|
Register | Sign In |
|
QuickSearch
EvC Forum active members: 63 (9162 total) |
| |
popoi | |
Total: 916,387 Year: 3,644/9,624 Month: 515/974 Week: 128/276 Day: 2/23 Hour: 0/1 |
Thread ▼ Details |
Member (Idle past 1425 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
|
Thread Info
|
|
|
Author | Topic: are "stand your ground" laws license to kill? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
RAZD Member (Idle past 1425 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
One of the jurors in the trial on the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin by George Zimmerman said she thinks Zimmerman got away with murder.
Now we have another case ... Michael Dunn Jury Goes Second Day of Deliberations Without Verdict - ABC News
quote: It's like he claims after the fact that it was self defense and made up a lot of his own testimony -- testimony that is contradicted by his fiance, the other boys in the car, and his behavior after the shooting. Will the "stand your ground" law allow him to get away with murder?by our ability to understand Rebel American Zen Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Admin Director Posts: 13014 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 1.9 |
Thread moved here from the Proposed New Topics forum.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
RAZD Member (Idle past 1425 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Thanks to ALEC these laws have spread like a fungus to several states now, and they are a move in the wrong direction.
by our ability to understand Rebel American Zen Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Theodoric Member Posts: 9140 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.3 |
Yes. They are a license to kill anyone that makes you feel uncomfortable.
Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Coragyps Member (Idle past 755 days) Posts: 5553 From: Snyder, Texas, USA Joined: |
Yup. Especially melanin-rich people. That's what those laws are written for.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
RAZD Member (Idle past 1425 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
'Stand Your Ground' Linked To Increase In Homicides : NPR
quote: Another study I saw showed a 3x increase in gun deaths since passing these absurd laws. It goes from ridiculous to absurd: both Zimmerman and Dunn instigated the confrontations before claiming they had to defend themselves, but now ...
South Carolina quote: Really??? At least their supreme court is stepping in ... sort of ...
quote: But there is hope ...
New Hampshire quote: If nothing else these laws should not apply to people that instigate confrontations. Really.by our ability to understand Rebel American Zen Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Theodoric Member Posts: 9140 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.3 |
Not sure why you bothered because it seems that you will be accused of posting unsupported assertions.
Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Taq Member Posts: 10033 Joined: Member Rating: 5.3
|
The part that bothers me the most about these laws is that it gives stupid people a false sense of justification for firing off their guns in the general direction of people. Unfortunately, there is no test for stupid that people have to pass when they purchase a firearm. I happen to think that we should have laws that discourage people from doing stupid things with firearms, not encourage them.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
Going from memory:
quote:
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
The part that bothers me the most about these laws is that it gives stupid people a false sense of justification for firing off their guns in the general direction of people. I agree that we should minimize that. It can be accomplished through education, like concealed-carry classes.
Unfortunately, there is no test for stupid that people have to pass when they purchase a firearm. But that goes for almost any dangerous and deadly item. We encourage liberty, until you're shown to be unable to handle it. We shouldn't restrict the rights of everyone, because some can't handle it.
I happen to think that we should have laws that discourage people from doing stupid things with firearms, not encourage them. Why don't we just have laws for discouraging people from doing bad things in general. Oh wait, we do. Some just don't follow them. Let's not punish the law-abiders though, okay? Edited by Catholic Scientist, : No reason given.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
Another study I saw showed a 3x increase in gun deaths since passing these absurd laws. I would expect that criminals who are assaulting people would be shot to death more in states that allow their law-abiding citizens to protect themselves. But that's not a bad thing. Did that study distinguish that?
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Taq Member Posts: 10033 Joined: Member Rating: 5.3
|
I agree that we should minimize that. It can be accomplished through education, like concealed-carry classes. Unless those are required before purchasing a gun (as well as regular refresher courses), I really don't see how this helps.
But that goes for almost any dangerous and deadly item. We encourage liberty, until you're shown to be unable to handle it. We shouldn't restrict the rights of everyone, because some can't handle it. We already restrict rights because of that very thing. We don't allow everyone to buy automatic weapons, or large explosives. The right to carry a firearm for the purpose of protection was never considered an unlimited right. There is also the right of moving about in public without being shot. That one needs to be protected as well.
Why don't we just have laws for discouraging people from doing bad things in general. Oh wait, we do. Some just don't follow them. Let's not punish the law-abiders though, okay? If we get rid of the "stand your ground" laws, how does that punish law-abiders?
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 305 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
|
Michael Dunn's neighbor had this to say:
Did I ever hear him say he wanted to shoot somebody? Not directly. b I'm the type of person that that's the last thing that I would be contemplating. I don't want to have a confrontation with anybody when I have a gun, anybody that does is predisposed, in my opinion, to kill somebody. If you're looking for confrontations just because you have a gun? There's no question in my mind that people that are looking for confrontations when they have a gun, Someday, they're going to find it. When I heard about this situation with Michael Dunn I was like "There you go, I KNEW it. Sooner or later he was gonna kill somebody." And there do seem to be people who spend their whole lives waiting for that one glorious day when they'll be legally justified in shooting someone.
Like this guy. At last, he's got him a couple of trespassers! He's not going to risk warning them off his property, or calling the police, or firing a warning shot, or letting them see him brandish his gun. If he did that, they might survive. Instead he picks them off sniper-style. Turns out they weren't actually on his property, but apart from that it was the perfect non-crime. A similar blunder was made by Gayle Muhs. This charming gun-nut had a sign outside his house reading "Trespassers will be shot. Survivers will be reshot!! Smile I will." So when he thought it was legal for him to open fire on a party of two adults and two children, well, in this sad world we live in no-one should miss out on a chance to smile. "Laugh and the world laughs with you", as the poet wrote, "weep and you weep alone". Now if only the "trespassers" had actually been anywhere near his property, that would have been sweet, because how often do you get to kill a seven-year old boy by shooting him in the head?
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
DevilsAdvocate Member (Idle past 3121 days) Posts: 1548 Joined: |
Like this guy. At last, he's got him a couple of trespassers! He's not going to risk warning them off his property, or calling the police, or firing a warning shot, or letting them see him brandish his gun. If he did that, they might survive. Instead he picks them off sniper-style. The two men he shot, who brothers, were on their own property which they had just bought and were looking at there shed. The two men shot were black and the man that shot them were white. I am pretty sure that race was a factor. Sad,
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
saab93f Member (Idle past 1415 days) Posts: 265 From: Finland Joined:
|
A similar blunder was made by Gayle Muhs. This charming gun-nut had a sign outside his house reading "Trespassers will be shot. Survivers will be reshot!! Smile I will." So when he thought it was legal for him to open fire on a party of two adults and two children, well, in this sad world we live in no-one should miss out on a chance to smile. "Laugh and the world laughs with you", as the poet wrote, "weep and you weep alone". Now if only the "trespassers" had actually been anywhere near his property, that would have been sweet, because how often do you get to kill a seven-year old boy by shooting him in the head? Stories like these make me wanna throw up. Why oh why are you Americans so hung on the 2nd amendment that you cannot see the hurt it causes. Stand your ground laws are just atrocious - I cannot comprehend how any semi-reasonable human being would support them. If you are in a dire need, you do what you have to but these laws lower the threshold to use deadly force basically nonexistent. Edited by saab93f, : Typo
|
|
|
Do Nothing Button
Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved
Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024