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Author Topic:   Semiotic argument for ID
Ed67
Member (Idle past 712 days)
Posts: 159
Joined: 04-14-2014


Message 196 of 223 (725429)
04-27-2014 3:44 AM
Reply to: Message 195 by Capt Stormfield
04-26-2014 11:25 PM


Re: The plain truth about the function of DNA
Capt writes:

The researchers... are using metaphor when they describe DNA as a code.

You want to try backing that up with FACT?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 195 by Capt Stormfield, posted 04-26-2014 11:25 PM Capt Stormfield has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 199 by Capt Stormfield, posted 04-27-2014 11:23 AM Ed67 has responded

    
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 3427
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.9


(2)
Message 197 of 223 (725443)
04-27-2014 9:46 AM
Reply to: Message 194 by Ed67
04-26-2014 9:54 PM


Ed67 buys the hype. Goes nuts
Your "second code hiding in DNA" is hype. It is not real.

This additional layer of complexity, regulatory sequences (ie, promoter and enhancer sequences), has been known for decades. The UofW paper points out that the use of preserved pairs of nucleotides which double as transcription binding factors is more prevalent than first thought. That's it. An expansion of what we already knew.

No "second code". The "second code" hype was courtesy of UofW's public relations office (think marketing folks). As usual, the weak minded press jumped at the hype. Press people are a scourge to truth, just like creationist IDiots. You read/heard something that fit your preconceived BS and swallowed it all whole.

source 1

source B

The sequences here are NOT some second code, some second language, that's been hidden in DNA all this time. They are standard functions of DNA that are nothing new or "stunning". Only the extent of their usage is new and not hardly "stunning" in the least.

You got had.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 194 by Ed67, posted 04-26-2014 9:54 PM Ed67 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 201 by Ed67, posted 04-27-2014 12:55 PM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply
 Message 208 by Ed67, posted 04-27-2014 3:10 PM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply
 Message 210 by Ed67, posted 04-27-2014 3:34 PM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 3513
Joined: 06-23-2003
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 198 of 223 (725444)
04-27-2014 9:49 AM


Ed runs like a scared bunny
No response to Message 189 or Message 190? Obviously because you have no response that doesn't involve acknowledging the errors that cripple your argument...

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.


  
Capt Stormfield
Member
Posts: 247
From: Vancouver Island
Joined: 01-17-2009


(2)
Message 199 of 223 (725447)
04-27-2014 11:23 AM
Reply to: Message 196 by Ed67
04-27-2014 3:44 AM


Re: The plain truth about the function of DNA
Sure. I'll give you 2 facts:

1 - I am a native English speaker. I understand these things.

2 - You have avoided every question asking you to explain your claim that there is a difference between the chemistry of DNA and chemistry that doesn't contain a code. That is internet code for "I'm not honest".


This message is a reply to:
 Message 196 by Ed67, posted 04-27-2014 3:44 AM Ed67 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 203 by Ed67, posted 04-27-2014 12:58 PM Capt Stormfield has responded

  
Ed67
Member (Idle past 712 days)
Posts: 159
Joined: 04-14-2014


Message 200 of 223 (725456)
04-27-2014 12:51 PM
Reply to: Message 195 by Capt Stormfield
04-26-2014 11:25 PM


Re: The plain truth about the function of DNA
The researchers, like all scientists, are using metaphor when they describe DNA as a code.

Researchers are big boys and can speak for themselves. If they mean 'metaphorical code' they will say it.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 195 by Capt Stormfield, posted 04-26-2014 11:25 PM Capt Stormfield has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 202 by Capt Stormfield, posted 04-27-2014 12:56 PM Ed67 has responded
 Message 209 by Omnivorous, posted 04-27-2014 3:16 PM Ed67 has responded

    
Ed67
Member (Idle past 712 days)
Posts: 159
Joined: 04-14-2014


Message 201 of 223 (725457)
04-27-2014 12:55 PM
Reply to: Message 197 by AZPaul3
04-27-2014 9:46 AM


Re: Ed67 buys the hype. Goes nuts
AZ writes:

No "second code". The "second code" hype was courtesy of UofW's public relations office (think marketing folks). As usual, the weak minded press jumped at the hype.

so you think that we shouldn't listen to science reporting
but we should listen to you instead.

You flatter yourself.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 197 by AZPaul3, posted 04-27-2014 9:46 AM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply

    
Capt Stormfield
Member
Posts: 247
From: Vancouver Island
Joined: 01-17-2009


Message 202 of 223 (725458)
04-27-2014 12:56 PM
Reply to: Message 200 by Ed67
04-27-2014 12:51 PM


Re: The plain truth about the function of DNA
Researchers are big boys and can speak for themselves. If they mean 'metaphorical code' they will say it.

So how does the DNA hold the pen when it "writes" the code? What kind of ink does it use? After all, if the authors meant "write in a metaphoric sense" they would say that, wouldn't they?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 200 by Ed67, posted 04-27-2014 12:51 PM Ed67 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 205 by Ed67, posted 04-27-2014 1:05 PM Capt Stormfield has responded

  
Ed67
Member (Idle past 712 days)
Posts: 159
Joined: 04-14-2014


Message 203 of 223 (725459)
04-27-2014 12:58 PM
Reply to: Message 199 by Capt Stormfield
04-27-2014 11:23 AM


Re: The plain truth about the function of DNA
Capt writes:

Capt writes:

The researchers... are using metaphor when they describe DNA as a code.


You want to try backing that up with FACT?
...

Sure. I'll give you 2 facts:
1 - I am a native English speaker. I understand these things.

2 - You have avoided every question asking you to explain your claim that there is a difference between the chemistry of DNA and chemistry that doesn't contain a code. That is internet code for "I'm not honest".

So you prefer to launch a personal attack on my honesty rather than present FACTS to back up your assertion.

Typical Darwinist hubris...


This message is a reply to:
 Message 199 by Capt Stormfield, posted 04-27-2014 11:23 AM Capt Stormfield has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 204 by Capt Stormfield, posted 04-27-2014 1:02 PM Ed67 has not yet responded

    
Capt Stormfield
Member
Posts: 247
From: Vancouver Island
Joined: 01-17-2009


Message 204 of 223 (725461)
04-27-2014 1:02 PM
Reply to: Message 203 by Ed67
04-27-2014 12:58 PM


Re: The plain truth about the function of DNA
So you prefer to launch a personal attack on my honesty rather than present FACTS to back up your assertion.

No attack, it is an simple observation of your behavior. If you are honest, go back and answer the question that has been posed several times. Honest is as honest does.

You might also answer the question about how DNA "writes".


This message is a reply to:
 Message 203 by Ed67, posted 04-27-2014 12:58 PM Ed67 has not yet responded

  
Ed67
Member (Idle past 712 days)
Posts: 159
Joined: 04-14-2014


Message 205 of 223 (725462)
04-27-2014 1:05 PM
Reply to: Message 202 by Capt Stormfield
04-27-2014 12:56 PM


Re: The plain truth about the function of DNA
Capt writes:

Researchers are big boys and can speak for themselves. If they mean 'metaphorical code' they will say it.

So how does the DNA hold the pen when it "writes" the code?What kind of ink does it use?

The DNA didn't write the code, the intelligent designer of life wrote the code in the DNA at the creation of life.

Capt writes:

After all, if the authors meant "write in a metaphoric sense" they would say that, wouldn't they?

Yes, they would. And in your word salad, you forgot to include the facts that support your statement.

Edited by Ed67, : No reason given.

Edited by Ed67, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 202 by Capt Stormfield, posted 04-27-2014 12:56 PM Capt Stormfield has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 206 by Capt Stormfield, posted 04-27-2014 1:15 PM Ed67 has not yet responded

    
Capt Stormfield
Member
Posts: 247
From: Vancouver Island
Joined: 01-17-2009


Message 206 of 223 (725463)
04-27-2014 1:15 PM
Reply to: Message 205 by Ed67
04-27-2014 1:05 PM


Re: The plain truth about the function of DNA
The DNA didn't write the code,

Ah, I see. You're not familiar with the article you linked to. Quelle surprise. Let me help. Here is a quote from the lead author of the paper:

"The fact that the genetic code can simultaneously write two kinds of information..."

Note that he is referring to the code doing the writing. According to you, he must mean it in a literal sense, since as you say:

Yes, they would.

...say it was a metaphor if that's what it was. So, how does the DNA hold the pen?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 205 by Ed67, posted 04-27-2014 1:05 PM Ed67 has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 207 by Capt Stormfield, posted 04-27-2014 1:23 PM Capt Stormfield has not yet responded

  
Capt Stormfield
Member
Posts: 247
From: Vancouver Island
Joined: 01-17-2009


Message 207 of 223 (725464)
04-27-2014 1:23 PM
Reply to: Message 206 by Capt Stormfield
04-27-2014 1:15 PM


Re: The plain truth about the function of DNA
And in your word salad...

Actually my replies tend to be rather terse, and, as befits their target, couched in fairly simple language. Quite the opposite of word salad.

But it's kind of cute the way you mimic the grown-ups language. Sort of like a little boy standing in his daddy's shoes, a fedora covering half his head, pretending to shave with whipped cream and a toothbrush handle. So do please carry on.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 206 by Capt Stormfield, posted 04-27-2014 1:15 PM Capt Stormfield has not yet responded

  
Ed67
Member (Idle past 712 days)
Posts: 159
Joined: 04-14-2014


Message 208 of 223 (725470)
04-27-2014 3:10 PM
Reply to: Message 197 by AZPaul3
04-27-2014 9:46 AM


AZPaul3 Reveals Contreversy in the Darwinian Camp
your first link writes:

Since the genetic code was deciphered in the 1950s, scientists have continued to find additional layers of complexity in the regulation of how genes are transcribed to make proteins. The current study from UW scientists have added additional knowledge to this growing field.
-https://medium.com/...nce-and-its-communication/54093e8d87be.

You can keep the hype. it's enough that the author freely admitted the above.

He confirms that 'additional layers of complexity' have been found, and that the UW scientists have added 'additional knowledge to this growing field'.

So your claim "there is no second code!" is all hype.

You might try reading the WHOLE article before making such outrageous accusations against a university's researchers and writers.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 197 by AZPaul3, posted 04-27-2014 9:46 AM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 211 by Capt Stormfield, posted 04-27-2014 3:37 PM Ed67 has responded

    
Omnivorous
Member (Idle past 350 days)
Posts: 3808
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005


Message 209 of 223 (725471)
04-27-2014 3:16 PM
Reply to: Message 200 by Ed67
04-27-2014 12:51 PM


Re: The plain truth about the function of DNA
Ed writes:

If they mean 'metaphorical code' they will say it.

I noticed that. Every time I encounter metaphorical language in English, hey, there it is! A big fat red METAPHOR printed right next to it!

Thank God, huh? Otherwise some folks could METAPHOR make asses of themselves.

Edited by Omnivorous, : make METAPHOR red, for Ed


"If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 200 by Ed67, posted 04-27-2014 12:51 PM Ed67 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 212 by Ed67, posted 04-27-2014 3:39 PM Omnivorous has responded

    
Ed67
Member (Idle past 712 days)
Posts: 159
Joined: 04-14-2014


Message 210 of 223 (725473)
04-27-2014 3:34 PM
Reply to: Message 197 by AZPaul3
04-27-2014 9:46 AM


Re: Ed67 buys the hype. Goes nuts
your second link writes:

The release also contains gems such as “The genetic code uses a 64-letter alphabet called codons.” This sentence makes me sad...


Your smart-pants 'contributor' thinks she knows better than to use literary terms to describe the codon...

yet in the SAME PARAGRAPH, gloating after showing up a research scientist, she gets a little too 'wordy' for her own good (pardon the pun):

your second link writes:


...Some amino acids get more than one word to designate them.


so, which one is it, you CAN use literary language in describing the genetic code, or you CAN'T.

Either way, this contributor is screwed.

Sad to say, many of my opponents here have adopted the same tactics of EQUIVOCATING.

Good luck with that.

Edited by Ed67, : No reason given.

Edited by Ed67, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 197 by AZPaul3, posted 04-27-2014 9:46 AM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply

    
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