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Author Topic:   ERV's: Evidence of Common Ancestory
Taq
Member
Posts: 10021
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 149 of 166 (505569)
04-13-2009 3:12 PM
Reply to: Message 144 by pcver
04-13-2009 8:48 AM


Re: My Little Goliath
I believe many (if not all) 'new species' should not have been classified as new species at all. They are actually variants of the same species, (even if they do not interbreed with the original species).
This is nothing more than semantics. A variant of a species that has never been seen before is a new variant, and hence a new species. This variation is produced by mutation, and that variation is filtered through natural selection. Due to the fact that the populations do not interbreed this will lead to different mutations accumulating in each population which will increase divergence over time.
Also, variants is exactly what we see. Humans and chimps are ape variants. Humans and bears are mammal variants. Humans and fish are vertebrate variants. So I guess you have no problem with humans and these other species sharing a common ancestor since they are all variants of the same thing?
You do believe natural selection is not the answer to evolution. I say neither is mutation an answer. So evolution is impossible.
You should read my reread my response. Natural selection by itself can not produce the evolution we see. You also need the additional mechanisms of genetic isolation and mutation. All three mechanisms in combination produce evolutionary change.
Can you please explain why these three observed mechanisms could not produce the pattern of similarity and dissimilarity of primate ERV's? Why is it impossible?

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 Message 144 by pcver, posted 04-13-2009 8:48 AM pcver has not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 10021
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 158 of 166 (505766)
04-16-2009 12:42 PM
Reply to: Message 153 by pcver
04-16-2009 7:39 AM


Re: My Little Goliath
Whilst ERVs suggest common ancestry, I cannot fathom how common ancestry can be a possibility without evolution. My disbelief in evolution certainly makes it much harder to accept common ancestry.
Then we can sum this up quite nicely. ERV's are evidence (not absolute proof) that chimps and humans share a common ancestor. While you do not believe that this is actually the case, you do agree that the characteristics of ERV's are consistent with common ancestry.
Is that a fair statement?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 153 by pcver, posted 04-16-2009 7:39 AM pcver has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 161 by pcver, posted 04-20-2009 8:28 AM Taq has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 10021
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 165 of 166 (505962)
04-20-2009 3:59 PM
Reply to: Message 161 by pcver
04-20-2009 8:28 AM


Re: Bye, bye Goliath
pcver writes:
If speciation does not create a "new function", then speciation will never advance evolution. Data change will not be sufficient. Functional change will also be required. The computers tell me that.
Two things.
First, speciation in and of itself does not produce new function. This also requires mutation and selection. Speciation produces divergence, two lineages that move in different evolutionary trajectories.
Secondly, why do you think that humans and chimps look different? What is the explanation for the difference in physiology and morphology? It's the difference in DNA, is it not? If changing the DNA can lead to different morphology then how is it impossible for mutation and selection to produce humans and chimps from a common ancestor?
Edited by Taq, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 161 by pcver, posted 04-20-2009 8:28 AM pcver has not replied

  
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