Understanding through Discussion


Welcome! You are not logged in. [ Login ]
EvC Forum active members: 89 (8876 total)
Current session began: 
Page Loaded: 12-10-2018 1:40 PM
207 online now:
Diomedes, Dr Adequate, PaulK, Percy (Admin), ringo, Son of Man, Tangle, xongsmith (8 members, 199 visitors)
Chatting now:  Chat room empty
Newest Member: Bill Holbert
Post Volume:
Total: 843,762 Year: 18,585/29,783 Month: 530/2,043 Week: 82/386 Day: 32/50 Hour: 1/10


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
RewPrev1
...
6768
69
7071
...
91NextFF
Author Topic:   Creation
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6116
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007


Message 1021 of 1355 (841247)
10-09-2018 9:44 PM
Reply to: Message 1005 by JonF
10-08-2018 9:23 PM


Re: Creation
Hi Jon,

Jon writes:

(This sort of thing happens, except for the location. It's difficult to do using atomic clocks because you have to account for relativistic effects from differences in altitude and velocity).

Do you have to allow for any relativistic effects if the atomic clock is in the lab with you?

Jon writes:

While looking stuff up I found Wikipedia: hour

Does any numbers you or anyone could come up with change the duration between sunrise and sunrise? I say no.

Does any numbers you came up with change the duration between events in existence? I say no.

Jon writes:

There are actually three slightly different systems in use; which one you use is decided by convenience.

Two of those definitions say the units of time we use is defined by the rotation of the earth relative to the sun.

My definition of time.

Time is a concept developed by mankind to measure the duration between events in existence (eternity).

Jon I would like to know what you have to measure while doing an experiment other than duration between two or more events in that experiment. Other than ingredients.

God Bless,


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1005 by JonF, posted 10-08-2018 9:23 PM JonF has not yet responded

    
JonF
Member
Posts: 4284
Joined: 06-23-2003
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 1022 of 1355 (841257)
10-10-2018 8:21 AM
Reply to: Message 1018 by ICANT
10-09-2018 9:03 PM


Re: Creation
What are Jesons

Infinitesimal Jesus's holding all the subatomic particles in the Universe in place. There's a picture but I can't find it now.

Why do you think my definition is wrong for relativistic analysis?[/qs]
For the reason I gave in the message to which you replied. Expanding, in relativistic analysis, time is just a coordinate in space-time. There is no duration. There is the "interval", which subsumes what we call duration.

But you can not measure time.

If you think so explain what it is that you are actually measuring.


Interesting question, but no answer is required to know that we are measuring something. As when we measure the rate at which an object falls. Did Galileo know what he was measuring?
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1018 by ICANT, posted 10-09-2018 9:03 PM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1028 by ICANT, posted 10-10-2018 4:32 PM JonF has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 15740
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 1023 of 1355 (841260)
10-10-2018 12:06 PM
Reply to: Message 1009 by ICANT
10-09-2018 6:13 PM


Re: Creation
ICANT writes:

So what gives? I thought the red light shining on the cloth would make it look as red as the red ochres made into dye and applied would.


That's the point. The red in the lens is not inherently "red". The lens transmits the red wavelengths of the white light that you shine into it. When those red wavelengths hit a white sheet, it reflects back some of them. That shows that the colour of the sheet is determined by the light that it reflects. If the sheet was inherently "white", how could red light make it look pink?

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1009 by ICANT, posted 10-09-2018 6:13 PM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1027 by ICANT, posted 10-10-2018 4:20 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 15740
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 1024 of 1355 (841262)
10-10-2018 12:17 PM
Reply to: Message 1013 by ICANT
10-09-2018 7:18 PM


Re: Creation
ICANT writes:

That means she would have to loosen 4 nuts to be able to remove and lay the flag pole down.


I described an actual flagpole.

ICANT writes:

Now if you used an 18' pole the tape would be hard to control at full height.


Which is why the woman did it the easy way.

The point of the story is that length and height are the same thing. We can put the x, y and z dimensions of a 3D object in any order of length, height and width. I brought it up because you seem to be very confused about measurement.


And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1013 by ICANT, posted 10-09-2018 7:18 PM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1026 by ICANT, posted 10-10-2018 4:12 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 15740
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 1025 of 1355 (841263)
10-10-2018 12:18 PM
Reply to: Message 1013 by ICANT
10-09-2018 7:18 PM


Re: Creation
duplicate

Edited by ringo, : Wifi acting up.


And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1013 by ICANT, posted 10-09-2018 7:18 PM ICANT has not yet responded

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6116
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007


Message 1026 of 1355 (841268)
10-10-2018 4:12 PM
Reply to: Message 1024 by ringo
10-10-2018 12:17 PM


Re: Creation
Hi ringo

ringo writes:

I described an actual flagpole.

I haven't seen a flag pole yet that was not fastened to something above ground that was anchored in the ground or the part of the pole was buried in the ground. So you would need to give quite a bit more information.

I used one I am familiar with.

ringo writes:

Which is why the woman did it the easy way.

For a 14' 8" pole she did it the hard way.

You could measure that pole with a 25' tape with no problem.

No disassembly of the pole to lay it on the ground.

ringo writes:

The point of the story is that length and height are the same thing.

So the Empire State Building is 1,454 ft in length to the tip. The Eiffel Tower is 984 ft in length.

I don't find that description of either.

ringo writes:

I brought it up because you seem to be very confused about measurement.

I am not so confused that I do not know that a rectangle box has length, width and height.

God Bless


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1024 by ringo, posted 10-10-2018 12:17 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1031 by ringo, posted 10-10-2018 5:21 PM ICANT has responded

    
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6116
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007


Message 1027 of 1355 (841269)
10-10-2018 4:20 PM
Reply to: Message 1023 by ringo
10-10-2018 12:06 PM


Re: Creation
Hi ringo,

ringo writes:

That shows that the colour of the sheet is determined by the light that it reflects.

quote:
In physics, a color is visible light with a specific wavelength. Black and white are not colors because they do not have specific wavelengths. Instead, white light contains all wavelengths of visible light. Black, on the other hand, is the absence of visible light.

https://www.google.com/search?biw=1280&bih=621&ei=zVu-W7_...

God Bless,


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1023 by ringo, posted 10-10-2018 12:06 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1029 by ringo, posted 10-10-2018 4:39 PM ICANT has responded

    
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6116
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007


Message 1028 of 1355 (841271)
10-10-2018 4:32 PM
Reply to: Message 1022 by JonF
10-10-2018 8:21 AM


Re: Creation
Hi Jon,

Jon writes:

Infinitesimal Jesus's holding all the subatomic particles in the Universe in place. There's a picture but I can't find it now.

That is not necessary I think scientist calls what holds the universe together Dark Energy.

So all Jesus does is supply the energy to hold it together. Remember He is all energy literally all everything.

Jon writes:

space-time.

space-time does not exist, there is only existence.

Jon writes:

Interesting question, but no answer is required to know that we are measuring something. As when we measure the rate at which an object falls. Did Galileo know what he was measuring?

If you are measuring something you have to know what you are measuring it with.

I don't know if Galileo knew he was trying to measure the duration from release to stop. But I will assume he was trying to figure out how long it took from the time he turned it loose until it stopped. He was a smart man.


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1022 by JonF, posted 10-10-2018 8:21 AM JonF has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1030 by JonF, posted 10-10-2018 4:49 PM ICANT has responded

    
ringo
Member
Posts: 15740
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 1029 of 1355 (841272)
10-10-2018 4:39 PM
Reply to: Message 1027 by ICANT
10-10-2018 4:20 PM


Re: Creation
ICANT writes:

"In physics, a color is visible light with a specific wavelength. Black and white are not colors because they do not have specific wavelengths. Instead, white light contains all wavelengths of visible light. Black, on the other hand, is the absence of visible light."


That agrees with what I said. The pink colour of the sheet is caused by the reflected red wavelengths. When white light shines on the sheet, all wavelengths are reflected.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1027 by ICANT, posted 10-10-2018 4:20 PM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1034 by ICANT, posted 10-10-2018 10:23 PM ringo has responded

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 4284
Joined: 06-23-2003
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 1030 of 1355 (841273)
10-10-2018 4:49 PM
Reply to: Message 1028 by ICANT
10-10-2018 4:32 PM


Re: Creation
space-time does not exist, there is only existence. If you are measuring something you have to know what you are measuring it with.

Yes, but you do not have to know the fundamental nature of what you are measuring.

If you are measuring something you have to know what you are measuring it with.

I don't know if Galileo knew he was trying to measure the duration from release to stop. But I will assume he was trying to figure out how long it took from the time he turned it loose until it stopped. He was a smart man.


Yes he was, but that wasn't the point of the experiments. They were about gravity. He did not know what gravity or time are at a fundamental level. And yet he measured both. It seems reasonable that when you can measure something repeatedly, replicate measurements and experiments, and develop a coherent theory of how it acts exists whether or not we know what that something is.

As Galileo didn't know and we still don't know despite knowing a lot more about them.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1028 by ICANT, posted 10-10-2018 4:32 PM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1033 by ICANT, posted 10-10-2018 10:06 PM JonF has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 15740
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 1031 of 1355 (841275)
10-10-2018 5:21 PM
Reply to: Message 1026 by ICANT
10-10-2018 4:12 PM


Re: Creation
ICANT writes:

I haven't seen a flag pole yet that was not fastened to something above ground that was anchored in the ground or the part of the pole was buried in the ground.


And I didn't say there was such a thing.

ICANT writes:

So you would need to give quite a bit more information.


I've told that joke many times and nobody but you has ever had any trouble understanding it. There's plenty of information.

ICANT writes:

I used one I am familiar with.


So did I.

ICANT writes:

You could measure that pole with a 25' tape with no problem.


How do you propose to line up the end of your tape measure with the top of the pole from 14' - 8" away?

ICANT writes:

I don't find that description of either.


What you fail to find doesn't change reality.

ICANT writes:

I am not so confused that I do not know that a rectangle box has length, width and height.


But you seem to be confused enough not to understand that the three dimensions are interchangeable. If I ask for a box that's 12" wide and 16" long, it doesn't matter if you make it 12" long and 16" wide instead. All I have to do is rotate it 90.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1026 by ICANT, posted 10-10-2018 4:12 PM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1032 by DrJones*, posted 10-10-2018 8:43 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply
 Message 1036 by ICANT, posted 10-11-2018 12:04 AM ringo has responded

  
DrJones*
Member
Posts: 1757
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 2.7


(1)
Message 1032 of 1355 (841278)
10-10-2018 8:43 PM
Reply to: Message 1031 by ringo
10-10-2018 5:21 PM


Re: Creation
I've told that joke many times and nobody but you has ever had any trouble understanding it. There's plenty of information.

what you're missing is that ICANT is either incapable of honest discussion or has a condition that prevents abstract thought.

It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1031 by ringo, posted 10-10-2018 5:21 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6116
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007


Message 1033 of 1355 (841279)
10-10-2018 10:06 PM
Reply to: Message 1030 by JonF
10-10-2018 4:49 PM


Re: Creation
Hi Jon,

Jon writes:

Yes, but you do not have to know the fundamental nature of what you are measuring.

We measure duration between events with a clock of some type that is based on seconds, minutes, hours etc.

We measure distance from one place to another with a system of fractions of inches, inches, feet, yards, miles, etc.

You can't swap the two methods so you do need to understand a little about what you are measuring. The method of measuring volume would not work on either distance or duration.

Jon writes:

They were about gravity.

So Galileo was trying to figure out why something dropped.

That should have been a no brainer. The air was not thick enough to hold it up.

God Bless,


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1030 by JonF, posted 10-10-2018 4:49 PM JonF has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1039 by JonF, posted 10-11-2018 9:48 AM ICANT has acknowledged this reply

    
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6116
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007


Message 1034 of 1355 (841280)
10-10-2018 10:23 PM
Reply to: Message 1029 by ringo
10-10-2018 4:39 PM


Re: Creation
Hi ringo,

ringo writes:

That agrees with what I said. The pink colour of the sheet is caused by the reflected red wavelengths. When white light shines on the sheet, all wavelengths are reflected.

I used a light that had a red bulb and red lens to get the pink reflection on the white cloth. I can put the Red ochre on the white cloth and it will not cause the surrounding area to reflect pink. In fact white will begin at the edge of the red ochre.

God Bless,


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1029 by ringo, posted 10-10-2018 4:39 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1035 by DrJones*, posted 10-10-2018 11:15 PM ICANT has responded
 Message 1041 by ringo, posted 10-11-2018 11:41 AM ICANT has responded

    
DrJones*
Member
Posts: 1757
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 1035 of 1355 (841281)
10-10-2018 11:15 PM
Reply to: Message 1034 by ICANT
10-10-2018 10:23 PM


Re: Creation
I can put the Red ochre on the white cloth and it will not cause the surrounding area to reflect pink

do you understand the red ochre is not light? do you have a grade school education of physics or should we really start dumbing it down for you?

0. cloth and ochre are different materials and therefore have different properties.
1. the cloth is reflecting white light, that is why it looks white.
2. when you shine a red light on the white cloth some of the red is getting reflected back at you.
3. when you expose red ochre to white light, you get a large amount of red light reflected back at you.


It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1034 by ICANT, posted 10-10-2018 10:23 PM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1037 by ICANT, posted 10-11-2018 3:12 AM DrJones* has not yet responded

  
RewPrev1
...
6768
69
7071
...
91NextFF
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2015 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.0 Beta
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2018