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Author Topic:   Is it moral for God to punish us?
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 37 of 145 (771199)
10-22-2015 9:20 AM
Reply to: Message 35 by Raphael
10-22-2015 2:31 AM


as humans, we have no reference point from which to accuse God of being immoral,
We have our own human empathy as a reference point.
Of course, as a believer, I would say that at an absolute basic level, God's law is objective. But what I wrote earlier was attempting to explain that without some sort of objective standard, without something that is outside yourself or your culture, you can't sensibly accuse the God of scripture, YHWH, of being immoral, when God himself necessarily is morality and the standard, and by his nature lives up to the standard because that is who He is.
In Genesis 18, when Abraham was pleading for Sodom, he pretty much did exactly that:
quote:
20 Then the Lord said, The outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is so great and their sin so grievous
21 that I will go down and see if what they have done is as bad as the outcry that has reached me. If not, I will know.
22 The men turned away and went toward Sodom, but Abraham remained standing before the Lord.
23 Then Abraham approached him and said: Will you sweep away the righteous with the wicked?
24 What if there are fifty righteous people in the city? Will you really sweep it away and not spare the place for the sake of the fifty righteous people in it?
25 Far be it from you to do such a thingto kill the righteous with the wicked, treating the righteous and the wicked alike. Far be it from you! Will not the Judge of all the earth do right?
The Lord did change his position after haggling with Abraham.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by Raphael, posted 10-22-2015 2:31 AM Raphael has not replied

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 38 of 145 (771200)
10-22-2015 9:21 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Greatest I am
10-13-2015 7:56 PM


Is it moral for an all-knowing and all-powerful God to set in motion a history that he designs and then condemns others for?
We live in a history that God has set up and is fully responsible for.
Do you contend that God does not have the power to, say, play a game of chance?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Greatest I am, posted 10-13-2015 7:56 PM Greatest I am has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 39 by ringo, posted 10-22-2015 12:42 PM New Cat's Eye has not replied
 Message 40 by Greatest I am, posted 10-22-2015 12:47 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 42 of 145 (771220)
10-22-2015 2:01 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by Greatest I am
10-22-2015 12:47 PM


Is it moral for an all-knowing and all-powerful God to set in motion a history that he designs and then condemns others for?
We live in a history that God has set up and is fully responsible for.
Do you contend that God does not have the power to, say, play a game of chance?
No.
So He does have the power to play a game of chance. That leaves room for Him not having set up, and not being fully responsible for, the history we live in.
I don't see why we must believe that God is controlling every instance of every thing that happens.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 40 by Greatest I am, posted 10-22-2015 12:47 PM Greatest I am has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 43 by Greatest I am, posted 10-22-2015 2:42 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 44 of 145 (771230)
10-22-2015 3:03 PM
Reply to: Message 43 by Greatest I am
10-22-2015 2:42 PM


If you could not dither out that I read your negative statement as a positive on and that my no could not possibly match the statements I put after it then----------
What did you just say to me?
Is that English?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 43 by Greatest I am, posted 10-22-2015 2:42 PM Greatest I am has not replied

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 92 of 145 (771991)
11-02-2015 11:34 AM
Reply to: Message 91 by ringo
11-02-2015 10:46 AM


kbertsche writes:
Do you have any evidence that there actually was an "original plethora" of gospels?
The evidence is the apocryphal gospels, non-canonical gospels, Jewish-Christian gospels, and gnostic gospels. You can say what you like about how different they are from the canonical gospels. I just don't think that's a very convincing way to shore up the credibility of the canonical gospels.
Those are the exceptions that prove the rule.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 91 by ringo, posted 11-02-2015 10:46 AM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
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