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Author Topic:   Proof of evolution!!!
Guido Arbia
Member (Idle past 233 days)
Posts: 548
From: n/a
Joined: 01-19-2004


Message 1 of 110 (263851)
11-28-2005 5:17 PM


Read this whole thing first, then decide to promote or not:

Hello, I am an alien, and I have come to earth recently after seeing a horrendus explosion destroy half the human race. I have come with archeologist who have dug up some interesting objects.

What we found was mind boggling.

We picked up complicated, and structured objects made of silicon that tramsit electricity to perform calculations. It was unbelievable. But I knew that humans couldn't have created it, even though it seemed pretty convincing.

Just because it looked like an intellegent design didn't mean it was. So I had a theory, this computer evolved from simple forms. In order to proove my theory I had to find these simpler forms.

As we dug deeper and deeper we did indeed find simpler computers. Unbelievable!!! My theory had so much evidence now!!! We found a Comadore 64 preceeding long before the Gate way. We knew that the commadore much have progressed over trillions of years of Natural Selection into a Gateway! I mean DUH!!!

We found knifes, and simpler knifes and simpler knifes. Some were made of rock. It was obvious that evolution took place. At first I was foolish enough to believe that the computer was intellegently designed, but after much research we have concluded that since the humans are too stupid to have created the computer and since we have overwelming evidence of its evolution that it has indeed evolved from the calculator, which evolved from an even simpler device.

OMG LIKE EVOLUTION IS SO TRUE!!!!!!!


Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by AdminNWR, posted 11-28-2005 5:34 PM Guido Arbia has responded
 Message 10 by arachnophilia, posted 11-28-2005 10:11 PM Guido Arbia has not yet responded
 Message 11 by randman, posted 11-29-2005 2:01 AM Guido Arbia has not yet responded
 Message 13 by Modulous, posted 11-29-2005 3:00 AM Guido Arbia has not yet responded
 Message 14 by PaulK, posted 11-29-2005 3:01 AM Guido Arbia has not yet responded
 Message 16 by Dr Jack, posted 11-29-2005 5:51 AM Guido Arbia has not yet responded
 Message 101 by travis1986, posted 12-05-2005 9:24 PM Guido Arbia has not yet responded

  
AdminNWR
Inactive Member


Message 2 of 110 (263858)
11-28-2005 5:34 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Guido Arbia
11-28-2005 5:17 PM


What position will you be defending?
This looks like a reasonable topic for Forum Intelligent Design. I hope that is what you intended.

I expect that some people will be arguing that biological organisms are very different from digital electronic equipment, and that while there may be a good case to be made that digital electronics is designed, the inference does not carry over to biological organisms.

Can I assume you will be arguing that the inference does carry over? Will you be able to defend that position?


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  • This message is a reply to:
     Message 1 by Guido Arbia, posted 11-28-2005 5:17 PM Guido Arbia has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 3 by Guido Arbia, posted 11-28-2005 8:11 PM AdminNWR has not yet responded

      
    Guido Arbia
    Member (Idle past 233 days)
    Posts: 548
    From: n/a
    Joined: 01-19-2004


    Message 3 of 110 (263925)
    11-28-2005 8:11 PM
    Reply to: Message 2 by AdminNWR
    11-28-2005 5:34 PM


    Re: What position will you be defending?
    Yes I will be defending intellegent design.

    Let them argue as they will.


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 2 by AdminNWR, posted 11-28-2005 5:34 PM AdminNWR has not yet responded

      
    AdminNWR
    Inactive Member


    Message 4 of 110 (263929)
    11-28-2005 8:27 PM


    Thread moved here from the Proposed New Topics forum.
      
    crashfrog
    Inactive Member


    Message 5 of 110 (263930)
    11-28-2005 8:31 PM


    Do computers self-replicate?

    Oh, no, they don't?

    Well, thread's over. Guido loses again. WTFPWND!!! Oh noes!!!!11!1oneone!! Bad analogies FTL!


    Replies to this message:
     Message 6 by Guido Arbia, posted 11-28-2005 8:46 PM crashfrog has not yet responded
     Message 7 by Guido Arbia, posted 11-28-2005 8:49 PM crashfrog has responded

      
    Guido Arbia
    Member (Idle past 233 days)
    Posts: 548
    From: n/a
    Joined: 01-19-2004


    Message 6 of 110 (263935)
    11-28-2005 8:46 PM
    Reply to: Message 5 by crashfrog
    11-28-2005 8:31 PM


    Your just jelous cuz I won that other argument.
    This message is a reply to:
     Message 5 by crashfrog, posted 11-28-2005 8:31 PM crashfrog has not yet responded

      
    Guido Arbia
    Member (Idle past 233 days)
    Posts: 548
    From: n/a
    Joined: 01-19-2004


    Message 7 of 110 (263937)
    11-28-2005 8:49 PM
    Reply to: Message 5 by crashfrog
    11-28-2005 8:31 PM


    Just as things made of sillicon do not link up and form next generation composites, protiens do not have this ability.

    The first cell must already exist before it can replicate.


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 5 by crashfrog, posted 11-28-2005 8:31 PM crashfrog has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 8 by Omnivorous, posted 11-28-2005 9:06 PM Guido Arbia has responded
     Message 9 by crashfrog, posted 11-28-2005 9:10 PM Guido Arbia has responded

      
    Omnivorous
    Member (Idle past 866 days)
    Posts: 3808
    From: Adirondackia
    Joined: 07-21-2005


    Message 8 of 110 (263940)
    11-28-2005 9:06 PM
    Reply to: Message 7 by Guido Arbia
    11-28-2005 8:49 PM


    guido writes:

    The first cell must already exist before it can replicate.

    The first replicator need not be a cell.

    You've lost twice in 8 posts.


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 7 by Guido Arbia, posted 11-28-2005 8:49 PM Guido Arbia has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 20 by Guido Arbia, posted 11-29-2005 6:15 PM Omnivorous has responded

        
    crashfrog
    Inactive Member


    Message 9 of 110 (263941)
    11-28-2005 9:10 PM
    Reply to: Message 7 by Guido Arbia
    11-28-2005 8:49 PM


    Just as things made of sillicon do not link up and form next generation composites, protiens do not have this ability.

    Says you. The truth, of course, is exactly the opposite. Not only do proteins self-assemble in the cell, classes of proteins exist that assemble copies of themselves from other protein sequences.

    But, just like a creationist, you've moved the goalposts. You lost the argument about evolution in the space of a single post, so naturally you're trying to move the argument to abiogenesis.

    I mean, I fuckin' took you out. In a single stroke, in an instant, like a Toshiro Mifune movie. I carved your post up like an Easter ham. So, naturally, you're trying to pretend that your humiliating defeat didn't just happen, and that it was your intent to talk about abiogenesis all along. Well, tough titties. You don't have what it takes to win there, either. And this isn't the thread or forum for it. You should have specified that the biochemical origins of life was your subject from the beginning. But that blunder has cost you dearly, indeed.

    Here's what I just did to you. Pretend that you're watching from the point of view of your argument.

    I'm sorry, am I bragging too much? There's not really much else to do in this thread. It's ridiculous that it was even promoted in the first place. Move it to the coffeehouse; no serious discussion is going to happen here.


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 7 by Guido Arbia, posted 11-28-2005 8:49 PM Guido Arbia has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 19 by Guido Arbia, posted 11-29-2005 6:10 PM crashfrog has responded

      
    arachnophilia
    Member
    Posts: 9069
    From: god's waiting room
    Joined: 05-21-2004


    Message 10 of 110 (263958)
    11-28-2005 10:11 PM
    Reply to: Message 1 by Guido Arbia
    11-28-2005 5:17 PM


    shopping.

    selection.

    same thing.


    אָרַח

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 1 by Guido Arbia, posted 11-28-2005 5:17 PM Guido Arbia has not yet responded

      
    randman 
    Suspended Member (Idle past 2798 days)
    Posts: 6367
    Joined: 05-26-2005


    Message 11 of 110 (263993)
    11-29-2005 2:01 AM
    Reply to: Message 1 by Guido Arbia
    11-28-2005 5:17 PM


    interesting discussion of data
    I notice no detractors really took on the OP and the issue of who would someone interpret the data if they assumed Intelligent Design could not exist in the first place.
    This message is a reply to:
     Message 1 by Guido Arbia, posted 11-28-2005 5:17 PM Guido Arbia has not yet responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 12 by Phat, posted 11-29-2005 2:51 AM randman has not yet responded

      
    Phat
    Member
    Posts: 11160
    From: Denver,Colorado USA
    Joined: 12-30-2003
    Member Rating: 1.2


    Message 12 of 110 (263996)
    11-29-2005 2:51 AM
    Reply to: Message 11 by randman
    11-29-2005 2:01 AM


    Proof of intelligent Aliens?
    Guidosoft writes:

    Hello, I am an alien, and I have come to earth recently after seeing a horrendus explosion destroy half the human race. I have come with archeologists who have dug up some interesting objects.

    Hey Alien! Yo..wassup? You seem to know English quite well! I wanna find out more about what planet you are from!
    Guido, the Alien writes:

    What we found was mind boggling!
    We picked up complicated and structured objects made of silicon that transmit electricity to perform calculations.

    Those are known as calculators.
    Alien writes:

    Pretty interesting how they were created! There is some speculation... It was unbelievable. But I knew that humans couldn't have created it, even though it seemed pretty convincing.

    Why not, alien?
    Alien writes:

    Just because it looked like an intellegent design didn't mean it was. So I had a theory, this computer evolved from simple forms. In order to prove my theory I had to find these simpler forms.

    You mean that calculator we found? Sheeesh!
    Guido/alien writes:

    As we dug deeper and deeper we did indeed find simpler computers. Unbelievable!!! My theory had so much evidence now!!! We found a Comadore 64 preceeding long before the Gate way. We knew that the commadore much have progressed over trillions of years of Natural Selection into a Gateway! I mean DUH!!!

    Aliens say "Duh"? Wow! :rolleyes:
    Guido/Alien writes:

    We found knifes, and simpler knifes and simpler knifes. Some were made of rock. It was obvious that evolution took place. At first I was foolish enough to believe that the computer was intellegently designed, but after much research we have concluded that since the humans are too stupid to have created the computer and since we have overwelming evidence of its evolution that it has indeed evolved from the calculator, which evolved from an even simpler device.

    OK, Alien! You have made your point.
    NWR writes:

    I expect that some people will be arguing that biological organisms are very different from digital electronic equipment, and that while there may be a good case to be made that digital electronics is designed, the inference does not carry over to biological organisms.


    Guido, now not an Alien writes:

    Let them argue as they will. Just as things made of silicon do not link up and form next generation composites, protiens do not have this ability.
    The first cell must already exist before it can replicate.


    Omnivorous writes:

    The first replicator need not be a cell.

    This message has been edited by Phat, 11-29-2005 03:39 AM


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 11 by randman, posted 11-29-2005 2:01 AM randman has not yet responded

      
    Modulous
    Member (Idle past 3 days)
    Posts: 7789
    From: Manchester, UK
    Joined: 05-01-2005


    Message 13 of 110 (263998)
    11-29-2005 3:00 AM
    Reply to: Message 1 by Guido Arbia
    11-28-2005 5:17 PM


    Evolved
    Yes, computers have evolved, they have changed over time. You, mr alien, have made a valid inference. Some aliens have suggested that all computers were created at the same time by humans, and that the sun went supernova for 40 days (this they claim was the reported explosion, despite there being evidence of a massive string of nuclear detonations on the earth surface), sorting the computer remains (indeed all remains) into perfect order before the supernova cooled down and the sun went normal again.

    So congratulations for not invoking the magic sun hypothesis.

    Now, you need to develop a Theory for your inferred phenomenon of computers changing throughout time. I doubt its going to be the same as the biological theory of evolution (which you are trying to lampoon), you don't even have the starting observations of Darwin, no reproduction, no fecundity, no population stasis, no heredity. There are also no later observations, there is no mechanism that one computer can use to pass its design onto offspring. If you dig through the dirt long enough you'll also find computer factories, blueprints and design specifications. Perhaps you'll even find a computer that has not been fully built yet, a tremendous aid to your research.

    I would say the evidence would clearly point to advanced tools of an advanced organism as a starting point for a theory.


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 1 by Guido Arbia, posted 11-28-2005 5:17 PM Guido Arbia has not yet responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 36 by Darkmatic, posted 11-30-2005 9:41 AM Modulous has not yet responded
     Message 51 by bkelly, posted 11-30-2005 9:29 PM Modulous has responded

      
    PaulK
    Member
    Posts: 14349
    Joined: 01-10-2003
    Member Rating: 1.6


    Message 14 of 110 (263999)
    11-29-2005 3:01 AM
    Reply to: Message 1 by Guido Arbia
    11-28-2005 5:17 PM


    The OP does not actually look like a serious attempt at an argument. Nevertheless sicne a serious answer has been requested here it is.

    While the fossil record demolished the old idea of "fixity of species" it was not the key ptoof of evolution.

    Evolutionary theory succeeded for the following reasons whcih are not strongly related to the fossil record:

    1) It explained why taxonomy formed a nested hierarchy

    2) Most importantly it explained biogeography. Both Darwin and Wallace did signiicant work in this area - and that is no coincidence.

    3) There was a workable explanation based on observation

    None of these applies to the example in the original post. Thus the OP does not come even close to representing the reasoning behind the acceptance of evolution.


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 1 by Guido Arbia, posted 11-28-2005 5:17 PM Guido Arbia has not yet responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 15 by mark24, posted 11-29-2005 5:37 AM PaulK has responded

        
    mark24
    Member (Idle past 3094 days)
    Posts: 3857
    From: UK
    Joined: 12-01-2001


    Message 15 of 110 (264014)
    11-29-2005 5:37 AM
    Reply to: Message 14 by PaulK
    11-29-2005 3:01 AM


    Not to mention reproduction with variation.
    This message is a reply to:
     Message 14 by PaulK, posted 11-29-2005 3:01 AM PaulK has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 17 by PaulK, posted 11-29-2005 6:16 AM mark24 has not yet responded

        
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