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Author Topic:   WTF is going on in London
frako
Member
Posts: 2402
From: slovenija
Joined: 09-04-2010


Message 1 of 26 (628350)
08-09-2011 3:01 AM


All i get from our news channels is that people are running amock burning things down and stealing no reason why the hell is this happening, does anyone happen to know why this is happening?
Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Larni, posted 08-09-2011 3:55 AM frako has responded
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 Message 7 by Larni, posted 08-09-2011 8:14 AM frako has responded
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Larni
Member
Posts: 3745
From: UK
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 2 of 26 (628352)
08-09-2011 3:55 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by frako
08-09-2011 3:01 AM


Not just London
Also Birmingham, Bristol and a few others.

As ever when the Torries get in power there is civil unrest.

Or maybe the Police should stop shooting people and releasing inaccurate statements about people shooting at them with imaginary guns.

Basically a guy was shot and killed in London. The police released a statment that he had a gun and had shot at an SO19 officer.

Later we hear the officer may have been shot with a police bullet and the guy had no gun in the first place.

Then there was peaceful demo in Tottenham. Later that night the riots kicked off.

Then it went viral.

Edited by Larni, : spellik and last sentance.


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frako
Member
Posts: 2402
From: slovenija
Joined: 09-04-2010


Message 3 of 26 (628353)
08-09-2011 3:57 AM
Reply to: Message 2 by Larni
08-09-2011 3:55 AM


Re: Not just London
glad to finaly get some information the way our news channels reported it, it looked like everyone has gone mad for no apparent reason.
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Mr Jack
Member (Idle past 360 days)
Posts: 3475
From: Leicester, England
Joined: 07-14-2003


Message 4 of 26 (628359)
08-09-2011 5:01 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by frako
08-09-2011 3:01 AM


Thirty years of increasing inequality in Britain, merged with a severe recession and a government intent on targetting austerity measures on the poorest has come home to roost.

Oh, and some armed criminal got shot, and provided an excuse to start trouble.


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Larni
Member
Posts: 3745
From: UK
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 5 of 26 (628370)
08-09-2011 6:04 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by Mr Jack
08-09-2011 5:01 AM


Yeah, the shooting (while tragic) is just the spark that lit an already very dry tinder box.
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bluegenes
Member (Idle past 22 days)
Posts: 2812
From: U.K.
Joined: 01-24-2007


Message 6 of 26 (628374)
08-09-2011 7:49 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by Mr Jack
08-09-2011 5:01 AM


Once again, and predictable.
Mr Jack writes:

Thirty years of increasing inequality in Britain, merged with a severe recession and a government intent on targetting austerity measures on the poorest has come home to roost.

That'll be pretty much the conventional analysis, and there's a lot of truth in it.

Nothing new. I lived in South East London in 1981, and remember these riots well. Unemployment had about doubled in the first two years of the Thatcher government. Apart from the main four riot areas, there were little copycat riots in many cities.


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Larni
Member
Posts: 3745
From: UK
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 7 of 26 (628376)
08-09-2011 8:14 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by frako
08-09-2011 3:01 AM


BBC news now reports that the guy did have a gun!

Stay tuned...


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frako
Member
Posts: 2402
From: slovenija
Joined: 09-04-2010


Message 8 of 26 (628377)
08-09-2011 8:20 AM
Reply to: Message 7 by Larni
08-09-2011 8:14 AM


well they could be lying political pressure to try and calm things down.
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FliesOnly
Member (Idle past 581 days)
Posts: 797
From: Michigan
Joined: 12-01-2003


Message 9 of 26 (628379)
08-09-2011 8:26 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by Mr Jack
08-09-2011 5:01 AM


Sounds eerily similar to a situation developing in the U.S.
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Artemis Entreri 
Suspended Member (Idle past 664 days)
Posts: 1194
From: Northern Virginia
Joined: 07-08-2008


Message 10 of 26 (628392)
08-09-2011 9:42 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by frako
08-09-2011 3:01 AM


thanks for asking
I was wondering the same thing. I was gone for a week (GenCon Indy 2011), and heard about this when I got back yesterday, but when I looked it up all the news was about the damage and what was going on and not the why.

at 1st I thought maybe their national soccer team finally didn't suck for once, but I think that is not the case.

It seems that the police suck everywhere even in jolly ol UK.


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Larni
Member
Posts: 3745
From: UK
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 11 of 26 (628394)
08-09-2011 9:48 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by frako
08-09-2011 8:20 AM


Already done that.
They already did that with that Brazilian guy gunned down on the underground a few years ago.

Then it came out that the initial ploice statement was false so I won't be suprised if the story is not confirmed for some years to come.


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Straggler
Member
Posts: 9950
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006
Member Rating: 2.7


(1)
Message 12 of 26 (628399)
08-09-2011 10:22 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by Larni
08-09-2011 9:48 AM


Re: Already done that.
Well I am somewhat in the thick of things here. I was in Tottenham on Friday and left when things looked like getting vaguely out of hand. I got the bus home through Brixton today and there are boarded up shops all over the place (including my local Tesco minimart). The sports shop and Curry's the electrical appliance store were most obviously looted and smashed up.

My missus actually knew the Brazilian (Charles de Menezes) shot in Stockwell a few years ago. He was the boyfriend of one of her friends and part of the South American community that she knows well.

Anyway - With regard to current events - If you target austerity measures at already poor and disenfranchised sections of society then I am not sure what else should be expected. If young men (primarily) full of pride, anger and with few if any educational or career prospects have little to lose and much to gain (in terms of respect and status) for being thugs then expect them to act like thugs. Yeah - It is yobbish. But yobbishnes is a way of being the one giving shit out instead of taking it in certain circumstances.

And our government seems intent on breeding those circumstances.


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Artemis Entreri 
Suspended Member (Idle past 664 days)
Posts: 1194
From: Northern Virginia
Joined: 07-08-2008


Message 13 of 26 (628402)
08-09-2011 10:36 AM


I am not sure of the validity of this source, but there is a new article (yesterday) from a group called the guardian.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/...rk-duggan-handgun-lethal-weapon

This article states that Duggan had a replica handgun that was converted to fire live ammunition. I think this would be incredibly difficult to produce, especially for someone without access to a lathe. It smells real fishy to me, as the anti-gun crowd on this side of the pond uses similar reasoning to attempt to ban toy guns.

It also states that the bullet recovered from a police radio was the same type of ammo fired by the police, which would point to Duggan not firing first somehow?

its all very confusing and hard to determine what is going on over there. Converted guns, was the suspect armed? did he shoot at the police? it is definitely a hot mess. It is slightly amusing that the "gangstas" over there have replica guns.

Thanks for the POV straggler.

It seems as if the police were too heavy handed (as they usually are).


Replies to this message:
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Larni
Member
Posts: 3745
From: UK
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 14 of 26 (628416)
08-09-2011 11:56 AM
Reply to: Message 12 by Straggler
08-09-2011 10:22 AM


Re: Already done that.
Well I hope you keep safe.

I used to live in Ponders End and went to the Tottenham campus of MDX uni so I know they place a little bit.

I completly concur with you points about the austerity and it's effects on young people with fire in their belly.

Once again, riots and civil unrest seem to correlate with Torry leadership.


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Larni
Member
Posts: 3745
From: UK
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 15 of 26 (628417)
08-09-2011 11:58 AM
Reply to: Message 13 by Artemis Entreri
08-09-2011 10:36 AM


I think this would be incredibly difficult to produce, especially for someone without access to a lathe.

This is very common in the UK.

Not being able to by guns but being able to buy replicas and whatever conversion gear you need can be a real money spinner.


This message is a reply to:
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