Understanding through Discussion


Welcome! You are not logged in. [ Login ]
EvC Forum active members: 160 (8123 total)
Current session began: 
Page Loaded: 09-03-2014 2:59 AM
83 online now:
Heathen, Malcolm, Minnemooseus (Adminnemooseus), Tangle (4 members, 79 visitors)
Chatting now:  Chat room empty
Newest Member: Colbard
Post Volume:
Total: 735,125 Year: 20,966/28,606 Month: 53/1,410 Week: 71/275 Day: 0/25 Hour: 0/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
RewPrev1
...
1516
17
18192021Next
Author Topic:   What's The Best Solution For Humanity?
Panda
Member (Idle past 128 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 241 of 301 (635962)
10-03-2011 10:43 AM
Reply to: Message 239 by IamJoseph
10-03-2011 8:28 AM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
Panda writes:

The bible was first.
There was NO writing before the bible.
The first alphabetical book is the Hebrew!


IamJoseph writes:

I thought you were being sarcastic as most here do not agree with it, even when they cannot provide a counter.


So - you think the bible existed before writing existed?

Always remember: QUIDQUID LATINE DICTUM SIT ALTUM VIDITUR

Science flies you into space; religion flies you into buildings.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 239 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 8:28 AM IamJoseph has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 243 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 7:13 PM Panda has responded

  
IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 83 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 242 of 301 (636034)
10-03-2011 7:11 PM
Reply to: Message 240 by frako
10-03-2011 8:40 AM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
No sir, not older, and if it was it only affirms the Hebrew.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 240 by frako, posted 10-03-2011 8:40 AM frako has not yet responded

    
IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 83 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 243 of 301 (636035)
10-03-2011 7:13 PM
Reply to: Message 241 by Panda
10-03-2011 10:43 AM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
No, Hebrew is a late comer, Abraham appearing 1,200 years after the Pyramids and picture writings.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 241 by Panda, posted 10-03-2011 10:43 AM Panda has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 244 by Panda, posted 10-03-2011 7:18 PM IamJoseph has responded

    
Panda
Member (Idle past 128 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 244 of 301 (636037)
10-03-2011 7:18 PM
Reply to: Message 243 by IamJoseph
10-03-2011 7:13 PM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
IamJoseph writes:

No, Hebrew is a late comer, Abraham appearing 1,200 years after the Pyramids and picture writings.


Ignore picture writings.

The bible was first.
The first alphabetical book is the Hebrew.
The bible existed before alphabetical writing existed, yes?


Always remember: QUIDQUID LATINE DICTUM SIT ALTUM VIDITUR

Science flies you into space; religion flies you into buildings.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 243 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 7:13 PM IamJoseph has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 245 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 7:35 PM Panda has responded

  
IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 83 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 245 of 301 (636043)
10-03-2011 7:35 PM
Reply to: Message 244 by Panda
10-03-2011 7:18 PM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
quote:
The bible existed before alphabetical writing existed, yes?

I should admit that my position here is varied from the widespread held one, which says Hebrew is a derivitive of Phoenecian, Canaanite and/or Sumerian. The evidences say my position is right. This applies to alphabetical writings per se.

When it comes to an alphabetical 'book', namely a multi-page continueing narrative, there is no question the first one was Hebrew: where are the Phoenecian/Sumerian books - those nations subsisted for upto a 1000 years after Israel emerged? With Canaan, we also have no alphabetical books, while the Hebrew writings say the Israelites entered Canaan with the five Mosaic books already completed and in hand. Also, Canaan was a vasal state of Egypt - and the Egytians spoke no Hebrew.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 244 by Panda, posted 10-03-2011 7:18 PM Panda has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 246 by Panda, posted 10-03-2011 7:57 PM IamJoseph has responded

    
Panda
Member (Idle past 128 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 246 of 301 (636053)
10-03-2011 7:57 PM
Reply to: Message 245 by IamJoseph
10-03-2011 7:35 PM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
IamJoseph writes:

When it comes to an alphabetical 'book', namely a multi-page continueing narrative, there is no question the first one was Hebrew: where are the Phoenecian/Sumerian books - those nations subsisted for upto a 1000 years after Israel emerged?


Epic of Gilgamesh?

Always remember: QUIDQUID LATINE DICTUM SIT ALTUM VIDITUR

Science flies you into space; religion flies you into buildings.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 245 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 7:35 PM IamJoseph has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 247 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 8:06 PM Panda has responded

  
IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 83 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 247 of 301 (636056)
10-03-2011 8:06 PM
Reply to: Message 246 by Panda
10-03-2011 7:57 PM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
Gilgamash is post-Mosaic. It is also proof the Noah flood story was a regional one, not a global one as wrongly interpreted!
This message is a reply to:
 Message 246 by Panda, posted 10-03-2011 7:57 PM Panda has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 248 by Panda, posted 10-03-2011 8:13 PM IamJoseph has responded

    
Panda
Member (Idle past 128 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 248 of 301 (636057)
10-03-2011 8:13 PM
Reply to: Message 247 by IamJoseph
10-03-2011 8:06 PM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
IamJ writes:

When it comes to an alphabetical 'book', namely a multi-page continueing narrative, there is no question the first one was Hebrew: where are the Phoenecian/Sumerian books - those nations subsisted for upto a 1000 years after Israel emerged?


Panda writes:

Epic of Gilgamesh?


IamJ writes:

Gilgamash is post-Mosaic.


It is older than any Hebrew document.

Always remember: QUIDQUID LATINE DICTUM SIT ALTUM VIDITUR

Science flies you into space; religion flies you into buildings.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 247 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 8:06 PM IamJoseph has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 249 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 8:29 PM Panda has responded

  
IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 83 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 249 of 301 (636059)
10-03-2011 8:29 PM
Reply to: Message 248 by Panda
10-03-2011 8:13 PM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
quote:
It is older than any Hebrew document.

Its not older and not alphabetical. It is a series, continually re-written and added to from 'existing material'; it is legendary [non-historical data containing dates and names]; none of its datings proven:

Scholars believe that it originated as a series of Sumerian legends and poems about the protagonist of the story,

"most likely in the eighteenth or seventeenth century BC, when one or more authors used existing literary material to form the epic of Gilgamesh.[3] The "standard" Akkadian version, consisting of 12 tablets, was edited by Sin-liqe-unninni sometime between 1300 and 1000 BC and was found in the library of Ashurbanipal in Nineveh" [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epic_of_Gilgamesh]


This message is a reply to:
 Message 248 by Panda, posted 10-03-2011 8:13 PM Panda has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 250 by Coyote, posted 10-03-2011 8:39 PM IamJoseph has responded
 Message 251 by Panda, posted 10-03-2011 8:41 PM IamJoseph has responded

    
Coyote
Member
Posts: 4679
Joined: 01-12-2008
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 250 of 301 (636061)
10-03-2011 8:39 PM
Reply to: Message 249 by IamJoseph
10-03-2011 8:29 PM


On dating
The traditional religious view on the origin of the Torah is that it was written by Moses between 1446 BC and 1406 BC. While this view is still held by conservative Christians and Jews, modern scholars argue that the whole of the Torah was composed in the mid-1st millennium BC as a "prequel" to the prophetic books (books of Joshua, Judges, Samuel and Kings).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dating_the_Bible

The first known examples of writing may have been unearthed at an archaeological dig in Pakistan.

So-called 'plant-like' and 'trident-shaped' markings have been found on fragments of pottery dating back 5500 years.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/334517.stm

So, you're 2,000 or more years off.

Care to try again, sticking to facts this time?


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 249 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 8:29 PM IamJoseph has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 254 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 8:59 PM Coyote has responded

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 128 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 251 of 301 (636062)
10-03-2011 8:41 PM
Reply to: Message 249 by IamJoseph
10-03-2011 8:29 PM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
IamJ writes:

Its not older and not alphabetical.

The line of text after the wiki quote you provided:

quote:
The "standard" Akkadian version, consisting of 12 tablets, was edited by Sin-liqe-unninni sometime between 1300 and 1000 BC and was found in the library of Ashurbanipal in Nineveh.
It is older and alphabetical is irrelevant.
The first book was not Hebrew.

Always remember: QUIDQUID LATINE DICTUM SIT ALTUM VIDITUR

Science flies you into space; religion flies you into buildings.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 249 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 8:29 PM IamJoseph has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 252 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 8:44 PM Panda has responded

  
IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 83 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 252 of 301 (636063)
10-03-2011 8:44 PM
Reply to: Message 251 by Panda
10-03-2011 8:41 PM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
All the quotes are from the same link. Only alphabeticals are referred to - otherwise the picture writings on the pyramids are of course older than Hebrew.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 251 by Panda, posted 10-03-2011 8:41 PM Panda has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 253 by Panda, posted 10-03-2011 8:52 PM IamJoseph has responded

    
Panda
Member (Idle past 128 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 253 of 301 (636068)
10-03-2011 8:52 PM
Reply to: Message 252 by IamJoseph
10-03-2011 8:44 PM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
IamJ writes:

Only alphabeticals are referred to - otherwise the picture writings on the pyramids are of course older than Hebrew.


The pyramids are not books.

The Epic of Gilgamesh is a book.
And it is older than the Dead Sea Scrolls.

There is no reason to ignore cuneiform writing.
The Epic of Gilgamesh is older than any Hebrew document.
The oldest book is not written in Hebrew.


Always remember: QUIDQUID LATINE DICTUM SIT ALTUM VIDITUR

Science flies you into space; religion flies you into buildings.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 252 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 8:44 PM IamJoseph has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 255 by IamJoseph, posted 10-03-2011 9:04 PM Panda has responded

  
IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 83 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 254 of 301 (636069)
10-03-2011 8:59 PM
Reply to: Message 250 by Coyote
10-03-2011 8:39 PM


Re: On dating
First millinium BCE, 3000 years old, is older than Gilgamesh. Of note most of the Hebrew books are dated, according to its narratives, as after 3000 [except for the book of Joshua].

There is no positive proof of the relics found in Pakistan [Mohenjodaro] as being alphabetical - nor do we have any follow-up from that source. The oldest reference to the Hebrew is an Egyptian stelle dated 3,500 years and it mentions a 'WAR WITH ISRAEL'. The Exodus from Egypt occurs on the heels of this relic according to the Hebrew bible narratives, which also states the entire five books was written in transit to Canaan, not from the Canaanite as a deritive. This is amaxzing circumstantial evidence. The oldest Hebrew alphabeticals is dated 3000 years, recently found in Israel, denoting that an advanced knowledge of alphabeticals was held with the people of this time; the Psalms and book of kings emerged and dated on the heels of this relic.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 250 by Coyote, posted 10-03-2011 8:39 PM Coyote has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 258 by Coyote, posted 10-03-2011 9:31 PM IamJoseph has responded

    
IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 83 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 255 of 301 (636071)
10-03-2011 9:04 PM
Reply to: Message 253 by Panda
10-03-2011 8:52 PM


Re: ITS CALLED BEING WRONG (again)
quote:
The pyramids are not books.

But they are writings and predates the Hebrew. Thus only alphabetical writings are referrd to by me.

quote:

The Epic of Gilgamesh is a book.
And it is older than the Dead Sea Scrolls.

These are slabs of stone and called poems. There were made at different times,updated by knowledge already held.

quote:

There is no reason to ignore cuneiform writing.

I do not, and agree they are much older than the Hebrew.

quote:

The Epic of Gilgamesh is older than any Hebrew document.


Have you never wondered why we do not have follow-up alphabetcal books from an older nation? I do.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 253 by Panda, posted 10-03-2011 8:52 PM Panda has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 257 by Panda, posted 10-03-2011 9:18 PM IamJoseph has responded

    
RewPrev1
...
1516
17
18192021Next
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2014 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.0 Beta
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2014