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Author Topic:   creo/evo creative movies/books/plays
docpotato
Member (Idle past 5047 days)
Posts: 334
From: Portland, OR
Joined: 07-18-2003


Message 1 of 52 (74120)
12-18-2003 1:49 PM


Hello everyone.
I am wondering if anyone has seen any movies, read any books, seen a play, etc. that they feel depict in a fictional setting or recreation of a real setting the conflict that we see here everyday. Obviously Inherit the Wind is the big name in plays or movies for this debate.
I'm curious if there are any others out there from either perspective of creationist or evolutionist. I'd be delighted to learn of any Christian-produced movies that argue for Creationism.

Replies to this message:
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 Message 6 by MrHambre, posted 12-18-2003 8:24 PM docpotato has not replied
 Message 7 by Mammuthus, posted 12-19-2003 3:19 AM docpotato has not replied
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 Message 14 by berberry, posted 12-27-2003 12:08 PM docpotato has replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 2 of 52 (74122)
12-18-2003 1:54 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by docpotato
12-18-2003 1:49 PM


Galileo by Bertolt Brecht.
Not actually creo/evo, but the exact same conflict.

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Abshalom
Inactive Member


Message 3 of 52 (74125)
12-18-2003 2:03 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Dan Carroll
12-18-2003 1:54 PM


Pro-Creationist Film
National Lampoon's "Animal House"

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crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 4 of 52 (74134)
12-18-2003 2:36 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by docpotato
12-18-2003 1:49 PM


There's some of that conflict in "Contact". When I was a believer I thought it was good. Now I'm of the opinion that it presents a rather maudlin spirituality. Though it's still a good movie.

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mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4752
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 5 of 52 (74159)
12-18-2003 6:55 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by crashfrog
12-18-2003 2:36 PM


I dunno Crash, when she went to
outta space and the alien turned out to be some cheesy human dude, and then she went home.- Pa-lease! - I paid for this!!!!
It dealt with science/faith - that was pleasing, rather than science/religion. Though the 'faith guy' was a bit of a holywood concoction. Apart from that I thought it was an unspecial movie. - For example; 2001 - A Space Odyssey certainly kicks it's butt right back to amateur.
P.S> - Oh my dear daddy's an alien with sparkling white teeth, and a celestial glow - maudlin, you coined it Crash.
[This message has been edited by mike the wiz, 12-23-2003]

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MrHambre
Member (Idle past 1392 days)
Posts: 1495
From: Framingham, MA, USA
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 6 of 52 (74172)
12-18-2003 8:24 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by docpotato
12-18-2003 1:49 PM


Pages from a Primate's Diary
Some of our Brit correspondents may already be familiar with the perverse Will Self, whose Great Apes tells the bizarre tale of a man who wakes up one fine morning to find himself a chimp living in a chimpanzee society. He is taken on as a case study by a chimp neurologist resembling a simian Oliver Sacks. For any of you drawing bad parallels to Planet of the Apes, relax. Self is exploring our primal heritage, the positive social aspects that Homo Sap abandoned when he crowned himself King. The satire here avoids the predictable targets and familiar avenues, but some may tire of all the grooming episodes.
------------------
The dark nursery of evolution is very dark indeed.
Brad McFall

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Mammuthus
Member (Idle past 6475 days)
Posts: 3085
From: Munich, Germany
Joined: 08-09-2002


Message 7 of 52 (74209)
12-19-2003 3:19 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by docpotato
12-18-2003 1:49 PM


Two books by Greg Bear, Darwins Radio and Darwins Children, touch on the evo vs creo debate. However, far more relevant is an episode of the Simpsons where in digging the foundation for a new shopping mall they discover a neandertal skeleton with wings which sets of an evo creo debate between Lisa and everybody else. In addition, being 1 of the 2 people on the planet that probably watches the new Star Trek series Enterprise (in German )(Actually side comment, is there some compelling reason that every character of authority in film or tv in Germany is dubbed by the same guy who dubs Homer Simpson's voice?)..where was I? Oh yes, in Enterprise, the doctor had the choice of saving a species on a planet that was somehow genetically de-evolving/dying/contrived sci fi crap or letting them die so that the other species on the planet that were largely a slave species could evolve. He made a big statement about how evolution is a fact...maybe that is why I watch the show...it is certainly not for the lousy dubbing, acting, or plot.

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Rrhain
Member
Posts: 6351
From: San Diego, CA, USA
Joined: 05-03-2003


Message 8 of 52 (74315)
12-19-2003 3:35 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by docpotato
12-18-2003 1:49 PM


Well, there was the Star Trek: Voyager episode where a group of dinosaur-like creatures find a human (a dead Voyager crewman) and through genetic analysis conclude that he is related to them. This helps to confirm their "distant origin" hypothesis that these saurians didn't arise in this part of the galaxy but actually came from somewhere else...and it turns out that they are descended from Earth dinosaurs.
This, of course, contradicts doctrine and after great drama, the saurian scientists are given a choice: Death to the entire Voyager crew and punishment to all of the saurian scientist families or denounce the "distant origin" claim which, of course, they do.
On a more general theme of the conflict of religion/morality coming up against science/technology is Twilight of the Golds where there is a somewhat religious couple. She is pregnant and he is a researcher in a genetic testing firm. They have developed a test that can be performed in utero to determine if the baby will be gay and it turns out that their child will most likely be gay. The mother also has a brother who is gay and is pretty much alienated from everybody else in the family. It deals with a bunch of issues such as abortion, the claim of "homosexuality is a choice" from religion, etc.
------------------
Rrhain
WWJD? JWRTFM!

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nator
Member (Idle past 2169 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 9 of 52 (74731)
12-22-2003 8:22 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by mike the wiz
12-18-2003 6:55 PM


quote:
I dunno Crash, when she went to
outta space and the alien turned out to be some cheesy human dude, and then she went home.- Pa-lease! - I paid for this!!!!
Except that the "human dude" wasn't human, but was just appearing as such so she would be able to understand and interact with it.
I found the most interesting part was the exploration and defense of skepticism and the scientific method as a legitimate means of understanding, and also interesting was the fact that "I don't know" was an acceptable answer.
quote:
Though the 'faith guy' was a bit of a holywood concoction
...and what a yummy concoction he was.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by mike the wiz, posted 12-18-2003 6:55 PM mike the wiz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by mike the wiz, posted 12-23-2003 8:33 AM nator has replied

  
mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4752
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 10 of 52 (74829)
12-23-2003 8:33 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by nator
12-22-2003 8:22 PM


...and what a yummy concoction he was.
Yuck, information overload .
the scientific method as a legitimate means of understanding,
Yes it is indeed. However she herself in the end had to deal with a 'faith' issue - trying to convince others with a lack of evidence. I empathize with her because 'words' are very hard to place right when your trying to convince someone with no evidence. Also they immediately judge her as somehow being irrational which is just annoying because that's what people do to me here sometimes.
What do you give it out of ten then Schraff? I'll give it 7, despite it's cheesy input.

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 Message 9 by nator, posted 12-22-2003 8:22 PM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by nator, posted 12-23-2003 7:55 PM mike the wiz has replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2169 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 11 of 52 (74942)
12-23-2003 7:55 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by mike the wiz
12-23-2003 8:33 AM


Yes it is indeed. However she herself in the end had to deal with a 'faith' issue - trying to convince others with a lack of evidence.
Heehee. Sorry, I forgot that people over 25 years old are not supposed to be or find others sexy. heeheehee.
quote:
I empathize with her because 'words' are very hard to place right when your trying to convince someone with no evidence. Also they immediately judge her as somehow being irrational which is just annoying because that's what people do to me here sometimes.
Well, the thing is, she actually did go somewhere but had no evidence. I also think it's interesting that she didn't really expect anyone to believe her.
On the other hand, there was quite a bit of evidence in that they figured out the plans to make the "ship/transporter/communicator thingy". It's npt like she just woke up one day saying she had communicated with aliens rather than having been strapped into this thing that they built from plans they got from outer space.
Read the book. The book is different than the movie in an important way which I will not talk about lest I ruin it for you.
quote:
What do you give it out of ten then Schraff? I'll give it 7, despite it's cheesy input.
I would agree with that score, yep. I love Jodie Foster's work.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by mike the wiz, posted 12-23-2003 8:33 AM mike the wiz has replied

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mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4752
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 12 of 52 (74944)
12-23-2003 8:25 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by nator
12-23-2003 7:55 PM


Read the book. The book is different than the movie in an important way
Yes. The read usually ends up more interesting than the watch. Though I'm not sure I'm so turned on by the movie that I'd buy the book.
On the other hand, there was quite a bit of evidence in that they figured out the plans to make the "ship/transporter/communicator thingy".
Good point, it's not like it was an "I've been abducted by aliens" open/close case, lol. If I remember correctly there was 15 hours of recorded static when the sneaky suits retrieved the film of the incident, and they proceeded in keeping it quiet.
My question is - How would you know for sure if it was an alien? Maybe the cheese was supposed to be God.
Sorry, I forgot that people over 25 years old are not supposed to be or find others sexy.
That's a new one on me, Lol, 'be', nonsense, I find some 40 year olds sexy now surely that's against the forum rules.
-----------------------------------------------------------
'Your lack of faith is disturbing' - Darth Vader
[This message has been edited by mike the wiz, 12-23-2003]

This message is a reply to:
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Rrhain
Member
Posts: 6351
From: San Diego, CA, USA
Joined: 05-03-2003


Message 13 of 52 (74974)
12-24-2003 8:24 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by nator
12-23-2003 7:55 PM


schrafinator writes:
quote:
On the other hand, there was quite a bit of evidence in that they figured out the plans to make the "ship/transporter/communicator thingy".
But then again, they were saying that it came from Hadden. After all, he's the one that told her how to decode it. The ultimate question was whether or not the signal was faked. Which is more likely...Hadden faked it all or it really was a signal from outer space?
The problem I have with it is the reason for denying what happened. It's been a while since I've seen it so I don't remember it too well, but it seemed that the only reason the government covered it up is because James Woods was playing a jerk.
------------------
Rrhain
WWJD? JWRTFM!

This message is a reply to:
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berberry
Inactive Member


Message 14 of 52 (75314)
12-27-2003 12:08 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by docpotato
12-18-2003 1:49 PM


A late 70s Italian picture contains a beautiful and powerful commentary on this debate: Allegro Non Troppo. It's a series of cartoons set to classical music pieces in the manner of Disney's Fantasia. My favorite sequence is what I call The Melancholy Cat; set to Sibelius' Valse Triste it follows a lonely cat wandering through the ruins of a war-torn city, remembering what life used to be like. It will bring tears to your eyes.
The sequence which is relevant to this debate is set to Ravel's Bolero (an ordinarily boring piece of music IMO). It begins with a shot of a coke bottle being thrown onto a lifeless planet by a passing spaceship. Interaction between the planet's environment and the tiny bit of Coke left in the bottle creates life, and that life evolves into more complicated life, which evolves into still more complicated life. Finally, the beauty of this evolutionary progress is interrupted by the appearance of religion.

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docpotato
Member (Idle past 5047 days)
Posts: 334
From: Portland, OR
Joined: 07-18-2003


Message 15 of 52 (75544)
12-29-2003 1:50 AM
Reply to: Message 14 by berberry
12-27-2003 12:08 PM


I will check this out soon, sounds lovely! Thanks for a great obscure recomendation.

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