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Author Topic:   Is a Literal Interpretation of the Bible Even Possible?
Dave B
Junior Member (Idle past 3517 days)
Posts: 12
Joined: 05-13-2011


Message 1 of 40 (615999)
05-13-2011 10:06 AM


There are actually two parts to this question:
1. How can a text which contains obvious contradictions be taken literally? This appears to create a logical dilemma which cannot be solved with a literal interpretation.
2. How can one resolve these logical contradictions while maintaining a literal interpretation?
Some examples of contradictions within the Bible include (but are not limited to):
The stories of Genesis 1 and Genesis 2. Namely, the in order in which creation occured.
Jim Meritt Bible Contradictions » Internet Infidels
The number of animals taken on the Ark by Noah in Genesis 7:2 and 7:8 / 7.9.
Jim Meritt Bible Contradictions » Internet Infidels
The last words spoken by Jesus as told by Matthew, Luke and John.
Jim Meritt Bible Contradictions » Internet Infidels
Edited by Dave B, : Added examples of Biblical contradictions.

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Adminnemooseus, posted 05-15-2011 12:26 AM Dave B has replied
 Message 6 by arachnophilia, posted 05-18-2011 9:24 PM Dave B has replied
 Message 7 by jar, posted 05-18-2011 9:40 PM Dave B has replied
 Message 20 by purpledawn, posted 05-20-2011 5:14 AM Dave B has not replied

  
Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 2 of 40 (616000)
05-15-2011 12:26 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Dave B
05-13-2011 10:06 AM


Needs more content
...which contains obvious contradictions...
Example(s), please.
Please add by edit to message 1, then post a "changes done" type reply to this message.
Adminnemooseus

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Dave B, posted 05-13-2011 10:06 AM Dave B has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by Dave B, posted 05-18-2011 8:18 PM Adminnemooseus has replied

  
Dave B
Junior Member (Idle past 3517 days)
Posts: 12
Joined: 05-13-2011


Message 3 of 40 (616001)
05-18-2011 8:18 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Adminnemooseus
05-15-2011 12:26 AM


Re: Needs more content
Added examples of Biblical contradictions to proposed topic including references to specific passages.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Adminnemooseus, posted 05-15-2011 12:26 AM Adminnemooseus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by Adminnemooseus, posted 05-18-2011 8:51 PM Dave B has not replied

  
Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 4 of 40 (616002)
05-18-2011 8:51 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by Dave B
05-18-2011 8:18 PM


Promoted with reservations
Your added materials are essentially bare links, which is a forum rule violation - Still, I'm going to promote it. We shall see what happens.
This is going to the "Bible Study" forum. It should be a study of supposed contradictions/conflicts within the Bible, NOT conflicts between the Bible and worldly reality.
Let the disaster ensue.
Adminnemooseus

Please be familiar with the various topics and other links in the "Essential Links", found in the top of the page menu. Amongst other things, this is where to find where to report various forum problems.

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 Message 3 by Dave B, posted 05-18-2011 8:18 PM Dave B has not replied

  
Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 5 of 40 (616004)
05-18-2011 8:52 PM


Thread Copied from Proposed New Topics Forum
Thread copied here from the Is a Literal Interpretation of the Bible Even Possible? thread in the Proposed New Topics forum.

  
arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1344 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 6 of 40 (616007)
05-18-2011 9:24 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Dave B
05-13-2011 10:06 AM


easy.
Dave B writes:
1. How can a text which contains obvious contradictions be taken literally? This appears to create a logical dilemma which cannot be solved with a literal interpretation.
you are conflating "literal" with "accurate". these words do not mean the same thing. while it is impossible for two contradictory statements both to be accurate, it is not impossible for both of those statements to be meant literally. one is (or both are) simply wrong.
2. How can one resolve these logical contradictions while maintaining a literal interpretation?
that the text literally conflicts.

אָרַח

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Dave B, posted 05-13-2011 10:06 AM Dave B has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by Dave B, posted 05-18-2011 10:07 PM arachnophilia has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 7 of 40 (616010)
05-18-2011 9:40 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Dave B
05-13-2011 10:06 AM


No problems.
Of course you can read the Bible literally. The only real issues are thinking that it is actually one book and so different stories need to be consistent and thinking that it can't simply be wrong.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Dave B, posted 05-13-2011 10:06 AM Dave B has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Dave B, posted 05-18-2011 10:23 PM jar has replied

  
Dave B
Junior Member (Idle past 3517 days)
Posts: 12
Joined: 05-13-2011


Message 8 of 40 (616014)
05-18-2011 10:07 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by arachnophilia
05-18-2011 9:24 PM


Re: easy.
arachnophilia writes:
Dave B writes:
1. How can a text which contains obvious contradictions be taken literally? This appears to create a logical dilemma which cannot be solved with a literal interpretation.
you are conflating "literal" with "accurate". these words do not mean the same thing. while it is impossible for two contradictory statements both to be accurate, it is not impossible for both of those statements to be meant literally. one is (or both are) simply wrong.
2. How can one resolve these logical contradictions while maintaining a literal interpretation?
that the text literally conflicts.
Agreed. It is not impossible for both to be meant literally. However, it is impossible for both to be taken literally. And that was my question.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by arachnophilia, posted 05-18-2011 9:24 PM arachnophilia has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by arachnophilia, posted 05-18-2011 10:12 PM Dave B has replied

  
arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1344 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 9 of 40 (616015)
05-18-2011 10:12 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by Dave B
05-18-2011 10:07 PM


Re: easy.
Dave B writes:
Agreed. It is not impossible for both to be meant literally. However, it is impossible for both to be taken literally. And that was my question.
no, you're still confusing "literal" with "accurate". i can take something literally without also thinking it's accurate.
for example, i do not think your post (which i am quoting) is accurate. however, i do not think it is therefor metaphorical, or in some way non-literal. i take your post literally, i just think it's in error.

אָרַח

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Dave B, posted 05-18-2011 10:07 PM Dave B has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by Dave B, posted 05-18-2011 10:40 PM arachnophilia has replied

  
Dave B
Junior Member (Idle past 3517 days)
Posts: 12
Joined: 05-13-2011


Message 10 of 40 (616016)
05-18-2011 10:23 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by jar
05-18-2011 9:40 PM


Re: No problems.
jar writes:
Of course you can read the Bible literally. The only real issues are thinking that it is actually one book and so different stories need to be consistent and thinking that it can't simply be wrong.
Exactly. If you want to take the Bible literally you need to explain away the stories that conflict with your literal interpretation. It is not possible for two contradictory stories, taken literally, to both be correct.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by jar, posted 05-18-2011 9:40 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by jar, posted 05-18-2011 10:32 PM Dave B has replied
 Message 12 by arachnophilia, posted 05-18-2011 10:34 PM Dave B has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 11 of 40 (616018)
05-18-2011 10:32 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Dave B
05-18-2011 10:23 PM


Re: No problems.
Dave B writes:
jar writes:
Of course you can read the Bible literally. The only real issues are thinking that it is actually one book and so different stories need to be consistent and thinking that it can't simply be wrong.
Exactly. If you want to take the Bible literally you need to explain away the stories that conflict with your literal interpretation. It is not possible for two contradictory stories, taken literally, to both be correct.
But the Bible is not one book. And it is certainly possible for two conflicting statements to be literally true within two different stories.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by Dave B, posted 05-18-2011 10:23 PM Dave B has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by Dave B, posted 05-18-2011 10:57 PM jar has replied

  
arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1344 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 12 of 40 (616019)
05-18-2011 10:34 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Dave B
05-18-2011 10:23 PM


Re: No problems.
Dave B writes:
Exactly. If you want to take the Bible literally you need to explain away the stories that conflict with your literal interpretation.
no i don't. the fact that stories contradict does not mean that i cannot read or interpret them literally. i just can't think they are all literally correct.
It is not possible for two contradictory stories, taken literally, to both be correct.
sure. but that wasn't the question was it?

אָרַח

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by Dave B, posted 05-18-2011 10:23 PM Dave B has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by Dave B, posted 05-18-2011 11:07 PM arachnophilia has replied

  
Dave B
Junior Member (Idle past 3517 days)
Posts: 12
Joined: 05-13-2011


Message 13 of 40 (616021)
05-18-2011 10:40 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by arachnophilia
05-18-2011 10:12 PM


Re: easy.
arachnophilia writes:
Dave B writes:
Agreed. It is not impossible for both to be meant literally. However, it is impossible for both to be taken literally. And that was my question.
no, you're still confusing "literal" with "accurate". i can take something literally without also thinking it's accurate.
for example, i do not think your post (which i am quoting) is accurate. however, i do not think it is therefor metaphorical, or in some way non-literal. i take your post literally, i just think it's in error.
I completely understand the semantics. But you cannot take two contradictory statements regarding the same truth, literally, without confronting some sort of logical dilemma. One of the two statements has to be incorrect (not accurate).
Let's assume we do not take the Bible literally, and instead we take it allegorically; both statements could be correct. Would you agree with this?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by arachnophilia, posted 05-18-2011 10:12 PM arachnophilia has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 17 by arachnophilia, posted 05-19-2011 6:33 PM Dave B has not replied

  
Dave B
Junior Member (Idle past 3517 days)
Posts: 12
Joined: 05-13-2011


Message 14 of 40 (616022)
05-18-2011 10:57 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by jar
05-18-2011 10:32 PM


Re: No problems.
jar writes:
Dave B writes:
jar writes:
Of course you can read the Bible literally. The only real issues are thinking that it is actually one book and so different stories need to be consistent and thinking that it can't simply be wrong.
Exactly. If you want to take the Bible literally you need to explain away the stories that conflict with your literal interpretation. It is not possible for two contradictory stories, taken literally, to both be correct.
But the Bible is not one book. And it is certainly possible for two conflicting statements to be literally true within two different stories.
So which of the two stories is accurate? One is to be taken literally and the other would be... what? Incorrect? Allegorical? If both describe the same event they cannot both be correct.
I see you want to argue semantics so let me clarify:
The Bible is considered to be accurate when read literally. When two accounts contradict one another which one do we accept as accurate?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by jar, posted 05-18-2011 10:32 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 16 by jar, posted 05-19-2011 8:49 AM Dave B has not replied
 Message 19 by arachnophilia, posted 05-19-2011 6:41 PM Dave B has not replied

  
Dave B
Junior Member (Idle past 3517 days)
Posts: 12
Joined: 05-13-2011


Message 15 of 40 (616024)
05-18-2011 11:07 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by arachnophilia
05-18-2011 10:34 PM


Re: No problems.
arachnophilia writes:
Dave B writes:
Exactly. If you want to take the Bible literally you need to explain away the stories that conflict with your literal interpretation.
no i don't. the fact that stories contradict does not mean that i cannot read or interpret them literally. i just can't think they are all literally correct.
It is not possible for two contradictory stories, taken literally, to both be correct.
sure. but that wasn't the question was it?
I apologize for not making it clear that those who interpret the Bible literally also believe it to be accurate. I assumed that that was implied in my asking of the question.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by arachnophilia, posted 05-18-2011 10:34 PM arachnophilia has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by arachnophilia, posted 05-19-2011 6:35 PM Dave B has replied

  
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