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Author Topic:   Queen Elizabeth and the U.K.?
shadow71
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Posts: 704
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 1 of 102 (657099)
03-25-2012 7:49 PM


I, as second generation citizen of the USA , a Political Science major and JD, have always wondered why the U.K. supports a monarcy?
What is the rationale for Elizabeth II to be accorded the benefits and acolades she receives from her subjects.?

Are the financial gifts she receives from her subjects worth the cost?
Does she have any Queenly Powers?

Any constitutional Powers?

Is she just a symbol of the old forgotten and destroyed Empire?

Would appreciate it if some of her subjects could enlighten me as to the merits of a Monarch for the U.K.

Edited by shadow71, : No reason given.

Edited by shadow71, : No reason given.


Replies to this message:
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Message 2 of 102 (657103)
03-25-2012 8:05 PM


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Theodoric
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Message 3 of 102 (657107)
03-25-2012 9:51 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by shadow71
03-25-2012 7:49 PM


Tradition?
I, as second generation citizen of the USA , a Political Science major and JD, have always wondered why the U.K. supports a monarcy?
What is the rationale for Elizabeth II to be accorded the benefits and acolades she receives from her subjects.?

Maybe Tevye has the answer.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

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NoNukes
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Member Rating: 2.1


Message 4 of 102 (657111)
03-25-2012 11:06 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by shadow71
03-25-2012 7:49 PM


There is a fairly thorough wikipedia article on the subject.

I, as second generation citizen of the USA , a Political Science major and JD

Hmm. The wiki article does not seem to mention any particular reader background/credentials. Sorry about that. I'll look for a more suitable reference.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison


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Dr Adequate
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Message 5 of 102 (657112)
03-25-2012 11:12 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by shadow71
03-25-2012 7:49 PM


Well, 78% of people want a monarchy with 19% against, and any US President with that sort of approval rating would think he'd died and gone to heaven.

The cost to the average person is 62p/year.

Of course, this exorbitant sum falls on people who don't particularly want a monarch, but then we also subsidize opera houses when some (most) people don't want opera, theater for people who don't watch plays, and libraries when some people don't read, so I think that's fair enough.

In short, the monarchy would seem to be justified by the fact that people want one.


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onifre
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From: Dark Side of the Moon
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Message 6 of 102 (657116)
03-26-2012 1:59 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by shadow71
03-25-2012 7:49 PM


Oh, Hellooooo!!!
have always wondered why the U.K. supports a monarcy?

Short answer: Because they can't do shit about it.

Long answer: Because they're all a bunch of twats.

Is she just a symbol of the old forgotten and destroyed Empire?

I think it's viewed as a symbol, and one of arrogance I suspect. Just something to brag about mostly. Lord knows their soccer is shit these days.

- Oni

Edited by onifre, : No reason given.


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Son Goku
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From: Ireland
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Message 7 of 102 (657118)
03-26-2012 4:53 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by shadow71
03-25-2012 7:49 PM


This is what Dr. Adequate said, but I think simply because it is what most of the population actually want. When I was in Britain most people viewed the Queen as a sort nice old lady who doubled as a harmless living symbol of Britain, basically most people are fond of the monarchy.

Is she just a symbol of the old forgotten and destroyed Empire?

Forgotten?, didn't it end only fifty/sixty years ago.

Edited by Son Goku, : No reason given.

Edited by Son Goku, : No reason given.


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Tangle
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From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 8 of 102 (657120)
03-26-2012 5:43 AM


It's just one of our eccentric little foibles.

I think the reason we currently have a monarchy is because we quite like queenie. She's been with us for at least three generations and now has the status of 'national treasure.'

She doesn't get involved with politics and she's a major tourism asset.

But I'm a republican at heart - I don't like the idea of being a subject rather than a citizen and I hate the servility and genuflection in the antiquated class and grace and favour structures that lives behind it all.

I suspect we'll be having a really good look at how much of royalty we wish to keep when she either pops her clogs or hands over the reigns.


Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

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Son Goku
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Posts: 964
From: Ireland
Joined: 07-16-2005


Message 9 of 102 (657121)
03-26-2012 6:01 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by Tangle
03-26-2012 5:43 AM


The next King.
I think there'll be serious questions when Charles takes over. I mean it would be difficult to dislike Elizabeth, but Charles comes across as a bit silly, interventionist. How do people in the UK feel about him?
This message is a reply to:
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Tangle
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Posts: 2233
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 10 of 102 (657126)
03-26-2012 7:18 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by Son Goku
03-26-2012 6:01 AM


Re: The next King.
Son Goku writes:

I think there'll be serious questions when Charles takes over. I mean it would be difficult to dislike Elizabeth, but Charles comes across as a bit silly, interventionist. How do people in the UK feel about him?

I think most people regard him as a crank and really wouldn't want him on the throne. It will throw everything into the air if he looks as though he's going to succeed.

(btw, when I say I'm a republican - I don't mean in the American sense )


Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

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Straggler
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Posts: 9922
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006
Member Rating: 3.6


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Message 11 of 102 (657160)
03-26-2012 12:05 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by shadow71
03-25-2012 7:49 PM


God Save Us From The Monarchists....
I, as second generation citizen of the USA , a Political Science major and JD, have always wondered why the U.K. supports a monarcy?

As a UK citizen I have to admit to being a bit baffled by the whole thing too. The whole royal thing in this day and age is....It's all a bit absurd.

What is the rationale for Elizabeth II to be accorded the benefits and acolades she receives from her subjects.?

Tourism is usually cited by monarchy supporters. But it's not like tourists actually get to meet, or usually even see, the queen. Frankly I think touristic interest in British history and tradition is often conflated with interest in the monarchy and thus falsely attributed. Tourists would still go to the Tower of London, watch the changing of the guard at Buckingham palace, visit castles and all that malarkey even if we got rid of the royal family tomorrow.

Indeed - It might even stir up some more interest if we did it in a suitably historical manner..... (fetch the guillotines!!)

Any constitutional Powers?

Nominally I believe the monarch has some sort of executive power over the elected government. But in practise - No. It's a silly figurhead.

Is she just a symbol of the old forgotten and destroyed Empire?

A symbol of lost empire and some sort of throwback to medieeval class structures. Nobility. Birth right. All that sort of nonsense.

Would appreciate it if some of her subjects could enlighten me as to the merits of a Monarch for the U.K.

Personally I would put them all out to pasture.


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Replies to this message:
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shadow71
Member
Posts: 704
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 12 of 102 (657161)
03-26-2012 12:09 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by NoNukes
03-25-2012 11:06 PM


NoNukes writes:


Hmm. The wiki article does not seem to mention any particular reader background/credentials. Sorry about that. I'll look for a more suitable reference.

Sorry I offended you. I was just giving reasons for my interest in this subject, ie. study of goverments and practice of law.
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shadow71
Member
Posts: 704
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 13 of 102 (657162)
03-26-2012 12:20 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by Straggler
03-26-2012 12:05 PM


Re: God Save Us From The Monarchists....
Hi Straggler, Your reply basically sums up my feelings on this issue. I was interested in hearing some U.K. perspective.
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ramoss
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Posts: 2788
Joined: 08-11-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 14 of 102 (657163)
03-26-2012 12:25 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Tangle
03-26-2012 7:18 AM


Re: The next King.

(btw, when I say I'm a republican - I don't mean in the American sense )

Does that mean you believe in sense and dignity??


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Panda
Member (Idle past 92 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 15 of 102 (657164)
03-26-2012 12:32 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by Straggler
03-26-2012 12:05 PM


Re: God Save Us From The Monarchists....
Straggler writes:

Personally I would put them all out to pasture.


They provide additional bank holidays!
How dare you undermine an Englishman's right to skive off work!

Tradition and heritage are all dead people's baggage. Stop carrying it!

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