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Author Topic:   Website Outage
Admin
Director
Posts: 12391
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 1 of 12 (700332)
06-02-2013 6:06 AM


The recent website outage occurred because our webhosting company disconnected our server from the Internet. Their explanation was not supported by any data and I am seeking more information.

I apologize for the inconvenience.


--Percy
EvC Forum Director

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Admin, posted 06-02-2013 12:58 PM Admin has acknowledged this reply
 Message 5 by nwr, posted 06-02-2013 4:09 PM Admin has acknowledged this reply
 Message 7 by Dr Adequate, posted 06-04-2013 2:08 PM Admin has acknowledged this reply
 Message 11 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-04-2013 4:17 PM Admin has responded

    
Admin
Director
Posts: 12391
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 2 of 12 (700348)
06-02-2013 12:58 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Admin
06-02-2013 6:06 AM


Information from Webhosting Company
Here's the response to my inquiry for more information:

Webhosting Company writes:

Yes, your server was the target of a DDOS. You are correct in saying that there is very little that can be done for a DDOS. It is uncommon for us to have a DDOS, maybe 3 times a year some server or another falls victim within our company. Generally, the DDOS is a result of someone getting angry enough about some content on a site and they want it shut down for a laugh.

A DDOS (Distributed Denial of Service Attack) requires network expertise and resources. Whoever did this was not only angry but skilled and well resourced. Maybe some of our members with expertise in this area can comment. Members can't respond to threads in this forum (The Public Record forum), so I'll move this thread over to the Announcements forum.


--Percy
EvC Forum Director

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Admin, posted 06-02-2013 6:06 AM Admin has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by Panda, posted 06-02-2013 1:24 PM Admin has acknowledged this reply

    
Admin
Director
Posts: 12391
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 3 of 12 (700349)
06-02-2013 12:59 PM


Thread Moved from The Public Record Forum
Thread moved here from the The Public Record forum.
    
Panda
Member (Idle past 1065 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


(1)
Message 4 of 12 (700351)
06-02-2013 1:24 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Admin
06-02-2013 12:58 PM


Re: Information from Webhosting Company
Admin writes:

A DDOS (Distributed Denial of Service Attack) requires network expertise and resources. Whoever did this was not only angry but skilled and well resourced.


Although you are correct that it requires resources - it doesn't actually require their own resources.
Supposedly there is a black market for buying lists of compromised PCs.
Someone could have bought up a list and used those 'stolen' resources to DDoS this site - perhaps.

Or maybe...
DDoS is often a blanket term for a wide variety of attacks (people use that term instead of DoS) - and not all these require large amounts of resources.
(This moves out of my area of expertise but...) some attacks use system settings and server errors to use up the victim server's resources.
I don't think those kinds of attacks require more than just expertise.

Edited by Panda, : No reason given.


"There is no great invention, from fire to flying, which has not been hailed as an insult to some god." J. B. S. Haldane

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 Message 2 by Admin, posted 06-02-2013 12:58 PM Admin has acknowledged this reply

  
nwr
Member
Posts: 5504
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.9


Message 5 of 12 (700376)
06-02-2013 4:09 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Admin
06-02-2013 6:06 AM


I apologize for the inconvenience.

A minor inconvenience. But I was wondering what happened so thanks for the explanation.

I agree with Panda's comment. There are huge botnets built out of trojanized machines, and they can probably be leased for a modest fee. So it mostly takes determination, rather than expertise, to mount a DDOS attack.

I mostly see this as someone who investigates phishing (in an amateurish way). That's another use of botnets.


Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Admin, posted 06-02-2013 6:06 AM Admin has acknowledged this reply

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 12820
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 6 of 12 (700564)
06-04-2013 1:57 PM


On the bright side, having enemies may be an indication that we ain't dead yet.
  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 15482
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 7 of 12 (700565)
06-04-2013 2:08 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Admin
06-02-2013 6:06 AM


Why was this post not visible during the actual outage?

You're getting slack, that's what it is.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Admin, posted 06-02-2013 6:06 AM Admin has acknowledged this reply

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 4409
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 8 of 12 (700568)
06-04-2013 2:25 PM


I was lonely, very lonely......

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

  
1.61803
Member
Posts: 2664
From: Lone Star State USA
Joined: 02-19-2004
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 9 of 12 (700572)
06-04-2013 3:41 PM


I was out for a few days. How long was the site down for?

Just curious. I'd freak if EvC disappeared.


"You were not there for the beginning. You will not be there for the end. Your knowledge of what is going on can only be superficial and relative" William S. Burroughs

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-04-2013 4:11 PM 1.61803 has acknowledged this reply

  
New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11183
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 10 of 12 (700574)
06-04-2013 4:11 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by 1.61803
06-04-2013 3:41 PM


I was out for a few days. How long was the site down for?

I think it was just one day, all day Saturday the 1st.

I'll have you know, I only checked to see if it was up, like, 10 times.

Just curious. I'd freak if EvC disappeared.

I don't freak, but I'd be pretty disappointed.

And not just because of the potential discussions that I'd loose, but also because of the loss of the records of all the posts I've written over the last... awe geez... 8.5 years.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by 1.61803, posted 06-04-2013 3:41 PM 1.61803 has acknowledged this reply

  
New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11183
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 11 of 12 (700575)
06-04-2013 4:17 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Admin
06-02-2013 6:06 AM


I apologize for the inconvenience.

Its no biggie.

But I do appreciate the explanation, so thanks.

I was just mentioning to Phi that losing the record of my posts would disappoint me as much if not more than losing future discussions.

I know you originally invented this software to sell at some point, and I've seen you admit that you've kinda missed the mark with the transition to tablets n'stuff.

Have you ever considered the value that some of us might place on the posts we've written here?

I don't blog or anything, but I can imagine myself in the future wishing that I could read over some of my old EvC posts, or share them with my family or something.

What kind of format are they stored in? How big are the files? Is it possible for you to mail me a flash drive with all my posts on it, or something like that? I'd be willing to pay for it.

What if it was a copy of each entire thread that I've ever participated in? Would that get too big?

Would I need special software to read the data?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Admin, posted 06-02-2013 6:06 AM Admin has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Admin, posted 06-05-2013 9:32 AM New Cat's Eye has not yet responded

  
Admin
Director
Posts: 12391
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 12 of 12 (700633)
06-05-2013 9:32 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by New Cat's Eye
06-04-2013 4:17 PM


Hi CS,

I'm a bit short of time right now, so let me just briefly provide a couple answers.

I value the post history as much as anyone. The database is backed up periodically.

Posts are stored in the database in HTML format. The current size of the database is about 2 GB, most of it messages. It wouldn't be too difficult to add a feature that throws the HTML for an entire thread into a file instead of a page at a time out to a browser, but I have no plans to do that at this time.

The thread index you get when you click on your name will tell you how many threads you've participated in, but it wouldn't give you an estimate of the size. Obviously it wouldn't be too big, since the total of all messages is around 2 GB. If your threads represented 1% of the total then that would be around 20 MB, a very modest size by today's standards.


--Percy
EvC Forum Director

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-04-2013 4:17 PM New Cat's Eye has not yet responded

    
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