Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
3 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,817 Year: 3,074/9,624 Month: 919/1,588 Week: 102/223 Day: 13/17 Hour: 0/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Does exorcism work?
Rrhain
Member
Posts: 6351
From: San Diego, CA, USA
Joined: 05-03-2003


Message 46 of 57 (642598)
11-30-2011 3:39 AM
Reply to: Message 35 by Buzsaw
11-28-2011 12:53 PM


Buzsaw writes:
quote:
You will learn how Emperor Constantine, a pagan Roman ruler, in the 4th century AD espoused Christianity and essentially merged paganistic rituals into an adulterated form of Christianity. He became both pontfix maximus, i.e. the first pope and ruler of the Roman Empire.
Wow...how much incorrectness can one stuff into such a short space.
First, it's "pontifex maximus," but we'll chalk that one up to a typo.
Second, the term predates Constantine by centuries. It's not like he was Henry VIII coming up with new stuff.
Third, Constantine was not the first pope. That honor goes to Peter:
Matthew 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
Fourth, there were six popes during the reign of Constantine the Great:
Marcellus I
Eusebius
Miltiades
Sylvester I
Mark
Julius I
Next, Christianity was around for a long time before Constantine. It's not like he was the head of the church. After all, he didn't even get baptized until just before he died.
Tell me you've actually read your Gibbon.

Rrhain

Thank you for your submission to Science. Your paper was reviewed by a jury of seventh graders so that they could look for balance and to allow them to make up their own minds. We are sorry to say that they found your paper "bogus," specifically describing the section on the laboratory work "boring." We regret that we will be unable to publish your work at this time.

Minds are like parachutes. Just because you've lost yours doesn't mean you can use mine.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by Buzsaw, posted 11-28-2011 12:53 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Larni
Member (Idle past 164 days)
Posts: 4000
From: Liverpool
Joined: 09-16-2005


(1)
Message 47 of 57 (642607)
11-30-2011 5:32 AM
Reply to: Message 37 by Buzsaw
11-28-2011 3:33 PM


Re: Biblical Exorcism vs Pagan Etc.
The primary difference is that the Biblical methodology involves no objects or physical applications.
Apart from crosses and holy water, of course.
ABE:
As for the existence of demons, there exists no better explanation for observable extreme evil phenomena?
How soon you forget:
MENTAL ILLNESS!
ABE: totally Ninja'd by Fracko *shakes fist*
Edited by Larni, : exasperation.
Edited by Larni, : No reason given.

The above ontological example models the zero premise to BB theory. It does so by applying the relative uniformity assumption that the alleged zero event eventually ontologically progressed from the compressed alleged sub-microscopic chaos to bloom/expand into all of the present observable order, more than it models the Biblical record evidence for the existence of Jehovah, the maximal Biblical god designer.
-Attributed to Buzsaw Message 53
Moreover that view is a blatantly anti-relativistic one. I'm rather inclined to think that space being relative to time and time relative to location should make such a naive hankering to pin-point an ultimate origin of anything, an aspiration that is not even wrong.
Well, Larni, let's say I much better know what I don't want to say than how exactly say what I do.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by Buzsaw, posted 11-28-2011 3:33 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 49 of 57 (729946)
06-22-2014 2:22 AM
Reply to: Message 38 by jar
11-28-2011 4:57 PM


Re: Biblical Exorcism vs Pagan Etc.
come to think of it, i see no rational reason to make the demons go into the pigs. Once the pigs drowned, the demons once again were free to roam for the likeliest host.

When I use a word, Humpty Dumpty said, in a rather scornful tone, it means just what I choose it to meannothing more nor less.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by jar, posted 11-28-2011 4:57 PM jar has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 50 by NoNukes, posted 06-22-2014 11:55 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied
 Message 51 by Coragyps, posted 06-22-2014 12:24 PM Phat has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 50 of 57 (729961)
06-22-2014 11:55 AM
Reply to: Message 49 by Phat
06-22-2014 2:22 AM


Re: Biblical Exorcism vs Pagan Etc.
come to think of it, i see no rational reason to make the demons go into the pigs. Once the pigs drowned, the demons once again were free to roam for the likeliest host.
Is your supposition consistent with the Bible? The demons begged to go into the pigs because Jesus was not going to allow them to go into nearby humans. If the demons had a roaming option, then why beg to go into the pigs?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 49 by Phat, posted 06-22-2014 2:22 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 52 by ringo, posted 06-22-2014 2:58 PM NoNukes has replied

  
Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 51 of 57 (729962)
06-22-2014 12:24 PM
Reply to: Message 49 by Phat
06-22-2014 2:22 AM


Re: Biblical Exorcism vs Pagan Etc.
Why wouldn't demons drown just as readily as pigs?

"The Christian church, in its attitude toward science, shows the mind of a more or less enlightened man of the Thirteenth Century. It no longer believes that the earth is flat, but it is still convinced that prayer can cure after medicine fails." H L Mencken

This message is a reply to:
 Message 49 by Phat, posted 06-22-2014 2:22 AM Phat has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 52 of 57 (729968)
06-22-2014 2:58 PM
Reply to: Message 50 by NoNukes
06-22-2014 11:55 AM


Re: Biblical Exorcism vs Pagan Etc.
NoNukes writes:
If the demons had a roaming option, then why beg to go into the pigs?
"Oh please Brer Fox, whatever you do, please don't throw me into the briar patch."
Reverse psychology. Instead of sending them back to Hell, send them into the pigs where they can escape more easily. .

This message is a reply to:
 Message 50 by NoNukes, posted 06-22-2014 11:55 AM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 53 by NoNukes, posted 06-22-2014 6:00 PM ringo has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 53 of 57 (729974)
06-22-2014 6:00 PM
Reply to: Message 52 by ringo
06-22-2014 2:58 PM


Re: Biblical Exorcism vs Pagan Etc.
Reverse psychology. Instead of sending them back to Hell, send them into the pigs where they can escape more easily.
The demons asked to be placed in the pigs and Jesus granted the request. Where is the reverse psychology?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by ringo, posted 06-22-2014 2:58 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 54 by ringo, posted 06-23-2014 12:09 PM NoNukes has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 54 of 57 (730058)
06-23-2014 12:09 PM
Reply to: Message 53 by NoNukes
06-22-2014 6:00 PM


Re: Biblical Exorcism vs Pagan Etc.
NoNukes writes:
The demons asked to be placed in the pigs and Jesus granted the request. Where is the reverse psychology?
You literalists have no subtelty at all, do you? It's a joke, son.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 53 by NoNukes, posted 06-22-2014 6:00 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 55 by Phat, posted 06-26-2014 9:23 AM ringo has replied
 Message 56 by NoNukes, posted 06-26-2014 10:47 AM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 55 of 57 (730262)
06-26-2014 9:23 AM
Reply to: Message 54 by ringo
06-23-2014 12:09 PM


Fool me once...shame on you
yes but Jesus is regarded as too wise to be fooled by mere demons.
This reminds me of Why did Jesus kill the pigs?
Edited by Phat, : No reason given.
Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

When I use a word, Humpty Dumpty said, in a rather scornful tone, it means just what I choose it to meannothing more nor less.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 54 by ringo, posted 06-23-2014 12:09 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 57 by ringo, posted 06-26-2014 12:04 PM Phat has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 56 of 57 (730268)
06-26-2014 10:47 AM
Reply to: Message 54 by ringo
06-23-2014 12:09 PM


Re: Biblical Exorcism vs Pagan Etc.
I know it was a joke. And if I was dull witted enough not to see that, as I sometimes am, you did provide a smiley, But it seems to me to be a joke with more set up then punchline. I suppose that's my fault.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 54 by ringo, posted 06-23-2014 12:09 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 57 of 57 (730274)
06-26-2014 12:04 PM
Reply to: Message 55 by Phat
06-26-2014 9:23 AM


Re: Fool me once...shame on you
Phat writes:
yes but Jesus is regarded as too wise to be fooled by mere demons.
Maybe He's regarded wrong.
By the way, your link doesn't work. It should be Why did Jesus kil the pigs?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 55 by Phat, posted 06-26-2014 9:23 AM Phat has not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024