, posted 12-28-2018 2:32 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 206 by GDR, posted 12-28-2018 5:05 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 207 by Dr Adequate, posted 12-29-2018 8:24 PM Faith has replied

  
vimesey
Member (Idle past 93 days)
Posts: 1398
From: Birmingham, England
Joined: 09-21-2011


(7)
Message 205 of 444 (846098)
12-28-2018 2:32 PM
Reply to: Message 204 by Faith
12-28-2018 1:58 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
I readily accept that Islam has a serious problem with radical extremists - that minority are vicious murdering bastards who deserve all the justice and resistance that civilised people can bring to the table.
But to tar every Muslim with their brush is completely wrong. There are 1.8 billion followers of Islam who yesterday didn’t kill anyone. They didn’t the day before that, or before that, or as far back in our lifetimes as you care to go. I work with many Muslims - in the run up to Christmas, they made samosas for Christmas charities, which were delicious - and not even slightly poisoned. The vast majority of their scholars reject the interpretation you impose on those Quranic verses - using in many cases the same semantic gymnastics which you use to justify a living God ordering the massacre of children. You’re demonising 1.8 billion peace-loving, normal, live-a-day human beings as a result of the arguments of a vanishingly small minority of blood thirsty psychopaths. Something Jesus didn’t do, unless you can find me an instance where he instructed his followers to hate a whole load of people, based on the actions of a tiny percentage.

Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 204 by Faith, posted 12-28-2018 1:58 PM Faith has not replied

  
GDR
Member
Posts: 6202
From: Sidney, BC, Canada
Joined: 05-22-2005
Member Rating: 2.1


(1)
Message 206 of 444 (846099)
12-28-2018 5:05 PM
Reply to: Message 204 by Faith
12-28-2018 1:58 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
Faith writes:
You are ignoring my one simple point: The written documents of Islam directly address the reader with commands to murder infidels. That does not exist in the Bible or in any other religion that I know of.
Did God command genocide or not?
Faith writes:
Some total ignoramus who thinks he's to obey commands addressed to the Israelites 3500 years ago is a ridiculous comparison.
And besides, how many Christians do you know who have taken such a command from the Bible and shot up a crowd or drove into a crowd or did a suicide bombing as if commanded to do so?
There are those who have attacked abortion centres. (You don't have to agree with abortion to see that as wrong.) Also, just maybe the west should be a lot more reticent about dropping bombs on foreign nations. It isn't the only way to resolve issues. I can't see where the average Iraqi is better off now than they were under Hussein. It is really just another group of thugs that have taken Hussein's place and in the meantime the west is responsible for the maiming and death of thousands of innocent Iraqis. That might have something to do with the west being seen as the enemy.

He has told you, O man, what is good ; And what does the LORD require of you But to do justice, to love kindness, And to walk humbly with your God.
Micah 6:8

This message is a reply to:
 Message 204 by Faith, posted 12-28-2018 1:58 PM Faith has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 305 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(6)
Message 207 of 444 (846128)
12-29-2018 8:24 PM
Reply to: Message 204 by Faith
12-28-2018 1:58 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
You are ignoring my one simple point: The written documents of Islam directly address the reader with commands to murder infidels. That does not exist in the Bible or in any other religion that I know of.
If you hear it said about one of the towns the Lord your God is giving you to live in that troublemakers have arisen among you and have led the people of their town astray, saying, Let us go and worship other gods (gods you have not known), then you must inquire, probe and investigate it thoroughly. And if it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done among you, you must certainly put to the sword all who live in that town. You must destroy it completely, both its people and its livestock.
Deuteronomy 12:13-15, Faith. And unlike the bits of the Qur'an that give you conniptions, that's not taken out of context.
And besides, how many Christians do you know who have taken such a command from the Bible and shot up a crowd or drove into a crowd or did a suicide bombing as if commanded to do so?
Historically, lots of Christians have killed for Christianity. If fewer do so now it's because people don't believe so much any more --- no-one cares about usury any more, or thinks of giving all their money to the poor, or worries about voting for a man who has based his life on the Seven Deadly Sins rather than the Ten Commandments. The very good and the very bad of Christianity have alike drained out of society, leaving only a gritty residue of scientific ignorance, spiritual pride, and homophobia.
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 204 by Faith, posted 12-28-2018 1:58 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 214 by Faith, posted 01-08-2019 11:32 AM Dr Adequate has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 305 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(2)
Message 208 of 444 (846129)
12-29-2018 8:29 PM
Reply to: Message 202 by Faith
12-28-2018 1:42 PM


Re: No one?
I see. So one has freedom of speech even if Antifa is beating your audience to a pulp and spraying mace in their faces, to the point that the speaker has to be hurried out the back door and never gets to speak at all. That's freedom of speech according to the Left I guess.
That's illegal according to the Left.
You should guess less often.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 202 by Faith, posted 12-28-2018 1:42 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 213 by Faith, posted 01-08-2019 11:03 AM Dr Adequate has not replied

  
Stile
Member
Posts: 4295
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004


Message 209 of 444 (846141)
12-30-2018 11:03 AM
Reply to: Message 193 by riVeRraT
12-21-2018 6:40 PM


Re: No one?
riVeRraT writes:
It's becoming more and more of a conversation. This is NBC...
Converstations are good, aren't they?
You're not trying to prevent conversations as a way to "protect free speech," are you?
Again, it seems like you may be getting offended a bit too easily.
Let me know when we get the point of attempting to implement legislation... which was the silly claim I was talking about.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 193 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 6:40 PM riVeRraT has not replied

  
Stile
Member
Posts: 4295
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004


Message 210 of 444 (846142)
12-30-2018 11:08 AM
Reply to: Message 194 by riVeRraT
12-21-2018 6:46 PM


Re: No one?
riVeRraT writes:
Stile writes:
Is this claim about PC-legislation on the same level of flat-earther attempts?
Or is it something more serious?
We can't further this discussion unless riVeRraT provides something more than his claims.
It's 150 posts in and he's provided nothing so far. Is this because he has nothing? Or is this just because he's busy or hadn't had time yet, or doesn't understand that others can't read his mind and need him to explain himself instead of expecting everyone to agree with his "so obvious facts?"
...
I guess Antifa smashing heads in the street over "hate speech" or "white supremacists marches" don't qualify as meat? When was the last time we even saw a white supremacists march? Wtf?
150 posts and I have nothing? You have your head in the sand bro?
Yes, nothing.
Antifa smashing heads over "hate speech" is something despised by everyone.
There is no legislation being introduced in order to allow Antifa to smash heads.
This is not meat in defense of any claim about PC-legislation being anything more than on the level of flat-earther attempts.
200 posts now, and still nothing.
Do you actually have anything to back up this claim about PC-legislation? Or do you just have nothing?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 194 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 6:46 PM riVeRraT has not replied

  
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