Understanding through Discussion


Welcome! You are not logged in. [ Login ]
EvC Forum active members: 109 (8803 total)
Current session began: 
Page Loaded: 11-24-2017 6:54 PM
353 online now:
Chatting now:  Chat room empty
Newest Member: jaufre
Post Volume:
Total: 822,958 Year: 27,564/21,208 Month: 1,477/1,714 Week: 320/365 Day: 47/42 Hour: 0/5

Announcements: Reporting debate problems OR discussing moderation actions/inactions


EvC Forum Side Orders Coffee House Gun Control Again Summations Only
Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
RewPrev1
...
333334
335
336337
...
346NextFF
Author Topic:   Gun Control Again
New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11816
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 5011 of 5179 (813853)
07-01-2017 11:23 AM
Reply to: Message 5008 by ringo
06-23-2017 11:40 AM


Re: Guns kill 1,300 US children every year, study finds
But more often than not, guns are not used in "response" to an attack; they're used in anticipation of an attack.

Is that a fact or an opinion?

If the other guy shoots first, a gun won't help you.

We just had a republican congressman get shot by a Bernie supporter whose life was saved, and probably a mass tragedy prevented, by the defensive use of guns in response to an attack where the other guy shot first.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5008 by ringo, posted 06-23-2017 11:40 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5017 by ringo, posted 07-03-2017 11:52 AM New Cat's Eye has responded
 Message 5029 by Astrophile, posted 07-04-2017 8:30 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11816
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 5012 of 5179 (813854)
07-01-2017 11:25 AM
Reply to: Message 5010 by Tanypteryx
06-30-2017 11:29 PM


Well at least those Trump voters are shooting their selves rather than being like those Bernie supporters who are shooting others.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 5010 by Tanypteryx, posted 06-30-2017 11:29 PM Tanypteryx has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5013 by Tanypteryx, posted 07-02-2017 12:10 AM New Cat's Eye has responded

Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 1590
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 4.1


Message 5013 of 5179 (813898)
07-02-2017 12:10 AM
Reply to: Message 5012 by New Cat's Eye
07-01-2017 11:25 AM


Well at least those Trump voters are shooting their selves rather than being like those Bernie supporters who are shooting others.

My comment was blurted out without really connecting to other events in the "news". Just a reaction to the irony of hard-line gun nuts shooting themselves and each other, proving they are not intelligent enough to be trusted with firearms.

I've been almost entirely without news since May 24. By news, I mean information about events that impact people or things or places I care about.

A month without the good or the bad has been quite refreshing. Now I have to decide how much I will let currents events intrude in my space.


What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5012 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-01-2017 11:25 AM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5014 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-02-2017 4:51 AM Tanypteryx has acknowledged this reply

  
New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11816
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.6


(1)
Message 5014 of 5179 (813908)
07-02-2017 4:51 AM
Reply to: Message 5013 by Tanypteryx
07-02-2017 12:10 AM


All of The NewsTM is shit and you're better off without it. Stay tuned out.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 5013 by Tanypteryx, posted 07-02-2017 12:10 AM Tanypteryx has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 5015 by Tangle, posted 07-02-2017 5:19 AM New Cat's Eye has responded

Tangle
Member
Posts: 5166
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.5


Message 5015 of 5179 (813910)
07-02-2017 5:19 AM
Reply to: Message 5014 by New Cat's Eye
07-02-2017 4:51 AM


Yup, get off down to your church, get on your knees and praise the Lord.
Hide from the world. Hallejuya!

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5014 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-02-2017 4:51 AM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5016 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-02-2017 5:41 AM Tangle has not yet responded

New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11816
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 5016 of 5179 (813913)
07-02-2017 5:41 AM
Reply to: Message 5015 by Tangle
07-02-2017 5:19 AM


No, go outside and do stuff.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 5015 by Tangle, posted 07-02-2017 5:19 AM Tangle has not yet responded

ringo
Member
Posts: 13889
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 5017 of 5179 (814005)
07-03-2017 11:52 AM
Reply to: Message 5011 by New Cat's Eye
07-01-2017 11:23 AM


Re: Guns kill 1,300 US children every year, study finds
New Cat's Eye writes:

ringo writes:

If the other guy shoots first, a gun won't help you.


We just had a republican congressman get shot by a Bernie supporter whose life was saved, and probably a mass tragedy prevented, by the defensive use of guns in response to an attack where the other guy shot first.

You make my point. The police officers fired after the attacker's gunfire. Their guns did not protect the congressman.

To be fair, they did protect other people who might have been shot.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5011 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-01-2017 11:23 AM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5018 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-03-2017 12:00 PM ringo has responded

New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11816
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 5018 of 5179 (814008)
07-03-2017 12:00 PM
Reply to: Message 5017 by ringo
07-03-2017 11:52 AM


Re: Guns kill 1,300 US children every year, study finds
You make my point.

You have a funny way of making your points look like other points.

The other guy fired first, and then their guns helped them - something you said won't happen.

The police officers fired after the attacker's gunfire. Their guns did not protect the congressman.

They prevented his death, I call that "protecting".

To be fair, they did protect other people who might have been shot.

And killed.

Defensive Gun Use for the win.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5017 by ringo, posted 07-03-2017 11:52 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5019 by ringo, posted 07-03-2017 12:17 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

ringo
Member
Posts: 13889
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 5019 of 5179 (814016)
07-03-2017 12:17 PM
Reply to: Message 5018 by New Cat's Eye
07-03-2017 12:00 PM


Re: Guns kill 1,300 US children every year, study finds
New Cat's Eye writes:

They prevented his death, I call that "protecting".


They didn't prevent him from being shot in the first place.

New Cat's Eye writes:

Defensive Gun Use for the win.


If you follow the thread, I said in Message 5001 that, "The idea that you can defend yourself with a gun is the problem, not the solution."

YOURSELF.

I concede that you can defend somebody else with a gun - but only if you shoot him BEFORE he shoots you.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5018 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-03-2017 12:00 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5020 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-03-2017 12:38 PM ringo has responded

New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11816
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 5020 of 5179 (814020)
07-03-2017 12:38 PM
Reply to: Message 5019 by ringo
07-03-2017 12:17 PM


Re: Guns kill 1,300 US children every year, study finds
They didn't prevent him from being shot in the first place.

So? Is your claim completely vacuous then?

If you follow the thread, I said in Message 5001 that, "The idea that you can defend yourself with a gun is the problem, not the solution."

YOURSELF.

I concede that you can defend somebody else with a gun - but only if you shoot him BEFORE he shoots you.

Not necessarily - it depends on where you get shot.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5019 by ringo, posted 07-03-2017 12:17 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5021 by ringo, posted 07-03-2017 12:42 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

ringo
Member
Posts: 13889
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 5021 of 5179 (814021)
07-03-2017 12:42 PM
Reply to: Message 5020 by New Cat's Eye
07-03-2017 12:38 PM


Re: Guns kill 1,300 US children every year, study finds
New Cat's Eye writes:

Is your claim completely vacuous then?


My claim is that you can't defend yourself with a gun. If the congressman had been running the bases with an M-16, a Colt 1911 and an RPG, he would still have been shot because he never saw his assailant.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 5020 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-03-2017 12:38 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5022 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-03-2017 12:54 PM ringo has responded

New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11816
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 5022 of 5179 (814025)
07-03-2017 12:54 PM
Reply to: Message 5021 by ringo
07-03-2017 12:42 PM


Re: Guns kill 1,300 US children every year, study finds
If the congressman had been running the bases with an M-16, a Colt 1911 and an RPG, he would still have been shot because he never saw his assailant.

So yes, vacuous it is.

It's dumb to equate "defending yourself with a gun" with "never getting shot".


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5021 by ringo, posted 07-03-2017 12:42 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5023 by ringo, posted 07-03-2017 1:02 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

ringo
Member
Posts: 13889
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 5023 of 5179 (814028)
07-03-2017 1:02 PM
Reply to: Message 5022 by New Cat's Eye
07-03-2017 12:54 PM


Re: Guns kill 1,300 US children every year, study finds
New Cat's Eye writes:

It's dumb to equate "defending yourself with a gun" with "never getting shot".


And I'm not doing that.

I'm saying that if you get shot, you get shot. Having a gun won't prevent that.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5022 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-03-2017 12:54 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5024 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-03-2017 1:08 PM ringo has responded

New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11816
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 5024 of 5179 (814032)
07-03-2017 1:08 PM
Reply to: Message 5023 by ringo
07-03-2017 1:02 PM


Re: Guns kill 1,300 US children every year, study finds
I'm saying that if you get shot, you get shot. Having a gun won't prevent that.

Sure, but being shot doesn't mean that you cannot defend yourself.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5023 by ringo, posted 07-03-2017 1:02 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5025 by ringo, posted 07-03-2017 1:14 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

ringo
Member
Posts: 13889
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 5025 of 5179 (814034)
07-03-2017 1:14 PM
Reply to: Message 5024 by New Cat's Eye
07-03-2017 1:08 PM


Re: Guns kill 1,300 US children every year, study finds
New Cat's Eye writes:

Sure, but being shot doesn't mean that you cannot defend yourself.


It means you didn't.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 5024 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-03-2017 1:08 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5026 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-03-2017 2:52 PM ringo has responded

RewPrev1
...
333334
335
336337
...
346NextFF
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2015 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.0 Beta
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2017