Imprecatory song and prayer

There are psalms in the Old Testament among other sources that show that prayer for the downfall of the enemies of God is a righteous act, though to hear many self-styled Christians talk we must be nicey-nice to everybody, even the Antichrist himself. Well, in a sense that is true. We are to treat even the devil himself with basic respect, at least call him Sir or the equivalent, but at the same time we may say "The Lord rebuke you" and we may say that to humans who offend God to certain extremes too. I believe there is Holy Spirit power in this.This morning a particular song has been running through my head but I can't find the words to it online, and wonder if any of the Christians here know them or can put them up. I know they are in the hymnals at church but for that I'll have to wait until tomorrow night.If anyone knows it would you please put the words up? Thanks. These are all the words I can remember at the moment:Stand up, oh God, be present now
Let all your ........But let the righteous sing and shout...This message has been edited by Faith, 02-14-2006 12:27 PM

But there is a danger down this path of imprecatory prayer. Jesus said to love your enemies and pray for them, and bless rather than curse, and sometimes imprecatory prayers can be used to curse rather than bless. It's complicated though. Jesus wasn't often nice to his enemies, but at the same time, He forgave them on the Cross.I think we should pray for the destruction of the lies and falsehoods binding people, but need to be careful not to curse individual people. I think one can pray God establish good leadership in a nation and overthrow tyranny and injustice, but there's a fine line still...

I know. But I'm not worried. God isn't going to answer a prayer that's wrong. The basic idea is to ask him to save someone but if he isn't going to, then please judge him for the sake of His honor.Loving our enemies is fine, and we should do this in any case -- do good to them, but this doesn't mean we can't ask God to take them out if it pleases him to do so. I'm not suggesting that a person should do anything like this, only asking God to. And I'm not talking about your average sinner, your average enemy of God, which all of us were at one time. I'm talking about someone who is an incorrigible enemy of God and His people. Of course Hitler and Stalin would be good examples, but there are many closer to home. I'm for praying against them: either convert them or judge them, please God.There is stuff that doesn't hurt you or me but is such a vile offense to God, especially stuff said in His name by wolves in sheep's clothing, stuff that lures weakminded Christians off the path, that I can't find fault with this advice. Again, a curse that is not deserved will not stick. That's one of the proverbs. There is no danger here. David cursed the enemies of God, and I see no reason why we shouldn't. So did Paul, so did Jesus. Again, if it isn't deserved it won't come home to roost.P.S. I think the only command this may conflict with is the command to die to self, but this never requires us to tolerate evil teaching that does harm to the church and lures people off the track. The woes Jesus spoke against the Pharisees were essentially curses. Paul spoke curses against former comrades who had turned against him. There is in other words good Biblical precedent for this.This message has been edited by Faith, 02-14-2006 02:25 PM

i found it on google. This sounds like a terrible song though.I can't believe that this church sings it. I always thought we were supposed to pray for our enemies. The only major enemy that we Christians have--apart from satan--is ourselves. Once we conquer our own flesh, lots of great things will happen because of God working through us--but not until then.

It's a very catchy tune. Wish I could find a professional group singing it but all You Tube has is a couple of church congregations doing it. Here's oneIt's based on the first line of Psalm 68, written by a Brit in the early 70s.Most of us don't pray this way, you know, we pray for people to be saved. But there are some who are such implacable enemies of God why not pray that God would remove them so they don't do more harm? As I say in my first post, it's up to Him to answer the prayer or not anyway. He knows who He wants to save, I don't.

"But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you." --- Jesus. Matthew 5:44.

Right, that's the objection. And it is what we usually do. However, knowing that King David prayed against God's enemies does suggest that possibility. I'll have to look up some commentaries and sermons on it.

I did find a very short sermon on the subject that says pretty much what I was thinking myself, though I wasn't sure enough of it to say it:The gist: Imprecatory prayers are not to be prayed against our personal enemies, we are only to pray for them.Praying against God's enemies, on the other hand, as long as we are sure that's what they are, is something else: Here's that short sermonEdited by Faith, : No reason given.

To the sane, I need offer no comment. But what should I say to the mad?

How much time do you spend praying against gay people trying to get married?

So if you haveto respect the devil, if he stops by at your cake shop and wants to buy a cake what do you do?

What's the problem, it's just too odd to think of praying against God's enemies or what?No, Larni, God's enemies aren't ordinary sinners, of course. Sure I pray that God won't let America come under worse judgment and that includes praying against laws supporting gay marriage.But as for God's enemies according to the meaning of imprecatory prayer, that wouldn't be any kind of ordinary sinner or antichristian but more like people who have dedicated themselves to destroying the Church and have the power to do it. Probably not Dawkins, he's just kind of sad. Maybe Bart Ehrman, there's a dedicated Bible-debunker and he's out there telling the world about it. That sort of thing. Oh and the Pope of course.

And as you have shown on another thread, don't forget the fags.

Surely if God has enemies he's already mad at them without you telling him he should be. Also, he would know exactly who they are, and you wouldn't.

Nevertheless there it is in the psalms.