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Author Topic:   Evolution Generator Program
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 3651 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 36 of 59 (576452)
08-24-2010 7:20 AM
Reply to: Message 35 by Wounded King
08-24-2010 5:16 AM


Re: Evolution Generator
I think if you really intended to mimic nature in any true sense, the target phrase should change every 10 generations or so.
And also you should have multiple targets that are being selected for-so that there are actually about 100 phrases that are being selected for simultaneously, with none having any more significance than another.
And to make it even more like nature, some phrases should occasionally just disappear altogether.
Oh, it would also help to make it more realistic, if you made each phrases longer by a few characters every few generations-to simulate the competition also increasing in fitness.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by Wounded King, posted 08-24-2010 5:16 AM Wounded King has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 37 by Huntard, posted 08-24-2010 7:26 AM Bolder-dash has replied
 Message 39 by Percy, posted 08-24-2010 7:30 AM Bolder-dash has not replied
 Message 42 by Nij, posted 08-24-2010 7:39 AM Bolder-dash has replied

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 3651 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 38 of 59 (576455)
08-24-2010 7:29 AM
Reply to: Message 35 by Wounded King
08-24-2010 5:16 AM


Re: Evolution Generator
And I thought of one more way to make it more realistic. Don't just use the 26 letters of the English alphabet to reach your target. Use every form of writing that has ever existed, plus a few that you just made up-in that way we can account better for every kind of mutations you ever thought of, plus many that you never thought of.
So you should have Japanese, and Chinese and Sanskript, and Greek., and some occasional hieroglyphics . And then the target phrase might occasionally have a few Arabic words, or American Indian words that come into existence suddenly then disappear almost as quickly.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by Wounded King, posted 08-24-2010 5:16 AM Wounded King has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 40 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-24-2010 7:31 AM Bolder-dash has replied

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 3651 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 41 of 59 (576459)
08-24-2010 7:38 AM
Reply to: Message 40 by Dr Adequate
08-24-2010 7:31 AM


Re: Evolution Generator
Well, think about it.
Or you can have it your way, only allow yourself 4 characters to select from and make your target phrase consist of a hundred billion possible characters. See how far that gets you.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 40 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-24-2010 7:31 AM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 43 by Nij, posted 08-24-2010 7:46 AM Bolder-dash has not replied
 Message 44 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-24-2010 7:53 AM Bolder-dash has not replied

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 3651 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 45 of 59 (576466)
08-24-2010 7:58 AM
Reply to: Message 37 by Huntard
08-24-2010 7:26 AM


Re: Evolution Generator
That would increase the chances of reaching a target phrase.
You also have not thought about it.
Give yourself hundreds of possible phrases to match. Then each generation matches a few of each of the phrases. It survives because it comes closer to matching one phrase, but in the next generation it survives because it is closest to a completely different phrase. In the meantime it has lost some of the compatibility it had with the phrase it was selected for from two generations ago.
Like, say you started to develop a third arm to make it easier to climb a tree, but then a few of your descendants started becoming ground dwelling bug collectors, and the third arm made it harder for them to run away from saber-toothed tigers. So a few generations down the road, they lose the arm to make them lighter, and they gain a thick coat of fur which matches the nearby grasses. But the descendants decided it was best to pursue a life of hiding in the desert sand, and shit that coat got hot. So the next few generations decided to scrap the fur coat altogether, put on a hard shell, and shorten their legs so they could tuck in under that shell.
But......then their insolent little bastard children started climbing trees again, and plus it was getting cold, and Geez did you know it is hard as hell to catch a few flying moths carrying around this dam trunk on your back all day, halfway up a tree?
So, do you think you will ever completely match up one of those phrases?
Good luck.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by Huntard, posted 08-24-2010 7:26 AM Huntard has not replied

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 3651 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 46 of 59 (576469)
08-24-2010 8:11 AM
Reply to: Message 42 by Nij
08-24-2010 7:39 AM


Re: Evolution Generator
Percy's, by contrast, is a toy for us to show people (like creationists, students and beginners) how evolution works and what it really looks like.
And hence the evolutionists entire problem right there. They take a toy, beginners like approach to the complex problem of getting from one place to another. They figure, if you just forget about all of the details, all of the complications that must be overcome, all of the pitfalls that go along with this so called strategy, ..if they just close their eyes to everyone of the zillions of problems, they can just say-well, it takes time.
Its like child who thinks that if they just stack up enough stones they can reach the sun. They ignore that rocks don't balance very good if you stack them high enough, and that that many rocks get pretty heavy, and that you are going to have to figure out pretty quick how to get back down to pick up the next rock, and put it on top.
And then soon the atmosphere is going to change, and you are going to lose gravity, and the rocks are going to start melting...
But hey, I still believe if I stack up enough rocks, I can reach the sun. It just takes time.
And by the way, halfway through your exercise, you are going to change your mind, and want to go to Jupiter instead..after you decided to go to Saturn.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by Nij, posted 08-24-2010 7:39 AM Nij has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 47 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-24-2010 8:19 AM Bolder-dash has replied
 Message 48 by Percy, posted 08-24-2010 8:25 AM Bolder-dash has replied
 Message 54 by Nij, posted 08-24-2010 9:02 AM Bolder-dash has not replied

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 3651 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 49 of 59 (576474)
08-24-2010 8:29 AM
Reply to: Message 47 by Dr Adequate
08-24-2010 8:19 AM


Re: Evolution Generator
Does anything in that analogy correspond to anything in the real world
Absolutely not.
But it does correspond to the made up fairy tale evolutionists use to paint this picture of one small step at a time Darwinian evolution.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 47 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-24-2010 8:19 AM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 51 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-24-2010 8:41 AM Bolder-dash has not replied

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 3651 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 50 of 59 (576476)
08-24-2010 8:32 AM
Reply to: Message 48 by Percy
08-24-2010 8:25 AM


Re: Evolution Generator
Percy,
There wouldn't be any such evolution models on the web, because if they really took into account all the variables that nature actually throws at the problem, they would all fail miserably. So who would post such a simulation on the web?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 48 by Percy, posted 08-24-2010 8:25 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 53 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-24-2010 8:44 AM Bolder-dash has not replied
 Message 55 by Nij, posted 08-24-2010 9:07 AM Bolder-dash has replied

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 3651 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 56 of 59 (576487)
08-24-2010 9:40 AM
Reply to: Message 55 by Nij
08-24-2010 9:07 AM


Re: Evolution Generator
I contend that the entire premise behind these simulations is bogus.
Dawkins began discussing these models to try to show how easily complex things can be created out of simple mechanisms. That same simplistic thinking is behind all of these computer models. They ignore that the goal posts are constantly moving, that the enemy is constantly changing, that the fortune to survive one generation might be completely different than the fortune to survive the next, that just because an animal starts evolving down one road, that that road wouldn't soon be a dead end, that when your are selecting for one trait in one individual, the next individual down the line will probably be selecting for a different trait, that the more time you are allotting for one new trait to form, the less likely it is that this trait would still be selected for thousands of years later, that the right mutations aren't likely to happen in the correct sequence, so even the extreme unlikelihood of an advantageous mutation becomes even more unlikely because it is only useful when it happens at the exact right chronology, that even lucky mutants would get killed for other reasons, that an advantage in one facet of existence, might be an extreme disadvantage in another...and a whole host of other problems that no computer simulator would ever program into his model, because of the obvious failings it would only generate.
Dawkins and Percy think that simplicity can clarify the difficult, when in fact, the more complex that nature is, the less likely it is that evolution could ever happen the way they claim.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 55 by Nij, posted 08-24-2010 9:07 AM Nij has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 57 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-24-2010 10:02 AM Bolder-dash has not replied
 Message 58 by Percy, posted 08-24-2010 10:27 AM Bolder-dash has not replied
 Message 59 by crashfrog, posted 08-24-2010 11:30 AM Bolder-dash has not replied

  
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