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Author Topic:   Creation
creation
Member
Posts: 654
Joined: 01-22-2017


Message 1261 of 1358 (844184)
11-26-2018 1:27 PM
Reply to: Message 1228 by ringo
11-16-2018 11:17 AM


Re: Creation
If there was water and land together, and then it was separated, we were left with land as well as water. I have no reason to doubt that in the beginning a large land mass existed that later broke apart.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1228 by ringo, posted 11-16-2018 11:17 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1262 by Phat, posted 11-26-2018 1:47 PM creation has responded
 Message 1267 by ringo, posted 11-27-2018 11:14 AM creation has responded

    
Phat
Member
Posts: 11574
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 1262 of 1358 (844188)
11-26-2018 1:47 PM
Reply to: Message 1261 by creation
11-26-2018 1:27 PM


Re: Creation
I have no reason to doubt that in the beginning, a large land mass existed that later broke apart.
The question is, why do you avoid the evidence that mainstream science offers as an explanation? Why rely on faith in an inerrant Bible and "living Word" while fighting the scientific approach to evidence?

If you claim to be a creationist, you surely need a solid relationship with a Creator...not simply a connection with "other creationists"....

Do you feel as if you have one? If so, do you imagine Him proud that you are fighting the scientists and evolutionists?


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1261 by creation, posted 11-26-2018 1:27 PM creation has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1263 by ICANT, posted 11-27-2018 12:57 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply
 Message 1265 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 2:20 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6118
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007


Message 1263 of 1358 (844231)
11-27-2018 12:57 AM
Reply to: Message 1262 by Phat
11-26-2018 1:47 PM


Re: Creation
Hi Phat

Phat writes:

The question is, why do you avoid the evidence that mainstream science offers as an explanation?

What evidence are you talking about?

Phat writes:

Why rely on faith in an inerrant Bible and "living Word"

I rely on evidence presented in the inerrant Bible. Especially since science has put forth many things that proves the Bible is correct.

Phat writes:

Do you feel as if you have one? If so, do you imagine Him proud that you are fighting the scientists and evolutionists?

Yes Phat I have a Creator that has revealed things to me that he revealed to no one else. I know He exists as we have met when I was dead for 3 hours and 20 minutes.

As far as fighting I don't fight. I made a statement in March of 2007 that I was here to learn. Now why would I imagine my Creator is proud of me for sharing information He has revealed to me?

I have learned science does not know how the universe began to exist or why.

I have learned science does not know how life began to exist.

I have learned science believes the land mass was in one place at least one time in the past, maybe more.

They know that because it is still moving. The plates are moving from 1 cm/yr to 10 cm/yr and at that rate Pangaea existed about 175 million years ago.

Science says a single land mass existed and the Bible says a single land mass existed, and the oldest map of earth agrees.

Now there is a difference of opinion as to how it got to where it is now. I believe it got pretty close to where it is at now in a nanosecond and hasn't stopped moving yet, although some are moving a lot slower than others.

I am still writing my book and have just started the chapter on what science wants us to believe.

I have over 9 gigs of information I am trying to sift through.

God Bless,


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1262 by Phat, posted 11-26-2018 1:47 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply

    
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6118
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007


Message 1264 of 1358 (844232)
11-27-2018 1:26 AM
Reply to: Message 1260 by Son of Man
11-22-2018 7:34 AM


Re: Creation
Hi Son,

Son of Man writes:

there must have been a point early in your life where none of it made sense or mattered to you,

It all made sense to me when I was 10 years old. I have seen no evidence presented on this site or in any of the thousands of pages I have read on the internet to change my mind.

Son of Man writes:

that the earth didn't flood

The earth has been covered with water at least 2 times. Genesis 1:2 and Genesis 7:19.

Son of Man writes:

but was compressed and made smaller

You putting words into my mouth now. Give me the quote where I said that.

I said the earth was smaller at one time in the past. Then due to accretion it got larger covering up matter that eventually turned into the oil in the ground. Which is now under 22,000 psi.

Son of Man writes:

oil is created by shifting of the earths plates,

Could you give me some supporting evidence for that? I thought it was matter that was covered up, put under extreme pressure and heat as it decayed and turned into oil.

Son of Man writes:

that's why it is only found in seams it didn't cover the earth then more earth bury it?

I thought it was found in pockets in the rocks and in sand and water that is in the earth.

Son of Man writes:

can I ask what religion you are? and do you believe the Bible holds prophecies or not?

Sure you can ask. I am a born again child of God, washed in the blood of the Lamb having my spirit sealed for eternity. I fellowship with some but not all Baptist. There are many who have left the truth of what the original text says a long time ago. Those I don't fellowship with as we have very little in common. But I will talk to anyone who will listen, and to some that won't.

God Bless,


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1260 by Son of Man, posted 11-22-2018 7:34 AM Son of Man has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1266 by Son of Man, posted 11-27-2018 7:38 AM ICANT has responded

    
creation
Member
Posts: 654
Joined: 01-22-2017


Message 1265 of 1358 (844236)
11-27-2018 2:20 AM
Reply to: Message 1262 by Phat
11-26-2018 1:47 PM


Re: Creation
I think the battle is spiritual, and against lies and anything that opposes and exalts itself against God and His word. Not against people...flesh and blood.

Science has evidence that there once was a large land mass...not on why and exactly how it separated.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1262 by Phat, posted 11-26-2018 1:47 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 1268 by ringo, posted 11-27-2018 11:24 AM creation has responded

    
Son of Man
Junior Member
Posts: 25
From: Ireland
Joined: 11-13-2018


Message 1266 of 1358 (844245)
11-27-2018 7:38 AM
Reply to: Message 1264 by ICANT
11-27-2018 1:26 AM


Re: Creation
ICANT writes:

But I will talk to anyone who will listen, and to some that won't.


you knocked the nail on the head, your not open minded like most of the religious I've met or talked to? I don't blame you for the way you have been raised, I'm sure you didn't walk into a church at 4 or 5 without an adult and ask to be preached to?
10 years old is very young to have made your mind up on such a heavy religious subject?
I was nearly 40 years old when I picked up the Bible to look at it both subjectively and objectively with an open mind, I have uncovered a lot of evidence that leads me to believe that the Bible creates it's own world and when this is done it creates the prophecies held therein, hence God spoke the world into being?

by the way you didn't answer the question on prophecy?

I along with many others believe that the earth has evolved, like the universe it is still expanding, continental plates as they are called now where once one huge land mass that can be put together like a huge jigsaw puzzle. That said I don't believe that man has evolved along with this planet, man must have been placed here because science tells us there is a missing link and the Bible mentions 'when giants walked among us'

I read science and the Bible open mindedly because they are both continuing to evolve

My Biblical journey started with the letters to the churches Rev 2 by placing the texts of each church into narrow columns you will find that the forth letter makes the longest column. near the base of the text there is a change from letters 1,2,3,4 'he who has an ear' comes last and he that overcomes comes first, in the letters 5,6,7, these verses are the other way around making the turns of columns of text to form a 7 branched candlestick or menorah.
The seven stars are found in 'the parable of the sower' within Mathew, Mark and Luke, the ending of each story has a slightly different end some 100, 60, 30 next some 30, 60, 100 and lastly some 100. Apply the rule 'the first will be the last etc. If you graph the numbers you get a pan shape, or the star formation the plough (American big dipper)?
At the point of the building the menorah I knew that I had somehow had to build a temple also using the texts of the Bible, along the way also finding more star formations ( see my other posts).

coincidence I think not?

Its all about building a picture seen primarily looking from the East towards the West, The texts of John hold the view of the temple looking from the same direction?

Edited by Son of Man, : added some words that I missed

Edited by Son of Man, : changed West to East


the first will be the last and the last will be the first.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1264 by ICANT, posted 11-27-2018 1:26 AM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1269 by ICANT, posted 11-27-2018 11:58 AM Son of Man has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 15740
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 1267 of 1358 (844260)
11-27-2018 11:14 AM
Reply to: Message 1261 by creation
11-26-2018 1:27 PM


Re: Creation
creation writes:

If there was water and land together, and then it was separated, we were left with land as well as water. I have no reason to doubt that in the beginning a large land mass existed that later broke apart.


Again... you claimed in Message 1215 that, "It does not say that continents were formed then." What do you think a "large land mass" is if it isn't a continent?

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1261 by creation, posted 11-26-2018 1:27 PM creation has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1270 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 4:45 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 15740
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 1268 of 1358 (844261)
11-27-2018 11:24 AM
Reply to: Message 1265 by creation
11-27-2018 2:20 AM


Re: Creation
creation writes:

Science has evidence that there once was a large land mass...not on why and exactly how it separated.


Science doesn't concern itself much with "why" things happen. It isn't "why" tigers have stripes so much as how are stripes an evolutionary advantage.

As for how the continents were separated, you can do the experiment: Heat a pot of water to almost boiling, then drop a few drops of oil onto the surface. Convection currents in the water will make the oil "continents" separate and merge into different "continents".


And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1265 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 2:20 AM creation has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1271 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 4:52 PM ringo has responded

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6118
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007


Message 1269 of 1358 (844265)
11-27-2018 11:58 AM
Reply to: Message 1266 by Son of Man
11-27-2018 7:38 AM


Re: Creation
Hi Man

Son of Man writes:

10 years old is very young to have made your mind up on such a heavy religious subject?

At 10 years old I had read the Bible cover to cover twice by the time I was nine and was on my third time at ten. I brought a devotion at prayer meeting in November of 1949. In my devotion I read Genesis 1:1 and then read the history of the Day God created the heavens and earth found beginning in Genesis 2:4. I held the same view then I do now. My view has been streamlined and expanded by my studies in Hebrew and Greek.

Son of Man writes:

I was nearly 40 years old when I picked up the Bible to look at it both subjectively and objectively with an open mind,

How could you possibly have an open mind at age 40. You may have looked at it when you were 40 but when were you born again? A person has to be born again and have the Holy Spirit dwelling in him/her to be able to understand the Bible for it is spiritually discerned.

quote:
1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

So the only way you could look at the Bible was intellectually which is what you had been taught for 40 years and had made up your mind about by the time you were 25.

Son of Man writes:

by the way you didn't answer the question on prophecy?

There were over a thousand prophesies about Christ hundreds of years before he enter the world in a human body. That came to pass before and after His birth.

There are prophesies that are being fulfilled on a daily basis. There are many prophesies that are yet to come to pass.

One prophecy that is going to take place is the earth will melt with fervent heat. 2 Peter 3:10 Science agrees as it says the Sun is increasing in size and in the future will make the earth to hot and dry for mankind to live on it. Then the sun will swallow the earth.

As a side note:
If you want to know the cause of global warming it is the sun getting larger getting closer to us thus producing more heat.

Son of Man writes:

hence God spoke the world into being?

The Bible makes no such declaration.

In fact the Hebrew word ברא says God created brought into existence the heavens and the earth. This did take place in one day as declared in Genesis 2:4. Using God's definition of day being a period of light as He call the light day.

The light period that ended when God created the darkness (Isaiah 45:7) that existed at Genesis 1:2 was one single light period with no light and dark periods. This will exist in the future as the new heaven and earth will have no need of the sun. Revelation 22:5.

Son of Man writes:

I along with many others believe that the earth has evolved,

Please explain to me what the universe and earth evolved from?

In other words what is the origin of the universe and everything in it?

Son of Man writes:

the universe it is still expanding,

quote:
Job 9:8 Which alone spreadeth out the heavens, and treadeth upon the waves of the sea.

Zechariah 12:1, Isaiah 40.22, 45:2 All these talk of a expanded heavens (universe).
Yes God spreadeth out the heavens.

Science draws a picture of a universe that is stretched out. But if the theory is that the space between what existed at T=0 + 1 billionth second is what is expanding the universe would be expanding in all directions and would be the shape of a globe.

Son of Man writes:

That said I don't believe that man has evolved along with this planet, man must have been placed here

So the universe and everything in it began to exist when there was non existence.

Yet you believe mankind could not have evolved as put forth by evolutionist. Why couldn't he begin to exist from non existence if everything else did?

But if he was place here who placed him here? If Aliens where did they come from? Who placed them where they were? There is no way to get away from a creator without everything beginning to exist from non existence. Which is an impossibility.

If you can understand what non existence is you should be able to understand why it is impossible. If you keep assuming existence then you will never understand non existence.

Son of Man writes:

I read science and the Bible open mindedly because they are both continuing to evolve

What was science in the 1800 hundreds has been proven to be false today. Then they blead people to treat things that were wrong with them. George Washington was bled to death.

But in the 1920's it was discovered that the life of the flesh was in the blood. Which was stated in Leviticus 17:11 2800 years before man discovered it.

Son of Man writes:

My Biblical journey

You need to go to the cross and receive Christ as your personal savior and start all over again.

God Bless,


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1266 by Son of Man, posted 11-27-2018 7:38 AM Son of Man has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1274 by Son of Man, posted 11-28-2018 1:47 PM ICANT has responded

    
creation
Member
Posts: 654
Joined: 01-22-2017


Message 1270 of 1358 (844276)
11-27-2018 4:45 PM
Reply to: Message 1267 by ringo
11-27-2018 11:14 AM


Re: Creation
Semantics game eh? Whatever you like to call it that existed after creation eventually broke up.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1267 by ringo, posted 11-27-2018 11:14 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1272 by ringo, posted 11-27-2018 7:41 PM creation has not yet responded

    
creation
Member
Posts: 654
Joined: 01-22-2017


Message 1271 of 1358 (844278)
11-27-2018 4:52 PM
Reply to: Message 1268 by ringo
11-27-2018 11:24 AM


Re: Creation
Or...we could spin a ball covered in frozen chocolate real fast suddenly, and see if it fractures...and maybe see if we get a pattern like the mid ocean ridges where it separates...or...we could..etc etc. Why would we imagine your belief based scenarios?

Since evolving/changing happened fast in the former times/nature, we should view the changes that happened as gifts of adaptability from God in a former nature where it happened fast. (not as some insane godless freakfest that happened slowly in this current nature, and started from pond slime or thermal vent sludge, or comet crud!)

Edited by creation, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1268 by ringo, posted 11-27-2018 11:24 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1273 by ringo, posted 11-27-2018 7:48 PM creation has responded

    
ringo
Member
Posts: 15740
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


(1)
Message 1272 of 1358 (844299)
11-27-2018 7:41 PM
Reply to: Message 1270 by creation
11-27-2018 4:45 PM


Re: Creation
creation writes:

Semantics game eh?


Not at all. I' m just pointing out that you don't think before you post.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1270 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 4:45 PM creation has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 15740
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


(1)
Message 1273 of 1358 (844300)
11-27-2018 7:48 PM
Reply to: Message 1271 by creation
11-27-2018 4:52 PM


Re: Creation
creation writes:

Or...we could spin a ball covered in frozen chocolate real fast suddenly, and see if it fractures.


No, that would not be a good model of the earth. Continental drift is not caused by spin.

creation writes:

Since evolving/changing happened fast in the former times/nature...


You must be too young to remember but creationists used to claim that evolution didn't happen at all. I think it's comical that they've given up their argumemts so thoroughly that now they have evolution happening impossibly fast. It's a sure sign that their only motivation is to scoff at science; they're not interested in truth or knowledge at all.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1271 by creation, posted 11-27-2018 4:52 PM creation has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1275 by creation, posted 11-28-2018 6:39 PM ringo has responded

  
Son of Man
Junior Member
Posts: 25
From: Ireland
Joined: 11-13-2018


Message 1274 of 1358 (844346)
11-28-2018 1:47 PM
Reply to: Message 1269 by ICANT
11-27-2018 11:58 AM


Re: Creation
ICANT writes:

At 10 years old I had read the Bible cover to cover twice by the time I was nine and was on my third time at ten. I brought a devotion at prayer meeting in November of 1949


I am trying to make the point that at some point in your life you were taken to a religious meeting and didn't go of your own free will, when was that point in time?

ICANT writes:

How could you possibly have an open mind at age 40


I had picked up the Bible twice before I was 40 and not a sentence of it made sense. at 39 or so I heard a talk on radio that mentioned brosnins Bible Code, after hearing this I opened the Bible and immediately saw it differently, I read Genesis creation and realised that it did not make any sense to be at the beginning, I soon found Revelation and that is when verses and stories somehow stud out like they where being highlighted in my mind. The first of these is at the foot of my posts. I could consider this to be spiritual help? All the stories were somehow locked in my mind until I found out how to use them. I have never been to a religious meeting in church or elsewhere unless forced. I see God in a totally different way to religious people, it is given away in the story of Adam and Eve? My first memory is that of the body i am in now only i was about 3 months old and led down in a coach built pram, my mother propped me up against the front of the pram and placed my older brother in front of me, I remember seeing me cry. the point being I remember being what some people call an orb, there are good orbs and bad dependent on how you lived your previous life, they are why you should be careful of what you wish for, I have never or will ever wish for anything, I know how it works. you are also responsible for what you say and what you write ( they watch you all the time).

ICANT writes:

This will exist in the future as the new heaven and earth will have no need of the sun. Revelation 22:5.

the light is the same as someone throwing light onto a subject I.e. now it makes sense?

as for your last question about evolving

I believe we were placed here by a far superior race than we are, we have a lot to learn about who we are as a race, the above tells you a small bit? not all can become heavenly if you do wrong you most likely will stay on the earthly plain? of course someone had to have evolved at some point in time, I like you cannot answer this, I do however know that there are more advanced civilisations than ours, I have seen spacecraft one of which was there in one second and gone before the next?

I would like some feedback on my work good or bad? I really don't mind which, it all helps


the first will be the last and the last will be the first.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1269 by ICANT, posted 11-27-2018 11:58 AM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1276 by ICANT, posted 11-28-2018 10:14 PM Son of Man has responded

  
creation
Member
Posts: 654
Joined: 01-22-2017


Message 1275 of 1358 (844366)
11-28-2018 6:39 PM
Reply to: Message 1273 by ringo
11-27-2018 7:48 PM


Re: Creation
How would we know the mechanism that started the plates moving? Have you forgotten that the theories of plate tectonics have only guessed?
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1273 by ringo, posted 11-27-2018 7:48 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1278 by ringo, posted 11-29-2018 11:01 AM creation has responded

    
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