Studying the supernatural

Yeah, I disagree. I don't disagree with everything but a lot. Not that it's wrong just that I have a different opinion.How can I relate this to the common ancestor. When I say for instance where did the common ancestor come from or who is it you might say "chuck, that's abiogenesis, we're talking evolution".Then I simply say, well alrighty then. I could tho say, that is also moving the goal posts.So, when I say the mechanism behind the lightning is God, and you tell me im moving the goal posts, it seems unfair, to me.Im more interested in origins than how the lightning works in relation to lightning being generated in an electrically charged storm system. (Even tho the method of cloud charging still remains elusive) So, slow down a little. Well, I sure as hel dont. I believe God. The God of the Bible is the one who created that process and put it in motion. That is something that you nor I can prove or disprove. Like I said, I think it's more plausable to think some intelligence was behind such an awesome thing.You will say, "well it's not that awesome anymore. We've explained it." When I learned how my cell phone worked it doesn't mean there was no designer just because I figured it out. Some one designed it to work the way it does. Even tho I don't know who or never seen him/her. Let's not get bogged down with everyone else. People make up all kinds of crazy things. Just because the greeks thought zeus was tossing electricity around doesn't means we should group all the SN into one big myth box. Ok, fine. It's not mysterious. How about miraculous? Amazing? Awesome? To be feared? Respected? Because it's not mysterious doesn't mean it wasn't created to work the awesome way it does. That is their problem. If they didn't care how things worked scientifically, so they only thought about one aspect and not the other. Does that mean that they were wrong to imply a greater being was responsible for what was happening? Can we have the best of both worlds? Why does it have to only be one? You are as guilty as them in implying only one explanation. It's not a [italics]competing[/italics] hypothesis, it's origins. Just like abiogenesis is not a competing hypothesis to The TOE. Rahvin, you sound like Xongsmith there (not that that's a bad thing).IF, we were able to detect God im not sure we would have any say in the matter how we choose to catargorize Him. The SN and the natural are entirely different. The natural is a different dimension that the SN.If we who are natural detected the SN it just means we have detected the SN. It doesn't give us any special powers to start labeling things we are allowed to discover because we simply observed it. The SN is the SN. I've been trying to tell you how God is. Why would we laugh? He is exaclty what He says He is. You are the one in the dark but doesn't have to be.I would not be laughing but confirming what I already know to be true.Although, right about now, after reading all that, you are the one laughing at me Let's revisit a couple old friends. Apples...and oranges I can clearly see what is around me at work. Wide out in the open. Warren could not see the soldiers hiding.If the soldiers are lightning, he couldn't see the lightning. So, he would obviosly be wrong. I agree with you but not the correlation. Me, on the other hand, can see the lightning. Im not making things up. Then PM me where the next strike will hit I mean Rahvin, that it didn't just come to be because of randomness. It was purposed. It is the result of intelligence. It serves a purpose.Prove it you say? I can't but maybe we can get to a point where you can start to believe that a SN being was the originator of it.What's to lose?

Ok. Let's test the SN. I must have missed it. Which should we start the testing at? I already said my shoulder was healed and you dismissed it because what, you weren't there to see it?Or prayer, was that one we could test? I think then, we need to test everyones understanding of prayer to see if it lines up with what God says. We have to pray His will for our prayer to be answered. His will is to heal us.Test: Successful. I was healed. You ok with this test of ours so far? Yes. What's the problem? Then you're onboard that God created lightning? Or atleast it's a viable hypothesis? So, you claim steak to things explained and NOW it seems to things UNEXPLIANED as well? What's left for everyone else?Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.

Hmmm, yes, belief that He will do it again as proven from past experiences. LOL Straggler. An atheist telling us how prayer can be tested. I've been told over and over by you atheists huh? That's gold man, gold. Yikes man. Read the Bible. If we have to study up on evolution to debate it at all resonably then you should read and study up on God. The God of the Bible. God Almighty. Start in Genesis if you want. Don't you already know who im talking about? How can you not? Im mean, if something is unexplained it goes in the unexplained column and sits there till explained and nothing else. No implying anything. When something IS explained science claims it as explained therefore natural causes, the whole nine yards. Saying nothing about it's origins or how it even originated or came into existance.Science deals with the natural and CANNOT rule out the influence from the SN no matter how they or you spin it. They simply do not know just like you do not know. So stop saying you know because you have no clue.Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.

If im claiming that lightning was created of God (which I am) and then we were to study lightning (which has been done) then I suppose that science has already studied the SN. Only they didn't realize it. Well, the natural world has laws that God put in place, gravity for instance. We can know that the laws of the natural will be obeyed no matter what we believe.The SN world has laws too. Here is one you know of but probably don't think to much about:You reap what you sow. IOW, what goes around comes around. That is SuperNatural Rahvin. That is not chance, it's not natural, and, it can be studied. It's happened in my life numerous times. It's a spiritual law God set in motion. There is no other way to explain it. It's a SN law.We CAN differenciate the natural from the supernatural. Well gee, that is a loaded question. You want to hear my whole spiritual experience? What I experience and how I know what I'm experiencing? In short, my spirt man is alive to God (who is a Spirit), now that i'm "born again". I am operating in the natural AND spiritual. You may see or hear or experience the SN but you wouldn't know it (necessarily). I would because my spirit man is alive and not dead (anymore). A born again Christian told me about God, that the way to Him was thru Jesus. After a few months of asking him questions over and over and over, I finally visited his church. After going there for a short while, I ended up giving my life to Christ and accepting what He did for me on the cross. My spirit was born again, I became alive unto God, and now have a relationship with the Creator of the universe. For the past 18 years i've experienced that relationship both in the natural and SN.I did what the Bible said and am now reaping the benefits of putting my trust in Christ (the bridge to God) thru faith. Faith got me there, (believing without seeing) and that faith was rewarded. It's not a blind faith but (now) a knowing faith that God is real and that He exists, as well as the spirit world, or as you would call it, the SuperNatural.

Granted, great. What is it that you need God to do? Granted He created everything we see, what is it exactly, that would convince you? Im already convinced because He(God) has revealed Himself to me. What is it (other than finding out yourself once you accept Christ) that you need to see being suspended naturally?

Seriously? I'm going to forsake everything, my relationship with God? How He changed my life? What He's continued to do for me over the last 18 years (and before leadingt me to salvation) to get with the times? The times have no bearing on my experiences with my Heavenly Father who happens to be the Creator of this wonderful universe and incidently, who also Created you, Straggler. If i got with the times, i'd be left behind. Then, we'd both be lost.

Instead of writing notes in the sky with the Stars (big dipper?) how about He uses me to tell you about the Gospel and saving power of Jesus? That is pretty simple and to the point, isn't it?

How do you know that? You havn't even begun the journey INTO the supernatural yet. You are just looking for signs first. Im your sign right now. You can study me.

I admit, you fooled me. I thought for a second we were having a discussion. I fell for it. Nevermind then.

Deleted. Taken to Discussion problems forum.Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.