On Judging Others

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I agree, if you are born in the US, then you are an American.

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Except, according to George Bush, if you are an Atheist.Atheists shouldn't be allowed to be citizens, according to him.

Found it - despite search not wanting to play Having read the replies (the first few rounds from jar, mikehager and Discreet Label) and I have to say I think you have grounds for feeling aggrieved, at least with mikehager and Discrete Label.However, without wishing to appear to be trying to read minds I suspect the response you got had more to do with the persona you adopt on this board and the reaction it provokes in people than with Political Correctness.My feeling is what you said was misinterpreted (and that was because the people involved put a bad - and in my opinion unjustified - interpretation on what you said).

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Oops! Wrong Planet

Much as it galls to have to agree with Faith on something if you get an Atlas and look at the countries bounded by the ones she listed I think you'll find the enclosed area covers all the countries you list except Portugal (she should have said the Iberian peninsular rather than just Spain).

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Oops! Wrong Planet

When did he say that?

Gee, I thought my boundaries were pretty inclusive of all that but maybe not. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

I've lived extensively in both Central and South America. There appears to be a slight difference in outlook between the two. In Central America, they refer to themselves in the collective as either "centroamericanos" or "americanos". In South America, they refer to themselves as "latinoamericanos" - a grouping which they insist doesn't include other latin americans such as the Central Americans. I guess everybody has their issues on this particular subject. You are 100% correct. Interesting that you should mention the Hopi and Navajo. I'm originally from the southwest, and the bare tolerance between the two groups is noticeable. They have very different cultures, and don't even speak a language from the same language family (Navajo is Athabaskan, Hopi is an Uto-Azteca derivative). I learned early on not to make the mistake of lumping all indigenous groups into one collective pot. The Dineh (literally, "The People") would be extraordinarily insulted to be mistaken for the Hopituh (literally, "The Peaceful Ones"), and vice versa. In this context, "Indian" isn't any better than "Native American", IMO.

Thanks. The nitpicking does get to one.

In a news conference at Chicago O'Hare airport, Bush (Sr. is who we're talking about, BTW) addressed the entire nation:

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I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God.

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The last placed I lived was just about 10 miles from the Navajo-Hopi Reservation which meant that there was a very high population of indigenous peoples. Both groups seem to dislike just about anyone not directly affiliated with their tribe, but I noticed even a more striking disparity between the two tribes. I also knew a Cherokee who moved onto that Rez and neither group treated him very well because he was an outsider. Certainly I knew their cultures were a bit different and their language was different, but I was under the assumption that the difference between Hopi and Navajo and were, perhaps, the difference between Cantonese and Mandarin. As you've elucidated, that isn't the case at all. And to even further show how Native Americans are extremely diverse, its my understanding that certain tribes do not come from Sino-asiatic blood, but rather, some share more DNA markers with Vikings. I can't recall which East Coast tribes those are, but I'm sure somebody will know what I'm talking about.

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“If chance be the father of all flesh then disaster is his rainbow in the sky. And when you hear of, state of emergencies, sniper kills ten, youths go looting, bomb blasts school, it is but the sound of man worshipping his maker” -Steve Turner

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: I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God.

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Well, that's not a good way to get re-elected. Stupid move.

The original idea stated by Yeshua has two parts, doesn't it?

Do not judge, lest you be judged.
For the measure you use to judge others will be used on you.

I confess I've never understood the controversy surrounding this quote, or the loquacious sermonizing it inspires, either.It looks like a straight-ahead admonition to withhold judgement when facts are still out, and to be careful, considerate, and fair in the hypotheses we form. It acknowledges the right of others to assess us by the same standard we use for them. And it encourages us to consider this reciprocity on the front end, before we proceed.That's just good advice. On the whole, it's how life works.A politician in a democratic country is discovered at a strip club. Being at the club is not a crime, but the headline still jeopardizes a career. The politician who run on a strong 'morality' line--to the right or the left--is going to pay a different price than the one who takes a more libertarian stance. Why? Because the public will assess the person's character in large part according the measure the person has used.One politician goes home red-faced. Another survives, has a long career, and gets teased about it at the retirement dinner. Someone looking at this discrepancy complains 'That's not fair! Where's the uniform standard?'Ah, but there is none. Each standard is a custom fit, and we are the tailors.

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Archer

It was misintepreted because of their knee-jerk politically correct reaction.One must not feel sympathy for anybody because that means you are judging them--a rule of politically correct morality that stifles naturally good sympathetic feelings.

Very well expressed.

Message #45 awaits, if you please.

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It was misintepreted because of their knee-jerk politically correct reaction.

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Or, as was suggested, the response you got had more to do with the persona you adopt on this board and the reaction it provokes in people than with Political Correctness.

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"Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins a movie by telling you how it ends! Well I say there are some things we don't want to know! Important things!"
- Ned Flanders"Question with boldness even the existence of God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear." - Thomas Jefferson