EvC Forum: Creation as presented in Genesis chapters 1 and 2

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Topic: Creation as presented in Genesis chapters 1 and 2

ICANT

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Message 42 of 607 (560324)
05-14-2010 11:15 AM

Reply to: Message 40 by Peg
05-14-2010 6:12 AM

Re: Yom

Hi Peg,

Peg writes:

he fact that Moses mentioned the 7th day along with the previous 6 should tell you that there must have been an evening and morning to it if those days are really literal. The fact that there is no evening and morning to that day should tell everyone that the previous 6 should not be taken literally.

So if I killed a person a day for 6 days and did not kill one on saturday the 7th day that would mean I did not kill any of them.

Peg writes:

the light and the dark periods were one day, just as the light itself was a day and just as the entire 6 days were one day (2:4)

Did the universe exist prior to Genesis 1:2?

Did light exist in the universe prior to Genesis 1:2?

In Message 34 you said:

Peg writes:

There was light in the universe, but not on the earth as genesis 1.2. tellls us "there was darkness upon the surface of the waters

how could there be darkness? Perhaps because the earth was covered by a thick blanket of atmosphere that did not allow light to penetrate.

If the heaven and the earth was created in Genesis 1:1, how could it be created in six days as put forth in your statement?

Peg writes:

further all-of days-of theearth seedtime andharvest andcold andwarmth andsummerandwinter andday andnight not they-shall-cease

days-of theearth is that one 24 hour period or a plural of 24 hour periods?

day andnight Is this the subject of the 24 hour period that will not cease for all those hour periods?

Peg writes:

So its not with regard to 'time' but the yom in this verse is actually refering to seasons, to heat, to cold, to day and to night which is showing how Yom is used figuratively. Its not always with regard to a 24 hour day as we know it.

Can you give your logic or reasoning and source in Numbers 11:31 where it mentions seasons, heat, and cold?

Are you asserting that this verse says there is an extended day that lasts for and undetermined length of time?

Peg writes:

The earth began in darkness/evening which is why the hebrews began their day in darkness in acknowledgement of the God as the creator.

Was the earth created in Genesis 1:2?

Peg writes:

and this account shows that the quails were being driven by the wind that length up into the air... it is speaking about distance.

So was the distance measured by the length of the day?
or
Was the distance measured by the distance a man could walk in a day which equals a days journey?

Peg writes:

You believe the earth was created in 6 literal days and no amount of evidence to the contrary is going to change that so i'll just leave it there.

But I do not now nor have I ever believed the universe was created in 6 days.

The heaven and the earth was created in Genesis 1:1 and according to Genesis 2:4 which you referenced it was created in one day.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

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	Message 40 by Peg, posted 05-14-2010 6:12 AM		Peg has not replied

ICANT

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Message 44 of 607 (560332)
05-14-2010 12:05 PM

Reply to: Message 41 by Philip
05-14-2010 9:38 AM

Re: Gen 1:21

Hi Philip,

Philip writes:

I Trust my older bible(s), a major creation/design event took place on the 5th day before God rested from all the works. Even the Alexandrian bibles (many listed below) ... state not just sea monsters.

You got some real oldies there.

The oldest Genesis being the Douay-Rheims Bible translated from the Latin Vulgate the NT in 1584, Genesis to Job in 1609, and the rest in 1610.

The KJV was begun in 1604 and finished in 1611.

Never the less Genesis 1:20 says:

Moses writes:

1:20 And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.

God commanded the waters to bring forth abundantly the moving creatures that hath life. Fowl that may fly.

Did God have Moses record a lie in verse 20?

Moses writes:

1:21 And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

If the living creature that moveth and fowl were brought forth in verse 20, why would they be bara created in verse 21?

I would contend that was some copist inserting his bias, but forgetting to remove verse 20.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

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	Message 41 by Philip, posted 05-14-2010 9:38 AM		Philip has not replied

ICANT

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Message 45 of 607 (560336)
05-14-2010 12:33 PM

Anyone care to Refute ?

In Message 36 I presented the following things I know because Genesis states the following things.

ICANT writes:

I know from verse 1 the heaven and the earth was (bara) created.

I know from verse 2 it had become uninhabitable as it was covered with water.

I know from verse 3 God caused light to be on the earth. It says nothing about Him (bara) creating the light. He just made it visible.

I know from verse 4 God divided the light from the darkness. It was dark on half of the earth and light on the other half of the earth.

I know from verse 5 God called the light day and the darkness night. It also tells me a light period and a dark period equals one day.

The light period of Genesis 1:1 and the dark period that ended with the light period of the second day was declared the first day.

I know from verse 6, 7, and 8 that God separated the waters from the uplifted waters and called that atmosphere heaven. This is where the birds and our airplanes fly.

I know from verse 8 the light period that began with the end of the dark period of the first day and ended with the light period of the third day was the second day.

I know from verse 9 that God caused all the water to gather in one place and let dry land appear as it is shown in my avatar.

I know from verse 10 that God called the dry land earth and the water sea.

So far nothing has been created only rearranged.

I know from verse 11 that God had the earth bring forth grass, herbs, and fruit trees, from their seed which was upon the earth.

I know from verse 12 that the earth obeyed and produced grass, herbs, and fruit trees.

I know from verse 13 the light period that began with the end of the dark period of the second day and ended with the light period of the fourth day was the third day.

I know from verse 14 and 15 that God caused visible lights in the heavens to be for signs and seasons, days and years and to give light upon the earth.

I know from verse 16, 17 and 18 that God caused two great lights to be visible on earth one to rule the day and one to rule the night. He also caused the stars to be visible on earth.

Still nothing has been (bara) created they were only made visible on earth.

I know from verse 19 the light period that began with the end of the dark period of the third day and ended with the light period of the fifth day was the fourth day.

I know from verse 20 that God caused the waters to bring forth water creatures and fowl to fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.

Still nothing (bara) created.

I know from verse 21 that God (bara) created great whales.

The first thing created that was not created in Genesis 1:1.

I know from verse 22 that God blessed them and told them to multiply and fill the waters and the fowl to multiply on the earth.

I know from verse 23 the light period that began with the end of the dark period of the fourth day and ended with the light period of the sixth day was the fifth day.

I know from verse 24 and 25 God called the living creature, cattle, creeping things, and beasts of the earth after their kind. That means they had already existed to come forth after their kind.

I know from verse 26 and 27 that God (bara) created mankind in His image male and female He created them. Did He create 2 or a thousand there is no way to know as the scripture does not say. He gave mankind dominion over the creatures on earth.

I know from verse 28 God blessed them and told them to be fruitful and multiply and replenish the earth and subdue it.

I know from verse 29 that God told them they could eat of every herb bearing seed and every tree that yielded fruit with a seed. No fruit of any tree was forbiden to mankind.

I know from verse 30 that the fowl of the air and every thing that creepeth on the earth that every green herb was given for meat.

I know from verse 31 the light period that began with the end of the dark period of the fifth day and ended with the light period of the seventh day was the sixth day.

On to chapter 2.

I know from verse 1 everything was finished.

I know from verse 2 that God ceased His preparing and furnishing the earth. God had completed His creative work.

I know from verse 3 that God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it. By ceasing His work.

I am affirming all of the things listed above as what Moses recorded in Genesis 1:1 through Genesis 2:3.

If you disagree with what I have affirmed please present your rebuttal for discussion.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

Replies to this message:
	Message 46 by purpledawn, posted 05-14-2010 3:26 PM		ICANT has replied

ICANT

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Message 47 of 607 (560366)
05-14-2010 5:21 PM

Reply to: Message 46 by purpledawn
05-14-2010 3:26 PM

Re: Anyone care to Refute ?

Hi PD,

prpledawn writes:

As I said in Message 27, what if Genesis 1 was written in a reverse apocalyptic language?

What if a frog had wings? He wouldn't bump his tail everytime he hopped.

I have spent much time conversing with Mr Jeff Vaughn at their web site you can probaly find me there.

I presented the same things there and gave them the opportunity to refute what the Bible says. They did like Peg does jumped up on their stump waveing their hands and shouting their beliefs. Which did not exist before the Reformation period.

Have you studied Preterist beliefs?

They have to ignore a lot of the Bible.

purpledawn writes:

At that time erets doesn't encompass the planet, so the creation aspect isn't necessarily more than a local issue.

Are you saying erets in Genesis 1:1 is not the earth?

purpledawn writes:

I've have no major quibble with your natural reading of the story, but it is an intriguing thought when viewing the story through apocalyptic symbolism.

Are you saying that the verse by verse presentation is what the KJV Bible literally says?

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

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	Message 46 by purpledawn, posted 05-14-2010 3:26 PM		purpledawn has replied

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	Message 50 by purpledawn, posted 05-15-2010 6:29 AM		ICANT has not replied

ICANT

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Message 52 of 607 (560522)
05-15-2010 6:57 PM

Reply to: Message 48 by Philip
05-14-2010 6:23 PM

The Genesis 1:1 Creation

Hi Philip,

Philip writes:

While God speaks as a YEC ... I am not glorified enough to understand the true science of it.

Where does God speak as a YEC?

God said He created the heaven and the earth in the beginning.

When was the beginning?

When did Genesis 1:1 take place? The Bible says in the beginning.

Some scientist tells us it was 13.7 billion years ago. Others tell us it was 20 billion years ago. Still others tell us there has been a progression of expansions which ended in collapses that have been going on for eternity.

Philip writes:

God appears to oversimplify Genesis 1.1 for my sanity's sake: Your/my creationist schemes may contain personal viewpoints and faith-hypotheses to fill in the Gen 1.1-2 gap(s) ... that sync with the scriptures but have a personal significance.

Genesis 1:1 is not simple as the history (generations) are declared to begin in Genesis 2:4.

Moses writes:

Genesis 2:4 These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,

I know from this verse that the following things are the history of the creation of the heaven and the earth in Genesis 1:1.

I know from Genesis 1:1 That the heaven and the earth was created in the beginning. It was already in existence when Genesis 1:2 took place. Therefore it was not created during the 6 days described in Genesis 1:2-31.

Verse 4 of chapter 2 is the beginning of the history of what happened in the day (light period) the heaven and the earth was created.

I know from verse 5 there was no life on earth. There was no man, plant, tree, or herb of the field and it had not rained on the earth.

I know from verse 6 God caused the earth to be water from a mist that came from underground.

I know from verse 7 the first life form on earth was man that God formed a man of the dust of the ground.
I also know God breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and that man became a living being.

I know from verse 8 Eden existed and God planted a garden eastward in Eden. God then put the man in this garden.

I know from verse 9 God caused every tree that is pleasant to the sight and good for food to grow. He also provided the tree of life and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

I know from verse 10 that a river went out of Eden to water the garden. After watering the garden it divided into 4 rivers.
I know from verses 11-14 some information about these rivers. I don't know the purpose of these verses.

I know from verse 15 that God gave the man He had formed from the dust of the ground a job. He was to dress the garden and keep it.

I know from verses 16 and 17 that the man was told he could eat of every tree of the garden except he could not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

I also know that he was told if he did eat of that tree he would die the same day. It does not say if God explained what death was but since God is just He had to explain it to the man.

I know from verse 18 God said it was not good for man to be alone and He said He would make him an help meet.

I know from verse 19 God formed every animal and every fowl from the ground. He then brought them to the man to see what he would call them.

I know from verse 20 the man gave names to all cattle, all fowl, and the beast of the field. But God had not made a help meet for the man yet.

I know from verse 21 God removed a rib from the man.

I know from verse 22 God cloned a woman from the rib He had taken from the man, and brought her to him.

That concluded the creation events recorded in this history. But there is much history left.

I know from verse 23 that the man said this is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh and that she would be called woman.

I know from verse 24 the man said because of this man will leave home and cleave to his wife and they shall be one flesh.

I know from verse 25 they were naked and were not ashamed. They lived in perfect inn once.

I know at this time there had been no water creatures created.

I know at this time there is no mention of seas.

I know that this is the record of what happened in Genesis 1:1 as Genesis 2:4 declares that it is.

Thus I have described here a creation that is covered in Chapter 2.

There are several noticeable differences in the stories found in the two chapters, therefore they can not be the same event.

In chapter 2 man was the first life form created from the dust of the ground, placed in a garden and told he could eat the fruit from all trees but one.

In chapter 1 man and woman is created at the same time after all other creatures and vegetation, they were never placed in a garden. They were never commanded not to eat the fruit of any tree. If fact they were told they could eat fruit of all the trees. They were blessed and told to be fruitful and multiply and replenish the earth.

In chapter 2 all creatures were formed from the ground. In chapter 1 all creatures (except water creatures and man who were created) were called from the ground after their kind.

In chapter 2 all vegetation was called forth from the earth. In chapter 1 all vegetation was called forth from the seed that was in the ground.

In chapter 2 the earth only had a river that divided into 4 that watered the earth. In chapter 2 the earth was covered with water.

The events in chapter 2 took place at the beginning.

The events that took place in chapter 1 beginning at verse 2 took place some 6,000 years ago.

But there is the objection it is just two stories of the same events that was recorded by two different people.

The problem with that is that God only told the story to Moses. Nobody believes that Moses wrote anything as he was too uneducated to be able to write besides he had nothing to write on.

Well Moses was one of the best educated men of his day as he was educated in Pharaoh's house with all the amenities of such a position.

Well he didn't have anything to write on. Since the children of Israel had just spent 400 years making clay bricks for the Egyptians why would they have a problem making clay tablets for Moses to write on.

We are told in Exodus chapter 24 that Moses wrote all the words of the Lord. All these things were to be read every seven years and rehearsed among the people.

So there is no problem with who wrote the first books of the Bible as far as God's children are concerned. Others may have all kinds of problems with the Bible because it is foolishness to them.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

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	Message 48 by Philip, posted 05-14-2010 6:23 PM		Philip has not replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 53 by Straggler, posted 05-15-2010 7:11 PM		ICANT has replied

ICANT

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Message 54 of 607 (560528)
05-15-2010 7:38 PM

Reply to: Message 53 by Straggler
05-15-2010 7:11 PM

Re: The Genesis 1:1 Creation

Hi Straggler,

Straggler writes:

Are you saying man was created twice?

When you put it that way, yes.

The one in Genesis 2:7 was formed from the dust of the ground in the beginning whenever that was.

The one I call modern man created in the image of God in Genesis 1:27 somewhere around 6,000 years ago.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
	Message 53 by Straggler, posted 05-15-2010 7:11 PM		Straggler has replied

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	Message 55 by Straggler, posted 05-15-2010 7:46 PM		ICANT has replied

ICANT

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Message 56 of 607 (560540)
05-15-2010 9:06 PM

Reply to: Message 55 by Straggler
05-15-2010 7:46 PM

Re: The Genesis 1:1 Creation

Hi Straggler,

Straggler writes:

ICANT even by the high standards of creationists you hold some very weird views.

It took you this long to figure that out.

I have never claimed to be your run of the mill YEC creationist or the run of the mill OEC.

I am just me.

Straggler writes:

Any clue as to when at all? Were these first humans the same as we know humans to be now?

When? No Where? Yes earth. Were they the same as us? No, the scripture does not say they were created in the image of God.

If the universe has imploded 1 time or several times it was when the first universe began to exist.

Opp's that means there would be no trace of them wouldn't it.

Then it could have happened 1000's of times and we were not told as we do not need to know.

Eternity to us is a very long time.

Straggler writes:

That is the Adam and Eve ones yeah? The ones we are descended from?

I am not to sure of that as the scripture does not say how many He created. It only says mankind male and female it did not say one man and one woman.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

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	Message 55 by Straggler, posted 05-15-2010 7:46 PM		Straggler has replied

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	Message 58 by Straggler, posted 05-16-2010 10:32 AM		ICANT has replied

ICANT

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Message 59 of 607 (560621)
05-16-2010 1:23 PM

Reply to: Message 58 by Straggler
05-16-2010 10:32 AM

Re: The Genesis 1:1 Creation

Hi Straggler,

Straggler writes:

Then it what sense were they "human"?

They had a physical body as the man was formed from the dust of the earth. The woman then being cloned from a rib of the man.

They had a mind as the man named all the creatures. They had the ability to make decisions. They had the ability to produce children which could commit murder, build cities and all had the ability to disobey God.

I find no place they had a spirit. Some say they did as the man became a living soul when God breathed into his nostrils the breath of life. The problem with that is that the Hebrew word translated as soul means living being.

That is all the things I can know from what is written.

Straggler writes:

So we are created from one set of humans but Adam and Eve were a different earlier set of humans? Is that right?

If you are referring to the Adam and Eve that was in Chapter 2 in the garden, we are no physical kin to them. The only kinship would be that we are mankind and they were mankind.

We are the product of the mankind and womankind that was created in Genesis 1:27 who were created in the image of God.
We have a body, mind, and a spirit that is eternal.

Now whether there was two of these people or a bunch of them is not stated. There could have been hundreds or thousands of them the Bible does not say. It only says mankind male and female.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
	Message 58 by Straggler, posted 05-16-2010 10:32 AM		Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 60 by Iblis, posted 05-16-2010 1:46 PM	ICANT has replied
	Message 64 by Straggler, posted 05-16-2010 6:09 PM	ICANT has replied

ICANT

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Message 61 of 607 (560629)
05-16-2010 4:07 PM

Reply to: Message 60 by Iblis
05-16-2010 1:46 PM

Re: Iblis Garden Spade

Hi Iblis,

Iblis writes:

If we aren't descended from them, how did we inherit their fruit catalyzed Lamarckian degeneration into sin and infamy? If we are descended from the perfect pair made in the image etc. why ain't we perfect?

We are not descended from the man formed from the dust of the ground and the woman that was made from his rib, sho were the only people created perfect. They had no sin or penalty for sin until the man disobeyed God.

But when this man disobeyed God sin entered into the world.

Sin and the penalty of sin has never been removed from this world.

That is the reason John recorded in 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

Paul tells:

Paul writes:

Romans 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

There is no scripture that says that the mankind that was created male and female in Genesis 1:27 was perfect and not subject to the penalty of sin that was already in the world.

Iblis writes:

Was Cain the child of the garden of Eden pair, or of the other pair some awesomely indefinite time long afterward? If the latter, how did he happen to move just east of Eden? If the former, then Seth was their son too, as he was spoken of as a replacement for Abel whom Cain slew. But if we aren't descended from them, then why does the Adam -- Seth -- Enos genealogy from those garden passages make it into the other guy's bloodline and ride along all the way up to Luke?

This is a debate not an argument.

I am affirming that there is a creation story in Genesis chapter 2 and a different one in Genesis chapter 1:2-1:31 using the KJV, LXX, and Hebrew texts. If you care to refute please do, in answer to the posts wherein is posted the parts you disagree with.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
	Message 60 by Iblis, posted 05-16-2010 1:46 PM		Iblis has replied

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	Message 63 by Iblis, posted 05-16-2010 4:53 PM		ICANT has replied

ICANT

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Message 62 of 607 (560630)
05-16-2010 4:10 PM

Reply to: Message 60 by Iblis
05-16-2010 1:46 PM

Re: Iblis Garden Spade

Deleted Double Post

Edited by ICANT, : No reason given.

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

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	Message 60 by Iblis, posted 05-16-2010 1:46 PM		Iblis has not replied

ICANT

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Message 65 of 607 (560696)
05-17-2010 1:06 AM

Reply to: Message 63 by Iblis
05-16-2010 4:53 PM

Re: ICANT Garden Spade

Hi Iblis,

Iblis writes:

Real Gap Theory at least attempts to answer every question raised not only by the Bible itself but by the findings of science in areas like geology, archaeology and physics. Your version can't even reconcile Genesis chapter 3 with Genesis chapter 3.

I have not put forth a gap theory.

The scope of this debate was to affirm that there was a creation story in Genesis 1:2-31. And a creation story in Chapter 2.

But what am I supposed to reconcile the story about the snake and a man and a woman being kicked out of a garden because the man disobeyed God with?

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
	Message 63 by Iblis, posted 05-16-2010 4:53 PM		Iblis has replied

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	Message 66 by Iblis, posted 05-17-2010 1:39 AM		ICANT has replied

ICANT

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Message 67 of 607 (560699)
05-17-2010 1:41 AM

Reply to: Message 64 by Straggler
05-16-2010 6:09 PM

Re: Confused

Hi Straggler,

Straggler writes:

Which set of humans (the first or second) did Adam and Eve belong to?

Eve is the word translators used for the Hebrew word meaning life or living. But this person was the woman that was formed from the rib of the man formed from the dust of the earth.

Adam is not a proper name. It is the transliteration (substituting the english letter for the Hebrew letter) of the Hebrew word for mankind. So every human that has ever existed is Adam, mankind.

These people belonged to the creation story in Genesis chapter 2.

Straggler writes:

What happened to the first lot of humans?

They died the same day the man disobeyed God and ate the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

Moses writes:

Genesis 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

I know they died because they were not swimming around in Genesis 1:2.

A point of information if you have not read the entire thread which it seems you haven't from your posts.

A day is a light period or a combination of a light period and a dark period.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
	Message 64 by Straggler, posted 05-16-2010 6:09 PM		Straggler has not replied

ICANT

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Message 68 of 607 (560704)
05-17-2010 2:47 AM

Reply to: Message 66 by Iblis
05-17-2010 1:39 AM

Re: Clarification for Iblis

Hi Iblis,

Iblis writes:

So show the break. I understand you object to certain parts of the Masoretic or Authorized text, fine, let's clear up which and why. I'm obviously not getting it, make me smarter than I am.

Genesis 1:1 Creation of heaven and earth.
Genesis 2:4-4:24 History of the day of the creation of the heaven and the earth.

The scriptures did not have chapters until Stephen Langton, an Archbishop of Canterbury, put the modern chapter divisions into place in around A.D. 1227.

When people change things in the Bible it is hard to remove all traces of the truth. Lets examine:

Moses writes:

Genesis 4:1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.

4:2 And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.

The man (Adam/mankind) knew Eve his wife and she bare Cain and she again bare his brother Abel.

Since the writer was writing a very long time after this event why did not the next verse include the statement in Genesis 4:25?

But why did Genesis 4:25 say The man knew his wife instead of Eve and she bare a son and called his name Seth. Then the reason given was to replace Abel.

How old was the man when Cain was born?

How old was Cain when Enoch was born?

How old was Enoch when Irad was born?

How old was Irad when Mehujael was born?

How old was Mehujael when Methusael was born?

How old was Methusael when Lamech was born?

How old was Lamech when Jabal was born?

Lamech had several sons and one daughter mentioned?

We have the history of 9 generations of people before Adam is said to have known his wife and she produced Seth to replace Abel.

But the Adam in Genesis 5:3 was only 120 years old when Seth was born.
But this Adam was created in Genesis 1:27 at the same time as the woman.

How could this man after 9 generations only be 120 years old?

This is the case of someone trying to make the Bible say what they thought it was supposed to say.

The man formed from the dust of the Ground was created before Genesis 1:2 as he was formed in the day the heaven and the earth was created.

Why is it that none of the people in Genesis chapter 4 lived a certain number of years and then died?

The death of 2 people are recorded. Abel who was killed by Cain and a young man that was killed by Lamech.

There is no age given for any of these people.

What could be the reason for that?

If I am correct there was a light period that lasted from the beginning until the evening found in Genesis 1:2 which God added a dark period to and declared it to be the first Day in Genesis 1:5.

That would be a good reason for no ages given as there was nothing to measure time as we know it by.

BTW this is said to happen in the New Heaven and the new Earth in Revelation 22:5.

I do know the generations of the man in Genesis 5:1 is those of the man created in Genesis 1:27 as it specifically says:

Genesis 5:1 This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;

5:2 Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.

The man in Genesis 2:7 was formed from the dust of the ground and God breathed the breath of life into him.

They are not the same man.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
	Message 66 by Iblis, posted 05-17-2010 1:39 AM		Iblis has not replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 69 by Straggler, posted 05-17-2010 12:46 PM		ICANT has replied

ICANT

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Message 70 of 607 (560771)
05-17-2010 2:44 PM

Reply to: Message 69 by Straggler
05-17-2010 12:46 PM

Do you care to Debate the Affirmed?

Hi Straggler,

Straggler writes:

Hold that thought!! Extrapolate to it's logical conclusion. Now why do you think any of the bible is the literal word of God?

What difference does it make Whether the Bible is the literal word of God or not to the affirmations I made in the OP?

In this thread I am not affirming the Bible being the literal word of God.

I am affirming there is a creation story in Genesis 1:2-31.

I am affirming there is a creation story in Genesis chapter 2.

As recorded in the KJV Bible and supported by the LXX, and Hebrew text.