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Author | Topic: Sinning for Others | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Jon Inactive Member |
Do you believe in unforgivable sin?
What do you consider these sins to be? If it meant saving the life of an innocent person, would you commit an unforgivable sin damning your soul to eternal torment?Love your enemies!
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AdminPhat Inactive Member |
Thread copied here from the Sinning for Others thread in the Proposed New Topics forum.
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Phat Member Posts: 18308 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
Jon writes: The only sin that is unforgivable to to ignore ones conscience(Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit) which, I believe everyone has an awareness of...even if they see Him merely as their own conscience. To repeatedly and knowingly denying and/or ignoring what we (I) am called to do is unforgivable, in my mind. I could never feel comfortable with myself...nevermind what God thinks.
Do you believe in unforgivable sin? Jon writes: I would never knowing do anything were I to believe I would be damned eternally...or even briefly! If it meant saving the life of an innocent person, would you commit an unforgivable sin damning your soul to eternal torment?Saying, "I don't know," is the same as saying, "Maybe."~ZombieRingo It's easy to see the speck in somebody else's ideas - unless it's blocked by the beam in your own.~Ringo If a savage stops believing in his wooden god, it does not mean that there is no God only that God is not wooden.(Leo Tolstoy)
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Jon Inactive Member |
Jon writes: I would never knowing do anything were I to believe I would be damned eternally...or even briefly! If it meant saving the life of an innocent person, would you commit an unforgivable sin damning your soul to eternal torment? Thank you for your answer and your honesty.Love your enemies!
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member
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The only sin that is unforgivable to to ignore ones conscience(Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit) That's not what Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is. Jesus had healed a man through the power of the Holy Spirit and then the Pharisees said that Jesus had used Beelzebub's power to do it. That's what Jesus said Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit was. Its when God does something and then you go: "Nah, that wasn't God that was the devil." From Matthew 12:
quote:
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
Do you believe in unforgivable sin? What do you consider these sins to be? The Bible says that the only unforgivable sin is Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, which is when God does something and you say that it wasn't God but something else that did it. See previous message. I think that it works the other way around too. So if you do something and you know it wasn't from God, but then you go and tell people that it was God that did it, then I think that counts too. Like televangelists who act like they're filled with the Holy Spirit, but they're just lying and faking it so people will give them money. It makes sense to me that God would be totally against that; being an impostor of God. It takes His place and it makes Him look bad.
If it meant saving the life of an innocent person, would you commit an unforgivable sin damning your soul to eternal torment? Nope.
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Jon Inactive Member |
If it meant saving the life of an innocent person, would you commit an unforgivable sin damning your soul to eternal torment? Nope. Thank you for your answer and your honesty.Love your enemies!
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2128 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
Sin lies only in hurting others unnecessarily. All other sins are invented nonsense.
Robert A. HeinleinReligious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein How can I possibly put a new idea into your heads, if I do not first remove your delusions?--Robert A. Heinlein It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. |
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9142 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.3
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Don't believe in sin.
Sin implies a deity of some sort an a transgression against this deity. Therefore since I ahve no belief in a deity, I have no belief in sin. Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
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Phat Member Posts: 18308 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
I read an interesting article in The National Examiner that touched on the concept of sin.
How The Modern Church Helped Create A God That People Hate The article starts out explaining the concept of an angry God--ala Jonathan Edwards:
Jonathan Edwards-July 8, 1741 writes: The God portrayed in "Sinners In The Hands Of An Angry God" is then contrasted with the lovey dovey God of megachurch Pastor Joel Osteen.
They are now the Objects of that very same Anger & Wrath of God that is expressed in the Torments of Hell: and the Reason why they don’t go down to Hell at each Moment, is not because God, in whose Power they are, is not then very angry with them; as angry as he is with many of those miserable Creatures that he is now tormenting in Hell, and do there feel and bear the fierceness of his Wrath. Yea God is a great deal more angry with great Numbers that are now on Earth, yea doubtless with many that are now in this Congregation, that it may be are at Ease and Quiet, than he is with many of those that are now in the Flames of Hell. So that it is not because God is unmindful of their Wickedness, and don’t resent it, that he don’t let loose his Hand and cut them off. God is not altogether such an one as themselves, tho’ they may imagine him to be so. The Wrath of God burns against them, their Damnation don’t slumber, the Pit is prepared, the Fire is made ready, the Furnace is now hot, ready to receive them, the Flames do now rage and glow. The glittering Sword is whet, and held over them, and the Pit hath opened her Mouth under them. The Devil stands ready to fall upon them and seize them as his own, at what Moment God shall permit him. They belong to him; he has their Souls in his Possession, and under his Dominion.Joel Osteen-May 18, 2014 writes: he good news is God already approved you.Quit working for something you already have. When He created you he looked at you and said that was good. Don’t be insecure and intimidated. If people don’t want to be your friend let them go. There’s freedom when you realize you’re not waiting for it — you’re already approved. The Creator of the universe has already blessed me. You may not feel blessed. Your checking account may not look blessed. You’ve got to believe it then you’ll see it. Declare I am blessed. I am prosperous. I am the head and not the tail. That activates the blessing. Hold your head up high. Walk with confidence. You’re royalty. Destined to reign. Go get your healing, dreams, abundance, and victory with your name on it. You don’t have to pray for what you already have. Just start acting like it's true. The author argues that both men were essentially megachurch evangelists of their day and asks quote:The author argues that both preachers appeal to emotionalism in a good cop/bad cop sort of way. While modern Christianity is no better than "feel good therapy", the author comes to the crux of his point. quote: Perhaps I have altered the context which the author intended, so I recommend reading this one page article. Saying, "I don't know," is the same as saying, "Maybe."~ZombieRingo It's easy to see the speck in somebody else's ideas - unless it's blocked by the beam in your own.~Ringo If a savage stops believing in his wooden god, it does not mean that there is no God only that God is not wooden.(Leo Tolstoy)
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Phat Member Posts: 18308 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
Theodoric writes: Don't believe in sin.Sin implies a deity of some sort an a transgression against this deity. Therefore since I have no belief in a deity, I have no belief in sin. I suppose the question is whether sin is a belief or a definition of transgression in general.God created war so that Americans would learn geography. —Mark Twain "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain
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ringo Member (Idle past 434 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
If sin can be a transgression against yourself, for example, it should be possible to forgive yourself.
I suppose the question is whether sin is a belief or a definition of transgression in general.
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Mal Junior Member (Idle past 3198 days) Posts: 15 From: Stockholm Joined: |
Hi
I am a noob so please go easy on me if I misunderstand something or my English is not perfect. I was confused by the first two sentences as one refers to a single item and the other to plural.
"Do you believe in unforgivable sin" and "what do you consider these sins (pl) to be" We were told that there is only one unforgivable sin and that has been explained (blasphemy of the HS). The next question I am confused about.
"If it meant saving the life of an innocent person, would you commit an unforgivable sin damning your soul to eternal torment?" I am not sure under which circumstances this could happen. If you save the life of an innocent person is that not a good thing that deserves a reward rather than a punishment? Would it not be wrong to stand by and allow the innocent person to die, assuming you are capable of saving that person? I am not sure which god would sentence someone to eternal torment for saving an innocent person. I hope I have explained well enough. Thank you.
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Phat Member Posts: 18308 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
Welcome to EvC, Mal.
I think that what Jon meant was to ask if any one of us would...of their own free will...take on the sin of another (kinda like Jesus did) even if it meant we would perish as a result. I might be wrong, however. We often go round and round on the same basic subjects, here. mal. Hows Sweden, by the way?Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
We were told that there is only one unforgivable sin and that has been explained (blasphemy of the HS). What does blasphemy of the HS mean to you? Can you give an example of it?
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