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Author Topic:   New catholic scandal
Panda
Member (Idle past 3740 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 14 of 75 (647373)
01-09-2012 12:54 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by Jazzns
01-09-2012 11:54 AM


Re: A Cure Worse than the Disease?
Jazzns writes:
So if I say right now that I think certain Republican presidential candiates are economic terrorists and that I hope they drop dead and you go out and shoot one of them, I am responsible for inciting you to violence?
That would have to be decided in court.
But the answer is: "Yes, you could be responsible."
As a similar example:
A Guardian article on 2 lads that posted on facebook, encouraging riots in the UK.
They never attended a riot - "Neither of their Facebook posts resulted in a riot-related event."
All they did was post on Facebook.
But they still got 4 years in prison.
Edited by Panda, : No reason given.
Edited by Panda, : No reason given.

If I were you
And I wish that I were you
All the things I'd do
To make myself turn blue

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by Jazzns, posted 01-09-2012 11:54 AM Jazzns has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by Jazzns, posted 01-09-2012 1:55 PM Panda has replied

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 3740 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 17 of 75 (647401)
01-09-2012 3:46 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by Jazzns
01-09-2012 1:55 PM


Re: A Cure Worse than the Disease?
Jazzns writes:
The point of the comparision was to elicit a further justification that the speech should be illegal. Can you justify it?
If it encourages violence towards others then it is considered to be Incitement and he would be arrested and tried for that crime.
The fact it is illegal is enough justification for arresting someone.
And the fact that inciting violence is detrimental to society is enough justification for it being illegal.
I totally support freedom of speech, but not at the cost of other's lives.
Jazzns writes:
To any extent that someone should be imprisoned for something like that should be because they were orchestrating the riots BY their speech, not the speech itself.
This seems very vague.
Could you provide a little more detail?
Jazzns writes:
Someone saying, "I am outraged! We should riot!" should be protected speech.
Rioting (as opposed to protesting or marching) is illegal.
Encouraging others to commit a crime is Incitement and is illegal (in the UK).
Edited by Panda, : No reason given.

If I were you
And I wish that I were you
All the things I'd do
To make myself turn blue

This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Jazzns, posted 01-09-2012 1:55 PM Jazzns has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by Jazzns, posted 01-09-2012 4:38 PM Panda has replied

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 3740 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 24 of 75 (647509)
01-10-2012 4:32 AM
Reply to: Message 19 by Jazzns
01-09-2012 4:38 PM


Re: A Cure Worse than the Disease?
Jazzns writes:
So if someone says, "I am outraged! We should riot!" and there is subsequently NO rioting, is that a crime?
Yes, it is a crime.
The law is anticipatory in nature.
Obviously, there is 'small print' in relation to the crime (details regarding intent and context) but that is what the prosecution service and the courts are there for.
But, at its most basic, it is a crime to tell people to riot.
If someone carries a concealed weapon but no-one is shot, is that a crime?
If someone is in possession of explosives but no-one has been blown up, is that a crime?
For similar reasons, encouraging crime is illegal.
The law's aim is to prevent crime before it happens.
Jazzns writes:
Should it be?
As I said in my previous reply: "I totally support freedom of speech, but not at the cost of other's lives."
Edited by Panda, : No reason given.

If I were you
And I wish that I were you
All the things I'd do
To make myself turn blue

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by Jazzns, posted 01-09-2012 4:38 PM Jazzns has not replied

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 3740 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 26 of 75 (647514)
01-10-2012 6:11 AM
Reply to: Message 25 by Tangle
01-10-2012 5:30 AM


Tangle writes:
I Predict A Riot lyrics
Songwriters: James Simon Rix;Charles Richard Wilson;Andrew Robert White;Nicholas James David Hodgson;Nicholas Matthew Baines
So far no prosecution for incitement.
Au contraire...
quote:
British indie band the Kaiser Chiefs have been arrested by the British police after looters were heard humming the song I Predict A Riot.
http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/...d_for_predicting_the_future
quote:
In a series of dawn raids at the band's various homes, British Home Secretary Theresa May congratulated the bobbies for 'nipping incitement to cause fear and damage in the community'.

If I were you
And I wish that I were you
All the things I'd do
To make myself turn blue

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by Tangle, posted 01-10-2012 5:30 AM Tangle has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 27 by Tangle, posted 01-10-2012 6:19 AM Panda has seen this message but not replied

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 3740 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 30 of 75 (647523)
01-10-2012 7:19 AM
Reply to: Message 29 by caffeine
01-10-2012 7:06 AM


Re: Abhorrent, but not incitement
caffeine writes:
We only have a limited part of what he said...
This is probably the most important aspect of this particular story.
I would not want him solely convicted on what a newspaper has printed.
caffeine writes:
Incidentally, incitement is no longer a crime a Britain, having been replaced with a new, statutory offence of 'encouraging or assisting an offence'.
In a colloquial sense 'incitement' is illegal, but yes, the actual offense of 'Incitement' has been replaced with a different (but very similar) offence.
(tbh: I am having trouble telling them apart.)
Edited by Panda, : No reason given.

If I were you
And I wish that I were you
All the things I'd do
To make myself turn blue

This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by caffeine, posted 01-10-2012 7:06 AM caffeine has not replied

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 3740 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


(1)
Message 46 of 75 (647602)
01-10-2012 12:59 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by Buzsaw
01-10-2012 11:56 AM


Re: Six Jeers & Zero Responses. Go Figure
Buzsaw writes:
I see Message 6 netted six jeers and zero responses. What does that tell us?
It tells us that people didn't like you post.
That's what jeers are for.
But feel free to make up rabidly crazy excuses to support your own paranoid delusions of grandeur and victimisation.
Buzsaw writes:
It is indicative that the jeers were biased and unwarranted. It is indicative that the message was irrefutable.
Ah - I see you did.

If I were you
And I wish that I were you
All the things I'd do
To make myself turn blue

This message is a reply to:
 Message 39 by Buzsaw, posted 01-10-2012 11:56 AM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 54 by Buzsaw, posted 01-10-2012 6:41 PM Panda has replied

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 3740 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


(1)
Message 58 of 75 (647699)
01-10-2012 7:17 PM
Reply to: Message 54 by Buzsaw
01-10-2012 6:41 PM


Re: Six Jeers & Zero Responses. Go Figure
Buzsaw writes:
Such are trollish behavior.
Judging from your long history of posting jeers and not replying, you clearly don't have a problem with such 'trollish behaviour'.
On balance though, hypocrisy is one of your nicer characteristics.

If I were you
And I wish that I were you
All the things I'd do
To make myself turn blue

This message is a reply to:
 Message 54 by Buzsaw, posted 01-10-2012 6:41 PM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 60 by Buzsaw, posted 01-10-2012 8:07 PM Panda has replied

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 3740 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 64 of 75 (647712)
01-10-2012 10:28 PM
Reply to: Message 60 by Buzsaw
01-10-2012 8:07 PM


Re: Six Jeers & Zero Responses. Go Figure
Buzsaw writes:
Tell me, how do you tell which are mine and which are others.
You hover the mouse over the red jeer icons.
So yes - I do know it is you that is jeering without replying.
And we all know what you think of people that jeer without responding... "What does that tell us? It is indicative that the jeers were biased and unwarranted. It is indicative that the message was irrefutable."
Considering how many biased and unwarranted jeers you have applied without a reply, you must have encountered many many messages which you were unable to refute.
Buzsaw writes:
There's a notorious pack of you trolls who troll me with substance-less nothingness, preventing the threads from moving forward and I get blamed by admins for it.
So, when we don't reply you call us trolls and when we do reply you call us trolls.
I think you don't actually know what a troll is.
Buzsaw writes:
Trolls can expect jeers when they deserve them.
Hypocrisy noted.
Buzsaw writes:
I don't jeer indiscriminately, by any means.
And nor does anyone else.
I would ask you for evidence of indiscriminate jeering, but I know that you don't 'do' evidence.
I also don't think you know what 'indiscriminate' means.
Edited by Panda, : No reason given.

If I were you
And I wish that I were you
All the things I'd do
To make myself turn blue

This message is a reply to:
 Message 60 by Buzsaw, posted 01-10-2012 8:07 PM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 65 by Buzsaw, posted 01-10-2012 11:36 PM Panda has not replied
 Message 67 by hooah212002, posted 01-11-2012 2:04 AM Panda has seen this message but not replied

  
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