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Author Topic:   Catholics are making it up.
RAZD
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Posts: 19295
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 316 of 321 (823556)
11-12-2017 2:08 PM
Reply to: Message 312 by Tangle
11-12-2017 8:05 AM


Re: Question: aren't all religions making it up?
Catholic 'traditions' are dafter and more convoluted than most and as a result are having to change to prevent further loss of followers. The fact that a belief needs to change this radically is evidence of how nonsensical it all is.

Having existed through (and been a major cause of) the dark ages, while maintaining services in an archaic language that very few (church elites) understood, where pomp and ceremony were the drawing points for the crowds, I would expect no less.

How do they compare to Orthodox Greek Christians?

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


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This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 318 by Tangle, posted 11-12-2017 2:43 PM RAZD has responded

  
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19295
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.3


(1)
Message 317 of 321 (823558)
11-12-2017 2:11 PM
Reply to: Message 315 by Phat
11-12-2017 2:01 PM


Re: is communication possible
What does a Zen Deist see?

Nothing I can put in words. Feeling mostly.

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

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Tangle
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Posts: 5233
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.1


(1)
Message 318 of 321 (823559)
11-12-2017 2:43 PM
Reply to: Message 316 by RAZD
11-12-2017 2:08 PM


Re: Question: aren't all religions making it up?
RAZD writes:

Having existed through (and been a major cause of) the dark ages, while maintaining services in an archaic language that very few (church elites) understood, where pomp and ceremony were the drawing points for the crowds, I would expect no less.

During that period they were predominantly a political, diplomatic, financial and military force - religion was the shop front but their purpose was power and control. They had staggering wealth and power and abused it horribly.

How do they compare to Orthodox Greek Christians?

No idea, it ain't my background.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 316 by RAZD, posted 11-12-2017 2:08 PM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 319 by jar, posted 11-12-2017 4:12 PM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 320 by RAZD, posted 11-12-2017 4:25 PM Tangle has responded

  
jar
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Posts: 29749
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 319 of 321 (823561)
11-12-2017 4:12 PM
Reply to: Message 318 by Tangle
11-12-2017 2:43 PM


Re: Question: aren't all religions making it up?
Tangle writes:

During that period they were predominantly a political, diplomatic, financial and military force - religion was the shop front but their purpose was power and control. They had staggering wealth and power and abused it horribly.

plus a change, plus c'est la mme chose:


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
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RAZD
Member
Posts: 19295
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 320 of 321 (823564)
11-12-2017 4:25 PM
Reply to: Message 318 by Tangle
11-12-2017 2:43 PM


Re: Question: aren't all religions making it up?
How do they compare to Orthodox Greek Christians?

No idea, it ain't my background.

Mine neither, but they have been around as long as the Catholics, if not longer.

And I think any ceremony or procession or need to get approval for anything (like weddings, etc) has to be made up.

During that period they were predominantly a political, diplomatic, financial and military force - religion was the shop front but their purpose was power and control. They had staggering wealth and power and abused it horribly.

Can you think of any church is not involved in power and control of people and wealth?

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 318 by Tangle, posted 11-12-2017 2:43 PM Tangle has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 321 by Tangle, posted 11-13-2017 3:29 AM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 5233
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 321 of 321 (823576)
11-13-2017 3:29 AM
Reply to: Message 320 by RAZD
11-12-2017 4:25 PM


Re: Question: aren't all religions making it up?
RAZD writes:

And I think any ceremony or procession or need to get approval for anything (like weddings, etc) has to be made up.

All our social structures are made up and they have no reason to either change or stay the same unless we decide there are benefits to be had by leaving them alone or changing them.

But with religions - and I'm picking on Catholicism here because it's the biggest and I know most about it - their beliefs are based on what they say they know about god's own structures and desires. They claim knowledge.

So they taught the existence of purgatory, then abandonned it. They taught indulgencies for rituals - and probably still do in some less developed countries. They teach that contraception is a mortal sin punishable by everlating damnation - except in the developed world where it isn't. Their priests must be celebate, except when they adopt converts from Anglicans to help their failing recruitment. And so on.

They have made all this up and are abandonning it because the societies they operate in won't tolerate it any more. They are abandonning what were important 'truths' because they have become embarassing and inconvenient.

Can you think of any church is not involved in power and control of people and wealth?

There are several religions/belief systems that seem fairly benevolent and several forms of christianity itself that are as extreme in their moderacy as Catholicism was, and is, in it's meglamania. But Catholicism's history is almost unique in its overt power play. At the height of its power it was the strongest force in Europe. In the 1500s if you did not do what your priest told you you were in a lot of trouble both in this life and the next.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 320 by RAZD, posted 11-12-2017 4:25 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

  
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