General Discussion Of Moderation Procedures 13.0

To make things simple I've used the horrible classifications of "Evo" and "Creo" within this post. I hope we can all understand what's trying to be conveyed.This isn't so much a particular reply to Brian as it is an attempt to clarify some of the implications that this site is somehow meant to be an equal battle-ground for Evo's and Creo's. I don't understand how anyone could be so dense as to spend a day scanning posts here and walk away with that impression. Are you sure about that? As far as I've ever read, Percy and this site have been extremely clear that this site is incredibly biased against the Evo side. It's been repeated many times, even by Percy, that Evo's are held to "a much higher debating standard" than Creo's. I would be very surprised if you or anyone else posting in this thread was unaware. I've never seen a "rabid attempt to balance the sides". All I've seen is simple application of the rules Percy has spelled out. The rules which are biased against Evo's.And, like any board, violate the clearly spelled out rules and you get banned. Temporarily or indefinitely depending on the severity.As everyone here has posted much more than I have, I'm sure you also understand the clear procedures of this board:Evo's are held to a higher debating standard than Creo's.This means, of course, that the site is not balanced, not fair, and not even. It is biased against Evo's. If you want to participate, you'll have to accept that. Creo's are allowed a lot more lee-way with regards to personal attacks and veiled insults. When an Evo pulls this sort of stunt, it is well known that a harsher whip will be used against them.I found Jar's suspension in accordance with the plan of this website, and fully justifiable by how this place is ran. In fact, I was suprised at how long he was able to continue repeating those facts and statements without any effort at all to engage in some sort of academic debate.I fully believe what Jar said was true, honest, and valid. But not here, not at EvC where Evo's are held to a higher debating standard. It didn't make sense. And Jar should know better.

You answered that question yourself, in your last message: I don't understand the confusion. How do they not harmonize? There is no mention of equality. The clearly spelled out rule is biased, and there is enforcement of that biased rule.I would, however, like to amend my use of Evo and Creo to "those who know how to debate" and "those who are unfamiliar with the polite rules of debate". Since there are Evo's and Creo's on both sides (although it does tend to lean in the direction of Jar's recent statements).The clearly spelled out rule is "Those who have the education and knowledge to debate are held to a higher standard than those who do not understand how to discuss with civility and tact." It clearly indicates that different people are going to be held to different standards in order to promote overall discussion. Or, as you pointed out in your last post, this place will soon have no people to discuss with.It is ironic to point out that Jar's entire point, his main idea is exactly what this forum does already. This forum already "allows those who have no other recourse to use personal attacks and incredulity as their only defense". It just doesn't spell it out in such a demeaning and in-your-face way as Jar has been repeating so abundantly as of late. And, since Jar is one of those who understands how debate should be done, and how discussion should be promoted and developed... when he starts posting the things he's been doing he should be held to those higher standards. It's funny how he's been suspended by the very idea he's been promoting, and how that idea has already been incorporated into how EvC is ran.There are boards where the strict rules of debate are held equally over everyone. Or boards where the moderators toss out whoever they want whenever they want. There doesn't seem to be much talk between Evo's and Creo's in such places.This board attempts to promote such discussion. The primary goal of this board is not "a place where everyone must follow strict debating rules" the primary goal is "to develop talks between Evos and Creos" (to put it generally). Personally, I think it's doing the best job on the internet in that respect. It may even be the only place attempting such a goal. Sure, it slips up on minor issues sometimes (I agree that the length of Jar's suspension may have been a bit long). But it gets the major things pretty much bang-on. That is, the major things that inhibit this boards primary goal of promoting discussion, not "treating everyone with strict equality". Lee-way is given to those who need it in order to promote discussion. Harsher guidelines are imposed on those who should be able to promote discussion, but choose not to.

The wording you have used can easily be manipulated to mean something other than the idea proposed. I agree, but would more clearly state: "There is one rule for those who know better, and one rule for those who do not". I agree. I also find this irrelevent.The very first forum rule is "Follow all moderator requests." Are you saying you've never read Admin or Adminimooseus or any of the others say "Those who know better are held to a higher standard"?As I stated in my first response: It may not be in the formal forum guidelines. But anyone with more than a superficial cursory glance at these forums is well aware of this clearly spelled out policy. But... there are two sets of rules already. One set for those who know better, and another for those who don't. This is in place specifically to help those-who-don't-know to learn. Those who know better already don't need it specified. And those who need to learn would only find it condescending and therefore it would only hinder helping them to learn. Posting such a rule in the formal forum guidelines is obviously redundant and counter-productive to the goal of promoting discussion. Because equality is counter-productive to the goal of promoting the kind of discussion EvC is inclined to foster.If you want equality, there are plenty of message boards that enforce such strict, unbiased rules. Of course, you may have also noticed that the EvC debate on such boards is rather... stifled, to say the least.

I am horrible with history I'm afraid whatever slur you're attempting here has gone straight over my head. Of course. But no one wants to talk to the people who don't act insane or possessed. Everyone is aware of rational and balanced believers and no one has any arguement or debate with them.What people do want to talk about is why some believe Noah's Flood is a part of reality. They want to talk about why some believe their way of life is the "known" best way, the only way, and everyone else should be exactly like them.These people are the "lunatic fringe", as you've dubbed them. And, in order to promote discussion with them, we need an environment catered to their needs. EvC offers such an environment. Equality and enforcing unbiased forum rules is in diametric opposition to such an environment.