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Author Topic:   Should we teach both evolution and religion in school?
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 1893
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 3.0


Message 1291 of 1321 (844098)
11-25-2018 12:15 PM
Reply to: Message 1289 by creation
11-25-2018 3:34 AM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
I daresay I think you have NO remains of any man before the flood, or even shortly after it. Your dates are wrong.

What you think does not change reality. So far you have not presented a shred of evidence to support your fantasy.


What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1289 by creation, posted 11-25-2018 3:34 AM creation has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1294 by creation, posted 11-26-2018 1:09 PM Tanypteryx has responded

    
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 1893
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 3.0


(1)
Message 1292 of 1321 (844100)
11-25-2018 12:29 PM
Reply to: Message 1290 by creation
11-25-2018 3:36 AM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
When pictures are drawn, for example of the Cambrian world, we do not see lions and man and birds...etc etc.

What do we see? Animals that all lived in a marine habitat. Land plants had not evolved yet. No mammals, no birds, no land animals lived during the Cambrian. No etc etc ever walked the Cambrian world.

Face it. Those things lived at the time. Be honest about the sick models science posits of the past!

Be honest, you just pulled that out of your ass. Your imaginary, fictional fantasy is based on nothing but BS.

We have evidence, you have bullshit. You need to up your game, so far all you demonstrate is your ignorance.


What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1290 by creation, posted 11-25-2018 3:36 AM creation has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1296 by creation, posted 11-26-2018 1:14 PM Tanypteryx has responded

    
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19719
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 1293 of 1321 (844147)
11-25-2018 3:29 PM
Reply to: Message 1289 by creation
11-25-2018 3:34 AM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
I daresay I think you have NO remains of any man before the flood, or even shortly after it. ...

Because there was no flood.

Teaching evolution and religion in school should be based on fact, not fantasy.

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1289 by creation, posted 11-25-2018 3:34 AM creation has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1295 by creation, posted 11-26-2018 1:10 PM RAZD has responded

  
creation
Member
Posts: 654
Joined: 01-22-2017


Message 1294 of 1321 (844179)
11-26-2018 1:09 PM
Reply to: Message 1291 by Tanypteryx
11-25-2018 12:15 PM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
You have no evidence for your religious claims of dates that have been labeled science falsely.

Bottom line, any claim that a fossilized or other remains of man is pre flood rests solely on your beliefs of a same nature in the past. Nothing else at all ever.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1291 by Tanypteryx, posted 11-25-2018 12:15 PM Tanypteryx has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1298 by Tanypteryx, posted 11-26-2018 2:06 PM creation has responded

    
creation
Member
Posts: 654
Joined: 01-22-2017


Message 1295 of 1321 (844180)
11-26-2018 1:10 PM
Reply to: Message 1293 by RAZD
11-25-2018 3:29 PM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
There was no big bang, or first lifeform or same nature in the past. Making claims is easy. Why would sane people teach your beliefs??
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1293 by RAZD, posted 11-25-2018 3:29 PM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1297 by RAZD, posted 11-26-2018 1:56 PM creation has responded

    
creation
Member
Posts: 654
Joined: 01-22-2017


Message 1296 of 1321 (844181)
11-26-2018 1:14 PM
Reply to: Message 1292 by Tanypteryx
11-25-2018 12:29 PM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
Exactly, a strange world where most life here did not yet exist, but only the fossilized creatures from which all future life had to have evolved!

That is not the way the bible says things happened. Man and animals and birds were here also. They just could not leave fossilized remains, most likely! That was the way it was back in that former nature for whatever reasons.

From dust early man was made, and to dust apparently (rather than fossilized remains) he returned!!!!!!


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1292 by Tanypteryx, posted 11-25-2018 12:29 PM Tanypteryx has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1299 by Tanypteryx, posted 11-26-2018 2:27 PM creation has not yet responded
 Message 1300 by edge, posted 11-26-2018 11:49 PM creation has responded

    
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19719
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 1297 of 1321 (844190)
11-26-2018 1:56 PM
Reply to: Message 1295 by creation
11-26-2018 1:10 PM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
There was no big bang, or first lifeform or same nature in the past. Making claims is easy. ...

Says the person making up claims: you should know.

Developing conclusions from evidence not so easy, as you should also know, because there is an absence of evidence for your assertions -- you can't find any ... so you try to make it up.

... Why would sane people teach your beliefs??

Because they are conclusions based on evidence, not mere belief, and sane people can look at the evidence and decide that the conclusions are valid.

This is the kind of thing that needs to be taught: how to tell fact from fantasy, how to use evidence to support your arguments, how to apply rational thinking to the issues.

Again, you are a poster child for the empty vapidness that is creationism: pontificating on things you don't have evidence for ... loudly, frequently, as if repetition can change reality;

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1295 by creation, posted 11-26-2018 1:10 PM creation has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1301 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 2:02 AM RAZD has responded

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 1893
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 3.0


(1)
Message 1298 of 1321 (844191)
11-26-2018 2:06 PM
Reply to: Message 1294 by creation
11-26-2018 1:09 PM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
From Message 1291:
Tanypteryx writes:

creation writes:

I daresay I think you have NO remains of any man before the flood, or even shortly after it. Your dates are wrong.

What you think does not change reality. So far you have not presented a shred of evidence to support your fantasy.

How is this an answer to that?

creation writes:

You have no evidence for your religious claims of dates that have been labeled science falsely.

Well, my claim is that you still fail to provide any evidence to support your imaginary, fictitious fantasy.

To clarify things for you, I have made no religious claims, nor any dates that have been labeled science falsely.

creation writes:

Bottom line, any claim that a fossilized or other remains of man is pre flood rests solely on your beliefs of a same nature in the past.

No one is claiming any remains are pre-flood. We are claiming there is not a shred of evidence of your flood. Your flood is fiction. Your beliefs about changes in nature are pure fantasies from your own muddled ignorance, nothing else at all ever.


What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1294 by creation, posted 11-26-2018 1:09 PM creation has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1302 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 2:05 AM Tanypteryx has responded

    
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 1893
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 3.0


(1)
Message 1299 of 1321 (844192)
11-26-2018 2:27 PM
Reply to: Message 1296 by creation
11-26-2018 1:14 PM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
creation writes:

That is not the way the bible says things happened.

The bible says nothing what so ever about the Cambrian. The bible is fiction, so it is not reliable.

creation writes:

Man and animals and birds were here also.

There were lots of species of animals in the Cambrian, but there were no humans or birds in the Cambrian. You are making up pure BS.

creation writes:

They just could not leave fossilized remains, most likely!

More made up BS.

creation writes:

That was the way it was back in that former nature for whatever reasons.

If there was a former nature you would not be able to make any claims about it.

Scientists report what they find in Cambrian deposits and there is no reason to pretend that your imaginary, fictional fantasy former nature is reality.

creation writes:

From dust early man was made, and to dust apparently (rather than fossilized remains) he returned!!!!!!

More made up BS.


What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1296 by creation, posted 11-26-2018 1:14 PM creation has not yet responded

    
edge
Member
Posts: 4450
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002
Member Rating: 2.6


(1)
Message 1300 of 1321 (844229)
11-26-2018 11:49 PM
Reply to: Message 1296 by creation
11-26-2018 1:14 PM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
From dust early man was made, and to dust apparently (rather than fossilized remains) he returned!!!!!!

And all human tools, buildings, footprints, artwork, gardens, and livestock?

All mysteriously went to dust, right?

For ... "whatever reason".

Sure, I can believe that.

When pigs fly.

Oh, wait! They DID fly in the previous state! I forgot ...

Once again, your logic is overwhelming.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1296 by creation, posted 11-26-2018 1:14 PM creation has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1303 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 2:14 AM edge has not yet responded

  
creation
Member
Posts: 654
Joined: 01-22-2017


Message 1301 of 1321 (844233)
11-27-2018 2:02 AM
Reply to: Message 1297 by RAZD
11-26-2018 1:56 PM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
Mere belief foisted on evidences is all you have shown you are able to do actually. Further pretense is in vain.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1297 by RAZD, posted 11-26-2018 1:56 PM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1304 by RAZD, posted 11-27-2018 7:41 AM creation has responded

    
creation
Member
Posts: 654
Joined: 01-22-2017


Message 1302 of 1321 (844234)
11-27-2018 2:05 AM
Reply to: Message 1298 by Tanypteryx
11-26-2018 2:06 PM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
All science claims about origins are religious claims. It is those 'science' claims here that must be supported. Not other beliefs!

There is all sorts of evidence for the past events you deny. Both the science evidences that you have misunderstood and contorted and violated, as well as historical, and Scriptural.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1298 by Tanypteryx, posted 11-26-2018 2:06 PM Tanypteryx has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1305 by Tanypteryx, posted 11-27-2018 12:35 PM creation has responded

    
creation
Member
Posts: 654
Joined: 01-22-2017


Message 1303 of 1321 (844235)
11-27-2018 2:14 AM
Reply to: Message 1300 by edge
11-26-2018 11:49 PM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
The thing is that after the flood was when the nature change likely came! That was possibly responsible for the tectonic changes that moved continents, uplift, mountain building, ice age, and more! Add to this the great changes and destruction of the flood year and we are left with the startling realization that what is the surface of the earth today may not represent any sort of reflection of what the earth and life was like before this.

Former cities could now be miles under the earth, or under mountain ranges...etc etc. That is exactly what I assume happened to the tower of Babel actually, and why we don't see it today.

Then there was God's clean up plan in the flood year, that I assume dealt with the dead bodies somehow, perhaps partially by some chemical processes in the water! ( as well as likely by organic ways, and new instinctual/dietary habits of animals and bugs, etc etc) I sometimes wonder if the iridium we see in the KT layer might be somehow a remnant of the chemical reactions?

[since we will again see nature similar to what it was in the former nature times in the future according to the bible, we can expect dietary changes n animals again!]

Nowthen, since the nature change came after the flood presumably, that also was when man and animals and even many plants started to be able to leave remains!!! That fits the evidence!

Edited by creation, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1300 by edge, posted 11-26-2018 11:49 PM edge has not yet responded

    
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19719
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 1304 of 1321 (844246)
11-27-2018 7:41 AM
Reply to: Message 1301 by creation
11-27-2018 2:02 AM


One Trick Pony
Mere belief foisted on evidences is all you have shown you are able to do actually. Further pretense is in vain.

We have reviewed your thesis and reject it for the following reasons:

The effort you've put into researching and documenting the evidence to substantiate your thesis is grossly insufficient for a school program based on facts.

Repeating the same assertions without reference to facts is indiscernible from delusion, and has no place in school.

You basic thesis provides nothing for educational value in schools, it leads nowhere. There is insufficient information provided to base a study plan for even a single class period.

Please review these comments and make changes if you want your thesis to be accepted for school use -- as anything other than a bad example.

Enjoy

Edited by RAZD, : .


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1301 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 2:02 AM creation has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1307 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 4:42 PM RAZD has responded

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 1893
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 3.0


Message 1305 of 1321 (844267)
11-27-2018 12:35 PM
Reply to: Message 1302 by creation
11-27-2018 2:05 AM


Re: Conclusion vs Assumption, Belief, teach the difference
creation writes:

All science claims about origins are religious claims.

Can you list all the science claims about origins? You would need to do that if you are teaching that in the classroom.

creation writes:

It is those 'science' claims here that must be supported.

Especially if you are going to teach them in the classroom.

creation writes:

Not other beliefs!

Beliefs have no place in science classes.

creation writes:

There is all sorts of evidence for the past events you deny.

Well, then you should be able to present it to the class. You keep making empty claims about evidence, but the students would laugh you out of the class if you showed them what you claim is evidence.

creation writes:

Both the science evidences that you have misunderstood and contorted and violated,

I have not seen that you know any of the scientific evidence. I can imagine you in front of the class, "The science evidences are misunderstood and contorted and violated. The goat herders knew about stuff."

creation writes:

as well as historical, and Scriptural.

You have already demonstrated that you have no knowledge of history or scripture. Scripture is fiction and and only should be taught in lit class.


What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1302 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 2:05 AM creation has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1306 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 4:40 PM Tanypteryx has responded

    
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