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Author Topic:   Debate v2: Ken Hamm vs Pat Robertson?
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1426 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 1 of 15 (727288)
05-17-2014 8:17 AM


quote:
But I think he should take Answers in Genesis and noted Ark enthusiast Ken Ham up on this offer:
I wonder if Pat Robertson would be prepared to discuss these issues with me or one of our AiG scientists [sic] on the 700 Club? Or maybe in some sort of debate format at Regent University? We are certainly willing to do thatmaybe all of you reading this could challenge CBN/Regent University to allow such a discussion, debate, or forum to occur publicly. I wonder if Pat Robertson, who is allowed to state these things so publicly through CBN will agree to have his statements publicly challenged and tested!
"I came across that challenge thanks to Right Wing Watch (where they watch Pat Robertson’s show so you don’t have to). Apparently Pat Robertson has been repeatedly taking swipes at young-earth creationism, calling it a joke, and insisting that you’d have to be deaf, dumb, and blind to think that this Earth that we live in only has 6,000 years of existence, ...
It’d also benefit the broader American Christian culture. For whatever reason, the media and the political sphere often treat American evangelicals as the default form of Christianity in the US, with Catholics treated as something vaguely other and mainline Protestant churches (the largest bloc of believers in the US) completely ignored. That means that Catholics and mainline Protestants wind up taking theological cues from evangelicals (however inadvertently), hence (in part) the spread of creationist ideas since the ’20s and anti-abortion politics since the ’70s. Seeing two evangelicals staking out a range of views on whether people of faith should automatically reject any science that might seem at odds with their religious faith could only help members of less conservative churches think more deeply about their views on science and religion.
Would Pat beat Hamm?
Will he do the debate?
Edited by RAZD, : img

we are limited in our ability to understand
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Replies to this message:
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NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 2 of 15 (727289)
05-17-2014 8:33 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by RAZD
05-17-2014 8:17 AM


What's in it for Pat Robertson and the 700 club? Why on earth would Pat even take note of Ken Ham?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by RAZD, posted 05-17-2014 8:17 AM RAZD has replied

Replies to this message:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1426 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 3 of 15 (727290)
05-17-2014 8:40 AM
Reply to: Message 2 by NoNukes
05-17-2014 8:33 AM


Well according to the article
quote:
It’d benefit evangelical Christians by reminding them that even within their theological community, there are a range of responses to science, and they don’t have to set themselves at odds with science just because some of their fellow evangelicals interpret the Bible as saying something at odds with what science textbooks say. That is why Ham is so scared of Robertson’s repeated criticisms (and why Robertson seems to find Ham worthy of a response). Robertson may be the most visible American evangelical leader since the retirement of Billy Graham ... And Robertson sees Ham leading a large chunk of his flock toward absurd beliefs, and wants to hold onto them.
Not that Pat doesn't have some absurd beliefs on his own, but it looks like he thinks Hamm is going down a very wrong road.

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
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Replies to this message:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1426 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 4 of 15 (727292)
05-17-2014 8:50 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by RAZD
05-17-2014 8:40 AM


Here's Pat on YEC beliefs
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

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Replies to this message:
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Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4411
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.4


Message 5 of 15 (727309)
05-17-2014 11:48 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by RAZD
05-17-2014 8:50 AM


Re: Here's Pat on YEC beliefs
Pretty funny.
One ignorant guy talking about other ignorant guys.
Plus a new species Triceratops rex Robertson, 2014.
It probably would be entertaining to watch 2 ignorant, stupid, crazy guys debate about science that neither has a clue about.

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1426 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 6 of 15 (727319)
05-17-2014 12:06 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Tanypteryx
05-17-2014 11:48 AM


Re: Here's Pat on YEC beliefs
Get out the popcorn
and drinking rules ...
keywords: usher, scripture, infallible, silly, ...

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


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NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 7 of 15 (727527)
05-18-2014 10:00 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by RAZD
05-17-2014 8:40 AM


That is why Ham is so scared of Robertson’s repeated criticisms (and why Robertson seems to find Ham worthy of a response).
I don't think a debate with Ham would help advance Pat's cause as much as does the sniping Pat is already doing. Ham has next to no forum for sniping back in anything like an effective manner. Why in the world should Pat give Ham any kind of credibility?
Not that Pat doesn't have some absurd beliefs on his own, but it looks like he thinks Hamm is going down a very wrong road.
Pat is a buffoon, yes.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 305 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(5)
Message 8 of 15 (727539)
05-19-2014 1:22 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by RAZD
05-17-2014 8:17 AM


It'll be like the Special Olympics, but without feeling sympathy for the contestants.

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xongsmith
Member
Posts: 2587
From: massachusetts US
Joined: 01-01-2009
Member Rating: 6.5


(1)
Message 9 of 15 (727628)
05-19-2014 1:00 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by Dr Adequate
05-19-2014 1:22 AM


Dr. A writes:
without feeling sympathy
...or any good common empathy.
I think in the case of Special Olympics, the actual participants don't give a damn about your sympathy. And rightly so.
- nate

- xongsmith, 5.7d

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Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


(2)
Message 10 of 15 (727643)
05-19-2014 2:18 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Tanypteryx
05-17-2014 11:48 AM


Re: Here's Pat on YEC beliefs
It probably would be entertaining to watch 2 ignorant, stupid, crazy guys debate about science that neither has a clue about.
Did the Republican 2016 primary start early??

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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 305 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 11 of 15 (727645)
05-19-2014 2:31 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by xongsmith
05-19-2014 1:00 PM


Schmempathy.

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Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 12 of 15 (727654)
05-19-2014 3:16 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by xongsmith
05-19-2014 1:00 PM


...or any good common empathy.
I think in the case of Special Olympics, the actual participants don't give a damn about your sympathy. And rightly so.
I agree. But the sympathy and empathy aspects can be helpful and supportive for the parents and other family members.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by xongsmith, posted 05-19-2014 1:00 PM xongsmith has replied

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xongsmith
Member
Posts: 2587
From: massachusetts US
Joined: 01-01-2009
Member Rating: 6.5


Message 13 of 15 (727675)
05-19-2014 6:04 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by Theodoric
05-19-2014 3:16 PM


Theo writes
sympathy and empathy aspects
But, see, they are very different - sympathy basically has a sort of holier-than-thou kind of attitude hiding inside it, but empathy has more of the i'm-down-in-here-with-you-on-this kind of aspect.

- xongsmith, 5.7d

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ramoss
Member (Idle past 633 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 08-11-2004


Message 14 of 15 (728030)
05-22-2014 2:10 PM


This seems like it would be like two seagulls , fighting over a piece of french fries.

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(2)
Message 15 of 15 (728258)
05-26-2014 10:57 AM
Reply to: Message 13 by xongsmith
05-19-2014 6:04 PM


sympathy basically has a sort of holier-than-thou kind of attitude hiding inside it,
Must it? I agree that the superiority thing can be there, but can we truly have empathy when the issues involved are completely foreign to what we understand or is sympathy the best we can do?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
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