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Author Topic:   Can sense organs like the eye really evolve?
Tanypteryx
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Posts: 4444
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 204 of 242 (639194)
10-28-2011 4:33 PM
Reply to: Message 184 by Robert Byers
10-27-2011 6:35 AM


I see you have been banned from replying, but on the off chance you might still be reading this thread and that you might actually try learning something about evolution. (I know....I'm delusional)
Robert Byers writes:
If evolution was the creator eyesight concepts and eye types
then just as there is a little diversity between big groups of types of creatures there would be after all that time fantastic diversity in EYES.
Good grief, Bob! Says who? The RBToE (Robert Byers Theory of Evolution) that only ONE person on the whole fucking planet believes or can understand?
People have been explaining over and over to you that NONE of what you are saying is close to what the ToE actually says. It is just fantasy gibberish that you are making up.
The eyes of mammals alone should be almost unrecognizable compared to each other.
Says who? Oh yeah, the RBToE.
In fact posters I've been talking with here understand this and desperately try to say THERE IS massive diversity.
Other posters admit there is not by their questions or criticisms.
More delusions. Eyes are all organs that detect light, but they do it in thousands of ways.
The patterns of differences and similarities of eyes within and between groups of animals show EXACTLY THE SAME patterns of differences and similarities that we see when we group them based on other anatomical features.
We see the same nested hierarchies when we group them based on many different features.
Within a group the eyes are usually more alike than than they are with eyes from creatures outside the group.
Mammals are more alike with each other than they are with birds, reptiles or fishes. Mammals, birds and reptiles are more alike than they are with mollusks or jelly fish.
Interestingly, this pattern of hierarchies is exactly the same as when we group these animals based on evolutionary lines of descent.
So while we can see that mammal eyes are similar we can also see that cat eyes are more similar to each other than they are to horses or dogs or humans.
This is exactly what the ToE predicts....that we will see patterns of similarities and differences the follow the evolutionary lines of descent.
The Theory of Evolution DOES NOT predict that we will see wild MASSIVE diversity, of eyes. within every group. Only the RBToE says that.

Tactimatically speaking, the molecubes are out of alignment. -- S.Valley
What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
You can't build a Time Machine without Weird Optics -- S. Valley

This message is a reply to:
 Message 184 by Robert Byers, posted 10-27-2011 6:35 AM Robert Byers has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 207 by NoNukes, posted 10-29-2011 11:11 AM Tanypteryx has not replied
 Message 208 by NoNukes, posted 10-29-2011 11:18 AM Tanypteryx has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4444
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.1


(3)
Message 224 of 242 (639890)
11-04-2011 3:28 PM
Reply to: Message 220 by Portillo
11-02-2011 5:25 AM


Portillo writes:
300 million year old paddlefish looks like todays paddlefish. 50 million year old stingray looks like todays stingrays. 160 million year old squid looks like todays squids. 200 million year old lobster looks like todays lobsters. 300 million year old dragonfly looks like todays dragonflys.
I will not address the others directly, but I can comment on dragonflies. I have spent my life studying the Odonata (dragonflies and damselflies). None of the fossil dragonflies from 300 million years ago belong to the same species as any modern dragonfly, or to the same genus, or even to the same family.
None of the modern families of Odonates are represented in the fossils discovered from 300 million years ago. All of those fossils are collectively called Proto-odonata. They share more characteristics with modern Odonates than with any other order of insects, but they have striking differences from the modern Odonates.
You mention larger size. Meganeura monyi, the largest fossil species of Proto-odonata discovered so far had a wing span of 27 inches and is ~325 million years old. The oldest fossil suspected to be related to the Odonates is ~404 million years old.
We do not know if any of the fossils discovered before the emergence of modern Odonate families are ancestral, but we can infer from the evidence that a Proto-odonate from that period was ancestral.
Why didn't trilobites evolve into anything in 200 million years?
They did. They evolved into a hugely diverse group of Trilobites.
You see, that is one of the things you do not seem to get. When new species evolve they still belong to the ancestral group, so Mammals are still vertebrates, dogs are still Mammals and so on.
This is what we mean when we refer to a "nested hierarchy".
Fossil species may superficially resemble modern species but they seldom, if ever, look exactly alike, and they very often cannot even be placed in modern families, let alone modern genera or species.

Tactimatically speaking, the molecubes are out of alignment. -- S.Valley
What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
You can't build a Time Machine without Weird Optics -- S. Valley

This message is a reply to:
 Message 220 by Portillo, posted 11-02-2011 5:25 AM Portillo has not replied

  
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