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Author Topic:   Terrible news. Just terrible. Urgent issue (antibiotic resistant bacteria hits USA!)
Taq
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Posts: 9973
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.7


(4)
Message 30 of 42 (810222)
05-25-2017 6:29 PM
Reply to: Message 29 by LamarkNewAge
05-25-2017 5:14 PM


Re: Most deadly superbug (60% die) infected 122 this year (6 in 2016), 3/4 in NY City.
LamarckNewAge writes:
I find it so amazing that the same publication that obsesses so much over the tiny number of terrorism induced deaths, over the years, also gives this lady such a prominent opinion box. From totally insignificant (the terrorist attacks ) to existentially & vitally concerning (superbugs ) .
I would suggest some perspective on the whole issue. For 200,000 years humans fought back against infections without any effective treatments. We seemed to have made it through in one piece.
I have personally worked with antibiotics that are still very effective against MRSA, and other pathogens such as Group A Strep (i.e. flesh eating bacteria) are still very sensitive to most of the classic antibiotics in almost all cases (e.g. penicillin, clindamycin). In fact, I will be at a massive conference next week on these very topics, so maybe I can bring back some updates for you.
I'm not saying that we shouldn't worry about antibiotic resistance in common human pathogens, but it isn't the Apocalypse either.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by LamarkNewAge, posted 05-25-2017 5:14 PM LamarkNewAge has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 31 by NoNukes, posted 05-26-2017 12:31 AM Taq has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9973
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.7


Message 33 of 42 (811349)
06-07-2017 11:29 AM
Reply to: Message 31 by NoNukes
05-26-2017 12:31 AM


Re: Most deadly superbug (60% die) infected 122 this year (6 in 2016), 3/4 in NY City.
NoNukes writes:
Cool! I have yet to read anything about this issue that does not sound like the coming of the apocalypse. I look forward to the updates if you can do that.
Got back from the conference yesterday and not a whole lot to report. Most of my time was spent on lectures and posters on other subjects, but I really didn't see anything on a superbug that was resistant to all known antibiotics. What I did see was tons of posters on new antibiotics that were active against bugs that had gained resistance to other antibiotics.
In other news, I attended an interesting symposium on the coevolution of microbiomes and their hosts. As it turns out, the phylogeny of gut bacteria follows the phylogeny of their hosts, especially when there is enough evolutionary distance between species to produce a strong phylogenetic signal. On top of that, transferring the gut bacteria from one species into another can cause disease or developmental issues, at least in the insect gut models that were presented.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 31 by NoNukes, posted 05-26-2017 12:31 AM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 34 by LamarkNewAge, posted 06-07-2017 6:26 PM Taq has replied
 Message 37 by LamarkNewAge, posted 06-08-2017 10:42 PM Taq has replied
 Message 41 by NoNukes, posted 06-09-2017 2:20 PM Taq has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9973
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.7


Message 35 of 42 (811459)
06-08-2017 11:07 AM
Reply to: Message 34 by LamarkNewAge
06-07-2017 6:26 PM


Re: Most deadly superbug (60% die) infected 122 this year (6 in 2016), 3/4 in NY City.
LamarckNewAge writes:
So what happens when a bug eats another bug?
Since they tend to be about the same size that isn't what usually happens. Instead, bacteria can release what are called bacteriocins which can cause surrounding bacteria to die and then break apart. The bacteria then soak up the resulting detritus.
This is the bacteria that humans get from the mothers vagina during birth, right? Something that a person needs as part of their internal microbiota?
That is also a very interesting lecture that I attended. As it turns out, vaginal and caesarean birth can have a big impact on the baby's gut flora. It does appear that vaginal birth allows the mother to seed the baby's gut flora. A caesarean birth results in a gut flora that has different ratios of standard bacterial groups which begins to resemble baby's from natural births after about a year.
I heard recently that a child benefits greatly to be around a dog in the early years. All the licking helps to create a resistance to bacteria, and the benefit comes only (?) when exposed in the early years.
I remember something about that, but it is a bit murkier. I think it has something to do with "training" T-cells, if my faulty memory is correct.
Hear anything about phages (phago in Greek has to do with eating and SAR means flesh,so sarcophagus means flesh eater ) ?
Flesh eaters? They eat bacteria, right?
Any mouth wash news?
There were posters and talks on phage, but I didn't attend any of those. I don't remember anything on mouthwash.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 34 by LamarkNewAge, posted 06-07-2017 6:26 PM LamarkNewAge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by LamarkNewAge, posted 06-08-2017 10:24 PM Taq has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9973
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.7


Message 39 of 42 (811586)
06-09-2017 11:19 AM
Reply to: Message 36 by LamarkNewAge
06-08-2017 10:24 PM


Re: Most deadly superbug (60% die) infected 122 this year (6 in 2016), 3/4 in NY City.
So the bacteria commonly get killed and then detritus gets soaked up by the host's bacteria?
This is true in some cases. In other cases, it is disease-causing bacteria that kill off the host flora and cause an infection. In other cases, the host flora just outcompetes any disease-causing bacteria or bacteria from other sources.
This is also why people can come down with serious infections after taking antibiotics, which happens to be research I am very familiar with. One of the prime examples is Clostridium difficile colitis which often occurs after a patient takes antibiotics and wipes out their normal flora. C. diff moves in and produces a serious and sometimes chronic and recurring infection. A lot of effort is being put into finding antibiotics that do a better job of preserving a patient's normal flora to prevent these types of opportunistic infections.
How does this relate to evolution and the progressive changes in species?
Evolution in the host can cause the bacteria's environment to change, and the bacteria evolve to that new environment. This process can also occur in the other direction. This process is broadly termed "co-evolution".
One of the interesting presentations I saw was how this type of co-evolution can aid in speciation. They cross bred two wasp species and saw that the hybrid larvae were not as viable as the larvae from intraspecies breeding. What they found is that the gut flora inherited from the mother was not compatible with the hybrid larvae and caused them to be less fit than larvae from intraspecies breeding. Their gut flora had evolved with each species to the point that they were not as compatible with the other species.
Edited by Taq, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by LamarkNewAge, posted 06-08-2017 10:24 PM LamarkNewAge has not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9973
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.7


Message 40 of 42 (811587)
06-09-2017 11:33 AM
Reply to: Message 37 by LamarkNewAge
06-08-2017 10:42 PM


Re: Most deadly superbug (60% die) infected 122 this year (6 in 2016), 3/4 in NY City.
LarmarckNewAge writes:
Are you saying that the typical event of the custody transfer ( for lack of a better description ) is a bad result in action.?
The transfer of maternal flora to child is usually considered a good thing.
What exactly was "new" before (the lecture you just heard ) and then your description of what is "newer" (post lecture things ) now?
I am not up on all of the literature in that specific field, so I can't confidently answer that question. However, research presented at meetings is usually the latest and newest stuff, so I can pass that on with hopes that it can answer your question.
In the previous study I talked about dealing with the natural v. caesarean births, part of that study was comparing the bacterial genomes found in the mother and child. They were able to track specific lineages of bacteria by measuring single nucleotide polymorphisms (i.e. SNP, or "snips"). Using this information they were able to demonstrate the age at which mother's flora appeared in the baby's gut. With caesarean delivery the mother's flora began appearing at about 1 year, but with natural child birth the mother's flora appeared right after birth.
This type of specific DNA information is probably the latest development in this type of research. They are able to screen vast amounts DNA and RNA to characterize and track complex communities of bacteria. A good analogy is the advancement of CPU speeds over the last 30 years. The ability to produce genetic data has somewhat followed Moore's law. It took a decade to sequence the first human genome, but now a single human genome can be sequenced in a matter of weeks (although with somewhat less coverage and accuracy compared to the human genome project). To use the computer analogy again, they have faster computers, and they have learned how to make multiple faster computers work in parallel with each other.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by LamarkNewAge, posted 06-08-2017 10:42 PM LamarkNewAge has not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9973
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.7


Message 42 of 42 (811611)
06-09-2017 3:41 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by NoNukes
06-09-2017 2:20 PM


Re: Most deadly superbug (60% die) infected 122 this year (6 in 2016), 3/4 in NY City.
NoNukes writes:
Thanks for bringing back the info. New antibiotics is at least some good news.
The bad news is that new antibiotics are about $2-3k for a full round, at least here in the US.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 41 by NoNukes, posted 06-09-2017 2:20 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
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