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Author Topic:   2014 was hotter than 1998. 2015 data in yet?
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8527
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 43 of 357 (776072)
01-08-2016 9:56 AM
Reply to: Message 42 by Jon
01-08-2016 8:30 AM


Re: o.k.
... that solar "is a technology that can produce an economic miracle."
Those are some pretty hefty claims and they require some pretty hefty evidence.
I suppose we could try it and see what happens.
We could run an experiment.
Fund more efficient solar technologies, panel every roof and every billboard and see if that impacts our energy budget in any substantial way.
Any guesses what would happen? Other than the political hollering and gnashing of teeth by big oil, of course.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by Jon, posted 01-08-2016 8:30 AM Jon has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 45 by Jon, posted 01-08-2016 8:15 PM AZPaul3 has seen this message but not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8527
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.2


(4)
Message 140 of 357 (777036)
01-25-2016 2:26 AM
Reply to: Message 137 by Jon
01-24-2016 9:30 PM


Re: 216 feet
And I've been doing a fair amount of research the last couple of days trying to get to the bottom of this. I can't find anyone who actually predicts a melting of all the ice and the rise in sea levels this would cause.
You apparently don't know how to do research on the web.
This took me less than 2 minutes to find and that was with a 1 1/2 min pee break.
What NosyNed, and anyone who really has done a fair amount of actual research on this, knows is that our best predictions are that sea levels will rise 80 cm to 1 m by the year 2100.
We also know that, even if we stopped pooping and poisoning our planet immediately, today, the greenhouse gasses already accumulated will continue to warm the planet, especially the oceans, even more over a period of centuries.
Since, because of people like you and your "fuck the long term planet if it's going to cost me short term profits" attitude we really don't hold out much hope for the prospect of lessening our poisoning by any appreciable degree any time in the near future. That means that warming, and the ice melt, and the sea level rise, will continue, and accelerate, for many more centuries.
So the question is asked, "what is the maximum that sea levels can rise because of the ice melt?" You answer that question by looking at how much ice there is and what would the sea level rise be if it all melted. Not an unlikely scenario over the next millennium given the number of selfish uncaring people we have who are gladly adding more poisons to this world so they can keep their beer cold and who hide behind a short-term view of cost/benefit bullshit
The data is in the body of this site on how much ice there is in the three major sets of ice sheets of Greenland, Eastern Antarctica and Western Antarctica.
Any guesses as to what that sea level rise would be?
I'll assume I don't have to hold your hand, walk you through the text to find the data and do the math for you to find the answer. If I'm wrong about that ... well, I have better things to do. You're on your own.
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by Jon, posted 01-24-2016 9:30 PM Jon has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 144 by Jon, posted 01-25-2016 9:03 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8527
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 146 of 357 (777087)
01-26-2016 12:27 AM
Reply to: Message 144 by Jon
01-25-2016 9:03 PM


Re: 216 feet
quote:
While nobody is suggesting any of the ice caps will melt away to nothing ...
The 200 foot rise in sea levels that would come from all the ice melting is specifically ruled out.
In response to my claim that "I can't find anyone who actually predicts a melting of all the ice", you link to an article where a melting of all the ice is entirely ruled out.
I see where NosyNed has already answered this.
I have to ask: do you really think your statements are equivalent to the quote? Do you really think that "not making a suggestion" is specifically "ruling it out"? I mean, this isn't even in the least bit subtle. How the hell does logic equate the two?
Let me ask you this: is it your contention now that since nobody is suggesting the ice sheets will melt away to nothing that means the ice sheets will not melt at all? Do you contend that the ice sheets are not melting right now, today? Since we already know this warming is going to continue for centuries do you contend that the ice sheets are just going to sit there in all their icy splendor without any melt?
Further, if the ice sheets are melting today and will continue so for many centuries, even though nobody is suggesting they will melt to nothing, how much melting could there possibly be? 1%? 6%? 60%?
Do you not comprehend that this warming, and the melting of the ice sheets and the rise in sea levels, will continue even if we stop pumping carbon into our atmosphere today? Do you not comprehend that this warming, and the melting of the ice sheets and the rise in sea levels, will continue for many centuries even if we stop pumping carbon into our atmosphere today? Do you not comprehend that if we continue to pump carbon into our atmosphere at prodigious rates, as seems likely, this warming will accelerate, ice sheet melting will accelerate, sea level rise will accelerate?
Final questions. How far can this scenario go over the next millennia+? What is the logical extreme of this continuous acceleration of global warming, ice sheet melting, sea level rising? Even if "nobody is suggesting any of the ice caps will melt away to nothing" what is the maximum, worst case scenario, possible?
That is what this subtopic of this thread is about. That is what NosyNed was stating. And despite your weaseling around you did, in fact, find the data in the article as promised, you did the math and you now know the answer.
So cut the bullshit.
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 144 by Jon, posted 01-25-2016 9:03 PM Jon has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 148 by Jon, posted 01-26-2016 7:47 AM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8527
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.2


(5)
Message 159 of 357 (777149)
01-26-2016 7:08 PM
Reply to: Message 158 by Jon
01-26-2016 6:14 PM


Re: 216 feet
is it worth giving up the food on your table and the clothes on your kids' backs just to stave off a few meters of sea water a couple hundred years in the future?
Is it?
No. But it would be worth giving up 10% of farm subsidies, 1 main battle tank, and a 5% increase in income tax on corporations and wealthy individuals each year to fund a $3 bn per year renewable energy project for the next 20 years to accomplish the same thing. And you can keep your house, Jon. You don't have to move into a mud hut or a cave. Oh, and you can keep you car, your fridge and your heat/AC during the transition as well.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 158 by Jon, posted 01-26-2016 6:14 PM Jon has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 166 by Jon, posted 01-26-2016 9:50 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8527
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 252 of 357 (777724)
02-06-2016 7:53 PM
Reply to: Message 251 by NoNukes
02-06-2016 7:15 PM


Re: What is scalability
Yes, I remember.
Transmitdental mediation.
Ooohmm, ooohmm, ooohmm.
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 251 by NoNukes, posted 02-06-2016 7:15 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
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