Understanding through Discussion


Welcome! You are not logged in. [ Login ]
EvC Forum active members: 107 (8805 total)
Current session began: 
Page Loaded: 12-13-2017 7:24 PM
339 online now:
kbertsche, Minnemooseus (Adminnemooseus), Percy (Admin) (3 members, 336 visitors)
Chatting now:  Chat room empty
Newest Member: jaufre
Post Volume:
Total: 824,103 Year: 28,709/21,208 Month: 775/1,847 Week: 150/475 Day: 43/17 Hour: 1/2

Announcements: Reporting debate problems OR discussing moderation actions/inactions


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
RewPrev1
...
31323334
35
36Next
Author Topic:   Loony Of The Week
Percy
Member
Posts: 16305
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 511 of 527 (824191)
11-24-2017 10:17 AM
Reply to: Message 508 by RAZD
11-22-2017 8:04 PM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
And the whole thing is costing him just $20,000,..
...
The plan, as stated, is to send himself 1,800 feet high in the air...

A commercial airline ticket would take him to a height of over 30,000 feet and cost far less than $20,000.

--Percy

Edited by Percy, : Bad dBCode.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 508 by RAZD, posted 11-22-2017 8:04 PM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 512 by RAZD, posted 11-24-2017 1:40 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

    
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19295
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 512 of 527 (824204)
11-24-2017 1:40 PM
Reply to: Message 511 by Percy
11-24-2017 10:17 AM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
And the whole thing is costing him just $20,000,..
...
The plan, as stated, is to send himself 1,800 feet high in the air...

A commercial airline ticket would take him to a height of over 30,000 feet and cost far less than $20,000.

Indeed.

Or a hot air balloon:

quote:
wiki: ... On November 26, 2005 Vijaypat Singhania set the world altitude record for highest hot air balloon flight, reaching 21,027 m (68,986 ft). ...

But I still want to know how his stunt would prove the earth is flat.

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 511 by Percy, posted 11-24-2017 10:17 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 515 by ProtoTypical, posted 11-24-2017 10:55 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply
 Message 525 by Dr Adequate, posted 11-25-2017 9:16 PM RAZD has responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 10230
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.3


Message 513 of 527 (824205)
11-24-2017 1:56 PM
Reply to: Message 508 by RAZD
11-22-2017 8:04 PM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
I wouldn't trust that thing to fly anywhere! Reminds me of those old-time videos where early attempts of aviation blew up and crashed again and again! This loon obviously seeks publicity...but for what reason?

Is Flat Earthism for real? How could anybody seriously believe that? Thats worse than believing that the planet is 6000 years old!


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
Paul was probably SO soaked in prayer nobody else has ever equaled him.~Faith :)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 508 by RAZD, posted 11-22-2017 8:04 PM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 514 by RAZD, posted 11-24-2017 3:20 PM Phat has not yet responded
 Message 521 by caffeine, posted 11-25-2017 4:08 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply
 Message 522 by dwise1, posted 11-25-2017 4:48 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply
 Message 523 by dwise1, posted 11-25-2017 4:55 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19295
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.3


(1)
Message 514 of 527 (824210)
11-24-2017 3:20 PM
Reply to: Message 513 by Phat
11-24-2017 1:56 PM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
I wouldn't trust that thing to fly anywhere! Reminds me of those old-time videos where early attempts of aviation blew up and crashed again and again! This loon obviously seeks publicity...but for what reason?

It looks to me like a prop for a 1950's Buck Rogers movie ...


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 513 by Phat, posted 11-24-2017 1:56 PM Phat has not yet responded

  
ProtoTypical
Member
Posts: 1761
From: Ontario Canada
Joined: 08-04-2010
Member Rating: 4.3


(2)
Message 515 of 527 (824221)
11-24-2017 10:55 PM
Reply to: Message 512 by RAZD
11-24-2017 1:40 PM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
But I still want to know how his stunt would prove the earth is flat.

Much more likely to prove that the earth is hard.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 512 by RAZD, posted 11-24-2017 1:40 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 516 by Minnemooseus, posted 11-25-2017 12:13 AM ProtoTypical has acknowledged this reply

  
Minnemooseus
Member
Posts: 3580
From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior)
Joined: 11-11-2001
Member Rating: 4.3


(2)
Message 516 of 527 (824223)
11-25-2017 12:13 AM
Reply to: Message 515 by ProtoTypical
11-24-2017 10:55 PM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
But I still want to know how his stunt would prove the earth is flat.

Much more likely to prove that the earth is hard.

And that since he is flat, the Earth also must be flat.

Moose

Edited by Minnemooseus, : Fix quote box, also tweak message.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 515 by ProtoTypical, posted 11-24-2017 10:55 PM ProtoTypical has acknowledged this reply

    
Phat
Member
Posts: 10230
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.3


(1)
Message 517 of 527 (824235)
11-25-2017 8:37 AM
Reply to: Message 508 by RAZD
11-22-2017 8:04 PM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
"It's the most interesting story in the world," Hughes told The Associated Press of his jury-rigged quest to overturn more than two millennia of scientific knowledge. And the whole thing is costing him just $20,000, according to the AP.
Ahhh ok, now i get it. Hughes is paying for publicity and publicity alone. He must figure that $20,000 worth of publicity will get him well known enough to tap the loon marketplace. If he is smart, he will invest some money into keeping himself alive while he does his publicity stunt. Perhaps a giant airbag?

Edited by Phat, : changed him to himself


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
Paul was probably SO soaked in prayer nobody else has ever equaled him.~Faith :)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 508 by RAZD, posted 11-22-2017 8:04 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 518 by jar, posted 11-25-2017 8:41 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply
 Message 519 by ringo, posted 11-25-2017 11:16 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
jar
Member
Posts: 29763
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 1.6


(3)
Message 518 of 527 (824236)
11-25-2017 8:41 AM
Reply to: Message 517 by Phat
11-25-2017 8:37 AM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
Phat writes:

If he is smart, he will invest some money into keeping him alive while he does his publicity stunt.

Hire a Stunt Double from Central Casting.


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 517 by Phat, posted 11-25-2017 8:37 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 13968
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


(1)
Message 519 of 527 (824244)
11-25-2017 11:16 AM
Reply to: Message 517 by Phat
11-25-2017 8:37 AM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
quote:
"It's the most interesting story in the world," Hughes told The Associated Press....

He seems to be channelling Trump. No doubt it will be the longest flight in the history of the world too, with the largest crowd in the history of the world watching.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 517 by Phat, posted 11-25-2017 8:37 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 520 by RAZD, posted 11-25-2017 4:06 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19295
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 520 of 527 (824258)
11-25-2017 4:06 PM
Reply to: Message 519 by ringo
11-25-2017 11:16 AM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
He seems to be channelling Trump. No doubt it will be the longest flight in the history of the world too, with the largest crowd in the history of the world watching.

and the softest landing after reaching a new record altitude ...

and yet the question remains ...

... how would this prove the earth is flat?

The higher you go the more you see, but you'll never see the other side of the earth.

Loony


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 519 by ringo, posted 11-25-2017 11:16 AM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
caffeine
Member
Posts: 1359
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008
Member Rating: 3.5


(1)
Message 521 of 527 (824259)
11-25-2017 4:08 PM
Reply to: Message 513 by Phat
11-24-2017 1:56 PM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
I wouldn't trust that thing to fly anywhere! Reminds me of those old-time videos where early attempts of aviation blew up and crashed again and again! This loon obviously seeks publicity...but for what reason?

Is Flat Earthism for real? How could anybody seriously believe that? Thats worse than believing that the planet is 6000 years old!

I suspect he doesn't believe all this flat earth silliness either. Apparently he launched a fundraising campaign for his rocket launch a few years ago with no mention of this, and only got a couple of hundred dollars. He didn't say anything about proving the earth flat when he did his last rocket flight, either (the one that landed him in hospital).

After appearing on a radio program and talking about his attempt to get funding and prove that NASA's round earth lies are all an NWO conspiracy, however, he's raised thousands. Basically, he likes to play with his home-made rockets, and has figured out a way to get gullible people to pay for it.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 513 by Phat, posted 11-24-2017 1:56 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 524 by dwise1, posted 11-25-2017 4:56 PM caffeine has not yet responded

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 3028
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 3.2


(1)
Message 522 of 527 (824261)
11-25-2017 4:48 PM
Reply to: Message 513 by Phat
11-24-2017 1:56 PM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
Is Flat Earthism for real? How could anybody seriously believe that? Thats worse than believing that the planet is 6000 years old!

Oddly enough, it is real. There was even a convention recently.

Just off-hand, I would assume that it's part of the larger anti-science mentality which we see so much of from the YECs. They feel that science conflicts with or even refutes with certain key points of things that they believe, so they want science to simply go away. But they also like their computers, the Internet, and flush toilets too much, so they also don't want science to go away. So they end up taking a cafeteria approach of picking and choosing which parts of science they want to keep and which parts they want to get rid of -- pretty much the same approach that they take with religion and with the Bible.

In the case of the Bible, they just ignore what they don't like, but in the case of science they look for things that science had gotten wrong and use that as an excuse to reject other things that they believe science had gotten wrong, but without having to reject those parts of science that brought them the things that they do like such as computers, microwave ovens, and flush toilets (in a last-season episode of Dark Matter the ship gets sent back in time a few centuries to modern-day earth; one character's primary concern was what kind of toilets existed in this primitive era).

A real-life example of creationists attacking science for apparently no other reason than to just discredit science was when local creationist Bill Morgan (he has several YouTube videos of presentations and debates) reported on a presentation at the local creationist club about the ozone layer -- he was VP of that club and published a monthly newsletter, which is where he would report on a speaker's presentation at the previous meeting. I describe it at http://cre-ev.dwise1.net/morgan/q_ozone.html. Basically, the speaker claimed that everything scientists were saying about refrigerants causing the hole in the ozone layer at the South Pole was based completely on laboratory experiments. That speaker presented a series of questions that he claimed had not been answered. Curiously, when I went to NOAA's site and to the pages about the ozone layer, those exact-same questions were presented in the FAQ and they were all answered. That speaker also argued that those heavy refrigerant molecules could never get up into the upper atmosphere to do damage was contrary to that site's report of the levels of those refrigerants found at various altitudes based on air samples taken by sounding rockets.

BTW, a key part of that speaker's claim, which Bill Morgan had adopted, was that no scientist had ever answered that list of questions, despite the simple fact that those very same questions were part of NOAA's FAQ.

On that page given above, I have a timeline of Bill Morgan's use of this claim:


  • April 1998. Bill Morgan reports on that presentation in his newsletter, so that presentation would have been at the March 1998 meeting. I immediately research the question, find that NOAA page which answered each and every question raised by his article. His response is to run away.
  • Late 1998, Bill Morgan posts that article on his web site -- unchanged. In our email corresondence, I pointed out that I had already informed him that those claims were wrong, so why was he posting something that he already knew was false? He at first tried to equivocate, but then just simply ran away yet again.

    Please note that at the time Bill Morgan posted that article, he already knew that it was false. That constitutes deliberate lying. Even if an argument for ignorance could be made for that instance, it cannot be made for the several times he continued to use that claim because I kept pointing out to him that it was false.

  • A year or two later he put up a new website which still included that very same ozone-layer article completely unchanged -- that informed me that he had deliberately chosen to include a claim that he already knew was false.

    Yet again I took Bill to task for his actions and yet again he refused to take responsibility for his own actions.

    I believe that it was this time (hey, I'm having to remember back nearly two decades here) that I led in by asking why he deliberately posted false claims on his web site. He responded with a typical Bill-Morgan boastfulness that he went out of his way to ensure that everything he posted was true and that if he ever discovered that one of his claims was not true then he would take it down immediately.

    I pointed out, yet again, that he knew that his "Ozone Layer" article was false and yet had yet again deliberately chosen to post it on his new website. Yet again, Bill immediately ran away and refused to respond to my follow-up emails. And, no, he never removed that article from that website.

  • Several years later, 2007 June 18, I relocated Bill's website (fishdontwalk.com, whose very name is a lie, considering walking catfish, snakeheads, and mudskippers). Bill's "Ozone Layer" article was still posted on that page. Only this time it bore the date of "Monday, January 17, 2005", which I assume is when he had created the site. This is despite the fact that it actually dates from April 1998 (lies upon lies!). So much for Bill Morgan's empty boast that he would remove a false claim immediately. Yet again I email Bill about how he is deliberately lying to the public by posting that article and yet again he runs away.

  • Two years later, 2009 August, I found the site of Rational Responders who had had their own bitter experiences with Bill's lying. He had again used his deliberate lie about the ozone layer. Apparently in response to their critique of him and his dishonest practices, his site suddenly disappeared.

  • Two years later, 2011 October, we briefly renewed our correspondence and I broached the subject yet again. This time, after much arguing back and forth, Bill agrees to remove the "ozone layer" article from his site. However, he still insisted CFCs cannot possibly be in the stratosphere because he himself could not understand how. He still refused to accept the explanation of atmospheric scientists from NOAA and he still tried to ignore the direct and empirical observation of the presence of CFCs in the stratosphere as well as the direct and empirical measurements of their concentrations. In response to our discussion, he ran away yet again.

    However this time, the text of the article did eventually disappear, though the links to it remained. About time! It only took thirteen (13) years!

  • Four years later, 2015, his site was still down except for a few features, none of which were the old articles, so no sign of his ozone layer lie. However, he does lead in with his ridiculous "chicken or the egg" argument in which he falsely imagines that a newly evolved chicken would have to have re-evolved all the systems in its body, including its reproductive system. And of course he refuses to explain that claim too

But the main question about that ozone layer lie is why he considered it so important that he kept using it in spite of the knowledge from the start that it was false and why it had even been made in the first place.

I think that creationists are driven to find and point out where science has been wrong about something just so that they can then arbitrarily choose which parts of science to ignore. We saw the same thing at work when CRR argued so doggedly to prove Neil deGrasse Tyson and Galileo wrong about ballistics. Whatever does ballistics and gravity have to do with evolution? All he wanted was to be able to say that scientists were wrong about something.

Back to Flat Earthism, frequent NCSE contributor Schadewald wrote an article about flat-earthers, at which time there were so few that the Flat Earth Society basically had only one member. Flat-earthers and YECs often get lumped together in terms of their ignorance of and disdain for science. That irritates YECs such that either Gish or H. Morris made a public statement that there are no member of the ICR is a flat-earther. Shortly after that, they received an angry letter cancelling his membership which said, "Now there isn't!"


This message is a reply to:
 Message 513 by Phat, posted 11-24-2017 1:56 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply

    
dwise1
Member
Posts: 3028
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 3.2


(1)
Message 523 of 527 (824262)
11-25-2017 4:55 PM
Reply to: Message 513 by Phat
11-24-2017 1:56 PM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
I wouldn't trust that thing to fly anywhere! Reminds me of those old-time videos where early attempts of aviation blew up and crashed again and again!

"Tom Swift and His Steam Powered Rocket."

BTW, in 1911 "Tom Swift and His Electric Rifle" was published. Decades later, "Thomas A. Swift's Electric Rifle" became the acronym, TASER.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 513 by Phat, posted 11-24-2017 1:56 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply

    
dwise1
Member
Posts: 3028
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 3.2


Message 524 of 527 (824263)
11-25-2017 4:56 PM
Reply to: Message 521 by caffeine
11-25-2017 4:08 PM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
From what I read, this guy became a flat-earther only one year ago.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 521 by caffeine, posted 11-25-2017 4:08 PM caffeine has not yet responded

    
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 15984
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 4.2


(2)
Message 525 of 527 (824276)
11-25-2017 9:16 PM
Reply to: Message 512 by RAZD
11-24-2017 1:40 PM


Re: Flat Earther "Mad" Mike Hughes ...
Or a hot air balloon:

Or an elevator. There are at least five buildings taller than his goal of 1,800 feet.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 512 by RAZD, posted 11-24-2017 1:40 PM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 526 by RAZD, posted 11-26-2017 1:33 AM Dr Adequate has not yet responded

  
RewPrev1
...
31323334
35
36Next
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2015 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.0 Beta
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2017