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Author Topic:   Few Questions (Re: God's Miracles - Past and Present)
coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 467 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 31 of 55 (129462)
08-02-2004 12:39 AM
Reply to: Message 30 by Coragyps
08-02-2004 12:26 AM


Re: Why doesn't God do miracles today?
I giggled for about 2 minutes after reading that sentence.

The Laminator
For goodness's sake, please vote Democrat this November!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 30 by Coragyps, posted 08-02-2004 12:26 AM Coragyps has not replied

Yaro
Member (Idle past 6486 days)
Posts: 1797
Joined: 07-12-2003


Message 32 of 55 (129468)
08-02-2004 1:18 AM
Reply to: Message 29 by Spiritman.8m
08-01-2004 11:04 PM


Re: Why doesn't God do miracles today?
The Lord will work thru anyone who is sincere, Yaro, yourself included. He works on behalf of the faith of those involved.
Maybe God is wanting to work thru you but you have never believed it! ...
Isn't this a bit iresponsible?
I mean, god ain't gonna do anything to make me belive in him cuz I have to come to that thrugh my free will. Which means there is no guarantee I will be saved to be able to be used for "some good". Mehnwhile two thirds of the world live in abject poverty and a stagering number of chilldrend die every year from mal nutriton and preventable desises.
Yet god waits for people to start beliving in him so he can work thrugh them to fix this stuff? Thats ludacriss, and negligent.
Especialy when the lord could simply snap his fingers and end all suffering on this earth.
I guess my question is, whats the point? Why the middle man?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by Spiritman.8m, posted 08-01-2004 11:04 PM Spiritman.8m has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 35 by Spiritman.8m, posted 08-02-2004 3:01 AM Yaro has not replied

Spiritman.8m
Inactive Member


Message 33 of 55 (129476)
08-02-2004 2:46 AM
Reply to: Message 30 by Coragyps
08-02-2004 12:26 AM


Re: Why doesn't God do miracles today?
If we say just 'believe in Him' it denotes intellectual belief. However if you have Spiritual experience you know that intellect itself won't get you anywhere. To 'believe on Him' implies full trust and dependance with the heart - which is what God is looking for before He will respond to you...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 30 by Coragyps, posted 08-02-2004 12:26 AM Coragyps has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 34 by coffee_addict, posted 08-02-2004 2:50 AM Spiritman.8m has replied

coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 467 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 34 of 55 (129477)
08-02-2004 2:50 AM
Reply to: Message 33 by Spiritman.8m
08-02-2004 2:46 AM


Re: Why doesn't God do miracles today?
Uh... shouldn't someone propose a topic for this one? You wouldn't want the cranky moose with the almighty admin mode to come down hard on you.

The Laminator
For goodness's sake, please vote Democrat this November!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 33 by Spiritman.8m, posted 08-02-2004 2:46 AM Spiritman.8m has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by Spiritman.8m, posted 08-02-2004 3:15 AM coffee_addict has not replied

Spiritman.8m
Inactive Member


Message 35 of 55 (129479)
08-02-2004 3:01 AM
Reply to: Message 32 by Yaro
08-02-2004 1:18 AM


Re: Why doesn't God do miracles today?
If God just snapped His fingers and fixed everything no one would change their heart and attitude toward greed, malice, violence, and usery of others, etc...
You have a different attitude than most others, your statements reflect it. You see God has set things right in the past but the 'human nature factor' keeps destroying what God wants to do. God gave us ability to 'create' and 'will' to act for His ways or our own. We were created in His image... We are spirit in a physical body and if we move in harmony with His Will, our life will have fulfillment of purpose, for us and others. If we choose what we want... it doesn't work out because it conflicts with what others want for themselves... The example of starving children is a good one because I believe there is the means to feed everybody on the planet.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by Yaro, posted 08-02-2004 1:18 AM Yaro has not replied

Spiritman.8m
Inactive Member


Message 36 of 55 (129480)
08-02-2004 3:15 AM
Reply to: Message 34 by coffee_addict
08-02-2004 2:50 AM


Re: Why doesn't God do miracles today?
Agreed!
Since I am new and not familiar with proceedures, perhaps someone else could do what needs to be done.

Spiritman.8m

This message is a reply to:
 Message 34 by coffee_addict, posted 08-02-2004 2:50 AM coffee_addict has not replied

lfen
Member (Idle past 4667 days)
Posts: 2189
From: Oregon
Joined: 06-24-2004


Message 37 of 55 (130046)
08-03-2004 3:14 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Led Zeppelin
04-24-2004 12:48 AM


Led Zeppelin has not registered and appears to have left the building.
Still he started an interesting little thread.
It was much easier 2500 years ago to talk of miracles. Seems like there are still many people today who are looking for such things to believe in though they have to go to ancient sources like the Bible to find them.
2500 years ago there were newscamera and investigator and only the earliest form of protoscience.
My opinion is God is performing as he always had. It's that there is a lot less room for the televangelists, would be prophets, and faith healers to put their humbug over on people.
The priests of Judah came up with the stories of miracles to gain the consent of the Jews to accept their point of view. The really clever innovation they came up with was when the battles went against the Jews they convinced them that it wasn't because Jehovah was not as powerful as they claimed but rather he was punishing the Jews because they hadn't obeyed the priests. This was a double bind in the priest favor. When things went good it was because Jehovah was favoring them and if things went bad it was because they hadn't kept the complicated contract they claimed Moses struck for them.
Actually I think this is a trick typical of priests everywhere. Heads they win, and tails they win. Since those times science and rationality have come along but it appears they are just a tiny speed bump on the priest's highway for believers even though the reports of miracles have fallen way off because of the amount of scrutiny available these days.
So why isn't it miracle enough that you exist in the universe?
lfen
"So remember, when you're feeling very small and insecure,
how amazingly unlikely is your birth,
And pray that there's intelligent life somewhere up in space,
because there's bugger all down here on Earth." Monty Python's Galaxy Song

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Led Zeppelin, posted 04-24-2004 12:48 AM Led Zeppelin has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 39 by Spiritman.8m, posted 08-15-2004 11:31 PM lfen has replied

Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 38 of 55 (132275)
08-10-2004 5:56 AM


Topic title modified
I added the "(Re: God's Miracles - Past and Present)" part.
My impression is that is the main theme, both in message 1 and in the most recent messages.
Adminnemooseus

Comments on moderation procedures? - Go to
Change in Moderation?
or
Thread Reopen Requests

Spiritman.8m
Inactive Member


Message 39 of 55 (134205)
08-15-2004 11:31 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by lfen
08-03-2004 3:14 PM


'Miracles' are happening ... regularly.
What makes you think the same type of works of the Spirit of God and communication with Jesus thru the Spirit aren't going on today?

Spiritman.8m

This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by lfen, posted 08-03-2004 3:14 PM lfen has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 40 by lfen, posted 08-16-2004 6:58 PM Spiritman.8m has replied

lfen
Member (Idle past 4667 days)
Posts: 2189
From: Oregon
Joined: 06-24-2004


Message 40 of 55 (134451)
08-16-2004 6:58 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by Spiritman.8m
08-15-2004 11:31 PM


Re: 'Miracles' are happening ... regularly.
I think there is a lot of communication going one with Jesus, Krishna, God, etc. This is an important activity for many people and I think reflects the bredth and depth of the mind.
"same type of works of the Spirit of God"? I was speaking of supernatural miracles that require a violation of physical laws such as the sun standing still or moving backwards.
lfen

This message is a reply to:
 Message 39 by Spiritman.8m, posted 08-15-2004 11:31 PM Spiritman.8m has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 41 by Spiritman.8m, posted 08-17-2004 1:14 PM lfen has replied

Spiritman.8m
Inactive Member


Message 41 of 55 (134696)
08-17-2004 1:14 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by lfen
08-16-2004 6:58 PM


Re: 'Miracles' are happening ... regularly.
lfen:
That's good you are open, though I won't go there on the subject of "a lot of communication going on ...". There are a great many types of spirits that exist on the spiritual plane...
However, Isn't it a great miracle if someone is healed who has a terminal illness the medical profession can't fix? When this person goes back to the doctor who re-tests and can't explain why there is now no sign of the illness, Isn't that miraculous? If God actually 'spoke' and brought the world into being, can He not also stop the world for a day... (in whatever manner it took place)

Spiritman.8m

This message is a reply to:
 Message 40 by lfen, posted 08-16-2004 6:58 PM lfen has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 42 by lfen, posted 08-17-2004 2:12 PM Spiritman.8m has replied
 Message 44 by 1.61803, posted 08-17-2004 9:46 PM Spiritman.8m has replied

lfen
Member (Idle past 4667 days)
Posts: 2189
From: Oregon
Joined: 06-24-2004


Message 42 of 55 (134708)
08-17-2004 2:12 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by Spiritman.8m
08-17-2004 1:14 PM


Re: 'Miracles' are happening ... regularly.
Spiritman,
I don't think there was an interuption of natural law in "miraclous" recoveries. The immune system of our organisms is very complex and capable of great healing and there is a role that the mind and consciousness play in that. Andrew Weil M.D. has written a good book on this titled SPONTANEOUS HEALING.
I am not that open on spirit communication. I think these are experiences of one part of a person's mind communicating with another part. Sometimes it is useful, other times not so useful and sometimes harmful but not supernatural.
I don't think Genesis is meant to be or is a literal account of creation, nor do I think the sun stopped. Maybe the author was talking about a sense of time slowing down that can happen sometimes as a result of lots of adrenalin and used that language cause that was what it felt like, or maybe because it made a good story.
I think in many ancient cultures such stories came about. In some sense the alien abduction stories and other strange things come about out of a love of fantastic tales. I still hold that wild kinds of miracles are reported less and less because of science and technology not giving them support and in fact undermining them by cameras, instrumentation, science, etc.
On the other hand I have deep sympathy that being at all and the complexity of the universe and life are lovely miracles to behold.
lfen

This message is a reply to:
 Message 41 by Spiritman.8m, posted 08-17-2004 1:14 PM Spiritman.8m has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 43 by Spiritman.8m, posted 08-17-2004 8:41 PM lfen has not replied

Spiritman.8m
Inactive Member


Message 43 of 55 (134798)
08-17-2004 8:41 PM
Reply to: Message 42 by lfen
08-17-2004 2:12 PM


Re: 'Miracles' are happening ... regularly.
lfen
OH ... So you believe nothing exists beyond us in the here and now.
Everything that happens supernaturally is simply our abilities playing a role.
You should watch the series show, 'Unexplained Mysteries'. It's not a religious show, ... they examine evidence.
I'm sure Dr. Weil writes a good story giving theories on how these things take place, but what evidence substantiates that these phenomenon are a result of what he says. Have you examined the evidence of claims for yourself to see if they are true?
... It is said that most people go thru life acting as sheep, that is they believe something because it seems a good idea to them but without substantiating what they believe. Do you do that?

Spiritman.8m

This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by lfen, posted 08-17-2004 2:12 PM lfen has not replied

1.61803
Member (Idle past 1494 days)
Posts: 2928
From: Lone Star State USA
Joined: 02-19-2004


Message 44 of 55 (134802)
08-17-2004 9:46 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by Spiritman.8m
08-17-2004 1:14 PM


Re: 'Miracles' are happening ... regularly.
spiritman writes:
There are a great many types of spirits that exist on the spiritual plane.
Evidence please. Please produce some verifiable evidence of spirits. As well as types of spirits as well as the current coordinates of the spiritual plane you are refering to.
spiritman writes:
can he not stop the world for a day...in what ever manner it took place.
Yes a astroid the size of the moon could impact the Earth and stop the Earth permanantly. It is a "miracle" that we creatures on Earth exist at all IMO.

"One is punished most for ones virtues" Fredrick Neitzche

This message is a reply to:
 Message 41 by Spiritman.8m, posted 08-17-2004 1:14 PM Spiritman.8m has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 45 by Spiritman.8m, posted 08-18-2004 1:50 AM 1.61803 has replied

Spiritman.8m
Inactive Member


Message 45 of 55 (134846)
08-18-2004 1:50 AM
Reply to: Message 44 by 1.61803
08-17-2004 9:46 PM


Re: 'Miracles' are happening ... regularly.
Hi 1.6803...
My comment as to God stopping the world has to based on the premise that you believe the spirit world exists around us. 'Believe' is not to say you make it up in your mind but that you come to acknowledge what you previously were ignorant of or refused to agree was true, and now agree that it is so!
The coordinates are right around you, but you need spiritual enablement to 'see' it.
Now the evidence can be given if you want it!!!
If I say to you that a certain type of mushroom grows in certain places and describe these types of places, would you go look to see for yourself?
If I give places where you may look for this evidence and find it, will you go look for yourself?

Spiritman.8m

This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by 1.61803, posted 08-17-2004 9:46 PM 1.61803 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 46 by sidelined, posted 08-18-2004 8:30 AM Spiritman.8m has replied
 Message 48 by 1.61803, posted 08-18-2004 3:49 PM Spiritman.8m has replied

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