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Author Topic:   Election 2006
RAZD
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Posts: 15885
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 31 of 96 (362694)
11-08-2006 6:20 PM


hippo cats
Anybody notice how the republicans are rushing to meticulously count every possible hanging chad?

Where did that urgency for decisions go eh?


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SuperNintendo Chalmers
Member (Idle past 2269 days)
Posts: 772
From: Bartlett, IL, USA
Joined: 12-27-2005


Message 32 of 96 (362701)
11-08-2006 6:46 PM
Reply to: Message 29 by clpMINI
11-08-2006 5:51 PM


Re: Virginia Senate Race
Allen has little to no chance of winning.... I'm betting he will concede... especially considering the FBI investigation
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Hyroglyphx
Member (Idle past 605 days)
Posts: 5140
From: Austin, TX
Joined: 05-03-2006


Message 33 of 96 (362703)
11-08-2006 6:58 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by SuperNintendo Chalmers
11-08-2006 1:17 PM


Re: wow... the massacre continues
This is truly a great thing for our soldiers regardless of which side you were on... I think everyone can agree that Rumsfeld was a big problem

I'll have to say that when the Secretary of Defense neglects to heed the advice of his own top generals who are reported to directly by officers in country, that is an enormous problem. Rumsfeld did what was in the best interests of his own party, which was to resign.


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Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3355
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 1.9


Message 34 of 96 (362707)
11-08-2006 7:24 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by RAZD
11-08-2006 6:20 PM


Re: hippo cats
RAZD writes:

Anybody notice how the republicans are rushing to meticulously count every possible hanging chad?

Where did that urgency for decisions go eh?

It went the same place as that SCOTUS decison that said everyone had to have the same right to be miscounted, but insisted it was a one-off, setting no precedent.

I recall with particular piquancy how they announced their decision a few hours before Florida was supposed to submit its electoral results--even though they had made their decision several days before--and argued there could be no recount because no time for it remained. I recall when the SCOTUS blocked a Florida recount because it might harm Bush. I think future historians will make much of those days, when major fractures appeared in the Republic.

I understand Rome had days like that.

You do know the GOP was planning both court action and media appeals to the Electoral College electors to change their votes in 2000 if Gore won the election but not the popular vote?

Of course, they changed their tune when it was Bush who took the college but not the popular vote.

RAZD, they are NOT nice people. :rolleyes:


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Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3355
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 1.9


Message 35 of 96 (362708)
11-08-2006 7:31 PM
Reply to: Message 33 by Hyroglyphx
11-08-2006 6:58 PM


Re: wow... the massacre continues
n_j writes:

I'll have to say that when the Secretary of Defense neglects to heed the advice of his own top generals who are reported to directly by officers in country, that is an enormous problem. Rumsfeld did what was in the best interests of his own party, which was to resign.

If the history of today ever become an open book, I suspect we'll find he did what the President demanded of him--all eyes are now on 2008, and Rummie was a liability.

Too bad he never did what was in the best interest of his country and his own humanity. Instead, he championed torture. We should never let old men lead us to war; they have too little to lose.

He should face the same kind of trials the captive Nazis faced.


Drinking when we are not thirsty and making love at any time, madam, is all that distinguishes us from the other animals.

-Pierre De Beaumarchais (1732–1799)

Save lives! Click here!
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC!
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Minnemooseus
Member
Posts: 3249
From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior)
Joined: 11-11-2001
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 36 of 96 (362709)
11-08-2006 7:36 PM


Minnesota (3rd party suck-dum)
Minnesota went pretty strong Democrat, with a Governor race "glitch".

Governor race - Party - Candidates - Vote total - Vote %

Independence PETER HUTCHINSON AND MAUREEN REED 141726 6.43
Republican TIM PAWLENTY AND CAROL MOLNAU 1028569 46.69
Democratic-Farmer-Labor MIKE HATCH AND JUDI DUTCHER 1007439 45.73

Source

Pawlenty is the incumbent.

The third party tilted things to Pawlenty / Molnau. Once again, to vote third party is to elect the one you don't want.

Moose


Professor, geology, Whatsamatta U
Evolution - Changes in the environment, caused by the interactions of the components of the environment.

"Do not meddle in the affairs of cats, for they are subtle and will piss on your computer." - Bruce Graham

"The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness." - John Kenneth Galbraith

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Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5142
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002
Member Rating: 2.0


Message 37 of 96 (362713)
11-08-2006 7:49 PM
Reply to: Message 35 by Omnivorous
11-08-2006 7:31 PM


Re: wow... the massacre continues
We should never let old men lead us to war; they have too little to lose.

My contention is that wars should be settled by putting an old (my age, say) general/secretary of war/president from each side in a cool room, wearing only their skivvies, and armed only with rolled-up damp towels. A couple of big welts each from getting popped with those babies, and they'll be ready to sind down and talk about it....


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Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5142
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002
Member Rating: 2.0


Message 38 of 96 (362714)
11-08-2006 7:52 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by Minnemooseus
11-08-2006 7:36 PM


Re: Minnesota (3rd party suck-dum)
Once again, to vote third party is to elect the one you don't want.

Here, too. The two noticeable independents here in Texas siphoned off Democrats and gave Perry the win.


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Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3355
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 1.9


Message 39 of 96 (362718)
11-08-2006 8:06 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by Coragyps
11-08-2006 7:49 PM


Re: wow... the massacre continues
Amen.
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anglagard
Member
Posts: 2013
From: Big Spring, TX, USA
Joined: 03-18-2006


Message 40 of 96 (362719)
11-08-2006 8:13 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by Coragyps
11-08-2006 7:52 PM


Re: Minnesota (3rd party suck-dum)
Coragyps writes:

Here, too. The two noticeable independents here in Texas siphoned off Democrats and gave Perry the win.

Four more years of no support for public schools and colleges (except UT Austin and A&M).

We may yet win the race to the bottom.


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RAZD
Member
Posts: 15885
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 41 of 96 (362725)
11-08-2006 8:31 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by Minnemooseus
11-08-2006 7:36 PM


blame the 1 vote system not the voters
The third party tilted things to Pawlenty / Molnau. Once again, to vote third party is to elect the one you don't want.

This is not the fault of the third party candidates or the people who vote for them, it is the fault of a discriminatory system of voting that only allows one to voice a first level choice.

I think if we had a system of rated voting (1 to 5?) not only would their be much better representation (better choices in primaries, better choices in elections) but there would be more emphasis on POLICIES than on MUD.

What we don't know is whether such a system would have different results - we can guess but we can't know.

I would hope that this election may focus things away from black-box-electronic voting and more onto principles of getting and counting the evaluations of candidates by the voters.

BUT - this goes off topic for this thread.

Personally I am happy with the governor state house\senate races as much as the federal ones -- they may change how things happen next election.

One of the things I had not realized is that the Supreme Court - in approving the Delay Texas redistricting fraud - left open the ability of any state to redistrict without waiting for the census to run again. WHERE people were counted was as much an issue as HOW they voted in the last presidential election.

Democrats now control more state governments than in many years. We also see state governments pushing raised minimum wages, stem cell research, medical care and other issue that have been ignored at the federal level for so long.

I would love to see the fiscal responsibility issue raise up and bite Cheney, by forcing his hidden contract companies to account for every dime or give it back. And then keep subpoenaing his records so that his final (2) years will be like Clinton's were. Or he gets impeached.

I would love to take the tax rebate issue and turn it over on the republicans - give the same amount of money back, but give the same amount to everyone, and give it in certificates that can only be redeemed in american companies for american made products.

And see what happens to the economy.

Enjoy.


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... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
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RAZD
Member
Posts: 15885
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 42 of 96 (362727)
11-08-2006 8:42 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by Minnemooseus
11-08-2006 7:36 PM


Not always 3rd party issue
In Rhode Island we had solid democratic runs on all federal and statewide positions (including a new democrat in the senate) except:
Donald L. CARCIERI	Republican	197,013 - 51.02% 
Charles J. FOGARTY Democrat 189,099 - 48.98%

Darn it.


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we are limited in our ability to understand
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... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


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Chiroptera
Member (Idle past 1014 days)
Posts: 6202
From: Oklahoma
Joined: 09-28-2003


Message 43 of 96 (362728)
11-08-2006 8:42 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by RAZD
11-08-2006 8:31 PM


Re: blame the 1 vote system not the voters
Actually, a proportional system for the legislature would be better; then even minority voters like myself could be assured that our votes would be pooled together to elect at least one member of a party that holds our positions. The problem with your scheme (and the ITV method) is that no minority candidate will actually be elected -- the minority candidates will still be eliminated, the votes then being distributed among what are still the non-preferred candidates. Minority viewpoints would still be excluded from the legislature.


Kings were put to death long before 21 January 1793. But regicides of earlier times and their followers were interested in attacking the person, not the principle, of the king. They wanted another king, and that was all. It never occurred to them that the throne could remain empty forever. -- Albert Camus
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RAZD
Member
Posts: 15885
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 44 of 96 (362731)
11-08-2006 8:46 PM
Reply to: Message 43 by Chiroptera
11-08-2006 8:42 PM


Re: blame the 1 vote system not the voters
perhaps a best of both worlds:

senate by preference system (they are supposed to represent the state)

house by proportional system (they are supposed to represent the people eh?) - one I like is having a lottery ... no campaigns, no parties, no politicians ...

Enjoy.


Join the effort to unravel {AIDS/HIV} {Protenes} and {Cancer} with Team EvC! (click)

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand

RebelAAmericanOZen[Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


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Max Power
Member (Idle past 2442 days)
Posts: 32
From: Minneapolis, MN, USA
Joined: 06-03-2005


Message 45 of 96 (362732)
11-08-2006 8:46 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by Minnemooseus
11-08-2006 7:36 PM


Re: Minnesota (3rd party suck-dum)
God forbid you vote for the better candidate. I truely wonder how many people would have voted Hutchinson had they not been voting against Pawlenty. The problem is both the reps and dems have it in their interest to deny the instant runoff elections.

Excuse the slightly Off Topic Rant


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