Dawkins and "The Great Tim Tebow Fallacy" (re: pro-life advertisement)

It has nothing to do with whether abortion is "okay."It has everything to do with whether I or society as a whle has the right to make choices for women. That is the only issue. Whether the State has the right to fore a woman to undergo pregnancy, with all of the emotional and mental trauma that implies, the physical risks which include injury, death, and extreme pain, regardless of whether the woman wants to or not.Should I be able to choose for you whether you get to keep a kidney? Do I have the right to force you to give it up, even to save a life? Should society be able to force you to take medication, even if you would choose not to? That's what we're talking about here - a woman's right to be able to choose what to do with her own goddamned body. Whether abortion counts as murder or anything else is secondary to that question.I do not "support" abortion. In a perfect world, they wouldn't be necessary.I do support a woman's right to be able to decide whether to remain pregnant or not, whether to accept medical treatment or not, whether they should be forced to undergo surgery for the sake of a fetus, etc.

Are you simply stating that if it happens naturally it's cool, but if someone makes the decision to end it on their own terms it's not cool? What is the point of that?

According to who?

What purpose would your opinion on morality serve in someone elses life?

I guess I just don't see how it's morally wrong to have an abortion,

I don't assume that at all.

To me, women, who unfortunately make eggs even if they doesn't want to get pregnant, can choose to do to their body whatever they want.

I know if I had to carry that burden I wouldn't want anyone's opinion affecting my decision.

It's growing in their body, how annoying to think someone else can decide what you should do.

The average egg with coitus only works about 1/3 of the time (I'll defer to Straggler's 70% from a better source).Let's see: 14-50, or about 36 years X 13 (full moons) = 468 shots at best. But (you agree?) most of these are lost in The Curse ("only women bleed"), so our problem is how many times - when the Catholic Method is ready, does it actually work? On average, I'll take Straggler's 30%, given the market for Fertilization clinics & even such weird things as Viagra.

So why when it comes to medically aborting these exact same collections of cells that you are so utterly uncaring about when the are aborted naturally do you experience such ire and outrage? What compels you to use terms like kill, murder, human, distinct life and child in the context of a tiny handful of medical abortions whilst you simultaneously couldn’t give a rats testicle about the billions of biologically identical humans being unknowingly flushed down the toilet?

Do you think it would be ethically apropriate to leave all those human beings dying of unintended causes (disease, parasites, accidents, heart attacks. whatever) to their fate?

I think we should attempt to stop the unnecessary death of human beings. I think human life should be valued and that this is the point of both the medical profession and the laws against killing people.

The point is that I apply this value of human life consistently to that which I consider "human". Regardless of whether or not the death is intended or otherwise. Whilst those like Hyro (and I guess yourself) seem to condemn the intentional "killing" of conceptuses whilst being entirely unconcerned by the billions of biologically identical "human lives" flushed down the bog.

It is inconsistent and smacks of having a misguided moral vendetta rather than a genuine concern for human life as you define it to be.

If they think unborn conceptuses are genuine human beings then they should be advocating that medical resources are directed to saving the most human lives. No?

"Fully developed people"? Are you saying some humans are more "human" than others? Gosh CS you are on the verge of an epiphany here!

You claim that they are human beings when objecting to abortion whilst simultaneously being utterly apathetic as to the plight of literally billions of biologically identical entities suffering an identical fate through natural causes.

Why wouldn't they? Unless they too realise that some "humans" are not as human as they are in fact claiming.

The number of unintentional human deaths by natural abortion oustrips the number of medically aborted ones by a colossal factor. If they are primarily out to save lives rather than impose their morality on others and persecute others for their moral choices why do they not embrace that fact and tackle the real cause of "human" death?

Then why don't you point these facts out to Hyro and others who advocate that point of view?

In what sense is it "human" in any way that the billions of biologically identical identities unknowingly flushed into the sewars every day are also "human"? Why are those "humans" not worthy of anything but apathy whilst a trivially miniscule minority that are medically aborted cause such violent consternation?

If billions of toddlers start randomly dying of natural causes do you think anyone would be as blase as they are about billions of conceptuses? "No big deal it's just natural causes. Nobody is intentionally killing them". Would we instead expend all our efforts and resources on the miniscule number of people who set out to intentionally kill toddlers? Or would we put every resource we have into solving the medical problem? Why the massive difference in perspective and emphasis between natural and intentional in the two cases?

Because in reality even the pro-lifers don't really give a shit about the fate of a conceptus in the way that they do about real babies and toddlers. They just use that as an excuse to impose their self righteous moral nonsense on others.

If they think unborn conceptuses are genuine human beings then they should be advocating that medical resources are directed to saving the most human lives. No?

Then how does that make them pro-life?

Seem like they're just pro-controlling what people do.