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Author Topic:   The Trump Presidency
Chiroptera
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Oklahoma
Joined: 09-28-2003
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 2296 of 2435 (837463)
08-02-2018 9:09 AM


Non-citizen voting
Just to make sure that it's clear, as everyone has pointed out, federal law prohibits non-citizens from voting in federal elections; it does not forbid non-citizens from voting in local or state elections. I suspect an attempt to do so would raise Constitutional issues.

Through the history of the Republic, many localities have allowed non-citizens to vote off and on in local elections. What's happening in San Francisco is nothing new in the US - although not common, either. It's mostly the current political climate that makes it note worthy.

Edited by Chiroptera, : Hit submit before I was done.



Oh, God! Pride of Man, broken in the dust again! -- Quicksilver Messenger Service

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 17584
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 2297 of 2435 (837464)
08-02-2018 9:24 AM


Trump's Grocery Store ID Claim
During Tuesday night's rally Trump said, "You know, if you go out and you want to buy groceries, you need a picture on a card — you need ID.”

I do the grocery shopping for our family. I have never been asked for a photo ID. Everything I've read in the news indicates that there are no grocery stores requiring a photo ID.

When asked to explain the president's comments Sarah Huckster Sanders implied he was talking about beer and wine. I buy a few bottles of wine every couple months. I've never been asked for any ID of any kind. The New Hampshire Liquor Commission, Division of Enforcement & Licensing Compliance Checks Policy says (bold underlining in the original):

quote:
III.a.i.1. For the purposes of RSA 179:7, any person making the sale of beverages or liquor to any person whose age is in question (emphasis added) shall require the purchaser to furnish any of the following documentation that such person is 21 years of age or over:...etc...

Here's the YouTube video of Trump making these absurd comments. It's only 1'25" long. There is no murmuring rumble of "say what?" from the crowd as Trump says you need photo ID in grocery stores and wherever you buy things. I shop all the time in Walmart, Home Depot, Lowes, Bed, Bath and Beyond, grocery stores and restaurants, and I'm never, ever asked for a photo ID.

What Trump says makes no sense, but the crowd eats it up anyway. Wasn't it just a few years ago that conservatives were railing loudly against a national ID when it became a topic of discussion? So there we have more evidence that a) Trump is not a conservative; and b) Trump's followers aren't conservatives, either, they're just Trump lovers who cheer (or boo as appropriate) anything he says. For how many more years is he going to rouse his crowds to cheer, "Lock her up! Lock her up!" It's ridiculous, absurd and terrifying all at the same time.

I'm trying to remember the places where I am asked for photo ID. Doctor's offices is the only one I can think of. They seem really concerned about making sure you're really who you say you are.

AbE: And my bank. They require photo ID for certain things, like opening up a new customer bank account, or closing on a mortgage, or anything to do with a trust.

--Percy

Edited by Percy, : AbE.


Replies to this message:
 Message 2299 by NoNukes, posted 08-02-2018 12:28 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply
 Message 2301 by Chiroptera, posted 08-02-2018 3:23 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

    
Chiroptera
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Oklahoma
Joined: 09-28-2003
Member Rating: 2.8


(1)
Message 2298 of 2435 (837466)
08-02-2018 9:42 AM
Reply to: Message 2295 by Percy
08-02-2018 8:51 AM


A feature, not a bug
...but on the other hand requiring documentary evidence will self-evidently reduce the voter rolls of the poor the most.

Which is really the point of the documentation requirements. Whatever the paranoid fears they're stoking in the base, Republican bigwigs don't actually care that much about illegal Mexicans voting; the purpose is to put obstacles in the way of black people voting.



Oh, God! Pride of Man, broken in the dust again! -- Quicksilver Messenger Service

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2295 by Percy, posted 08-02-2018 8:51 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
NoNukes
Member
Posts: 10870
From: Central NC USA
Joined: 08-13-2010
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 2299 of 2435 (837468)
08-02-2018 12:28 PM
Reply to: Message 2297 by Percy
08-02-2018 9:24 AM


Re: Trump's Grocery Store ID Claim
During Tuesday night's rally Trump said, "You know, if you go out and you want to buy groceries, you need a picture on a card — you need ID.”

Trump is not the first president to reveal that he does not buy his own groceries. I do recall that my parents used to write checks for everything including groceries. You were very likely to be asked for ID during those days.

When asked to explain the president's comments Sarah Huckster Sanders implied he was talking about beer and wine.

Nice improv by Sarah. But if you appear to be over 30 something, nobody is going to ask for ID.

I'm trying to remember the places where I am asked for photo ID. Doctor's offices is the only one I can think of. They seem really concerned about making sure you're really who you say you are

Just about anything you do at the DMV including registering to vote. Visit a prisoner, board an airplane. There are a few things.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

"Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”

We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World.

Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith

I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith

No it is based on math I studied in sixth grade, just plain old addition, substraction and multiplication. -- ICANT


This message is a reply to:
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Chiroptera
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Oklahoma
Joined: 09-28-2003
Member Rating: 2.8


(1)
Message 2300 of 2435 (837469)
08-02-2018 1:40 PM
Reply to: Message 2295 by Percy
08-02-2018 8:51 AM


The consent of the governed
I wanted to respond to this part in a separate comment since it may be off topic. Also, I don't intend to debate it: I just want to point out that there are differences of opinion.

-

On the one hand it seems only right that we insure that only citizens vote....

Me, I feel that all legal residents should be allowed to vote. You have to obey the laws where you live, so you should have a say on what those laws are.



Oh, God! Pride of Man, broken in the dust again! -- Quicksilver Messenger Service

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2295 by Percy, posted 08-02-2018 8:51 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Chiroptera
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Oklahoma
Joined: 09-28-2003
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 2301 of 2435 (837470)
08-02-2018 3:23 PM
Reply to: Message 2297 by Percy
08-02-2018 9:24 AM


Re: Trump's Grocery Store ID Claim
I'm trying to remember the places where I am asked for photo ID.

When I bought my cell phone (ATT), I was required to show a picture ID as well as a bill of some sort to show proof of address.



Oh, God! Pride of Man, broken in the dust again! -- Quicksilver Messenger Service

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2297 by Percy, posted 08-02-2018 9:24 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
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ringo
Member
Posts: 14920
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 2302 of 2435 (837472)
08-02-2018 3:33 PM
Reply to: Message 2301 by Chiroptera
08-02-2018 3:23 PM


Re: Trump's Grocery Store ID Claim
When I bought my cell phone (ATT), I was required to show a picture ID as well as a bill of some sort to show proof of address.

I don't have photo ID. Never did. Never will.

I had to show two pieces of ID, including one with an address to get a library card.

I need the same ID to vote, which I find disturbing. I never used to need any kind of ID to vote.


And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2301 by Chiroptera, posted 08-02-2018 3:23 PM Chiroptera has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2303 by Chiroptera, posted 08-02-2018 3:45 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
Chiroptera
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Oklahoma
Joined: 09-28-2003
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 2303 of 2435 (837473)
08-02-2018 3:45 PM
Reply to: Message 2302 by ringo
08-02-2018 3:33 PM


Re: Trump's Grocery Store ID Claim
I do have a photo ID (actually, two: my passport and a state ID card). But I don't carry either of them with me except in the very few occasions I know that I'll need to show them to someone to transact my business.


Oh, God! Pride of Man, broken in the dust again! -- Quicksilver Messenger Service

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2302 by ringo, posted 08-02-2018 3:33 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 7519
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 3.5


(4)
Message 2304 of 2435 (837474)
08-02-2018 3:52 PM
Reply to: Message 2291 by marc9000
08-01-2018 9:14 PM


Re: .50 Cal Jesus Kills for your Sins
marc9000 writes:

In short, I hope every leftist keeps claiming that there is no desire for illegals to vote, and that the mainstream media isn't biased. And we'll see how the elections go this November.

The purpose of voter ID laws is not to keep illegals from voting, but to keep American citizens from voting. Specifically, to keep minority citizens from voting.

I am also on record as saying some of the media is very biased. Fox News is a perfect example.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2291 by marc9000, posted 08-01-2018 9:14 PM marc9000 has responded

Replies to this message:
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ringo
Member
Posts: 14920
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.1


(3)
Message 2305 of 2435 (837475)
08-02-2018 4:17 PM
Reply to: Message 2291 by marc9000
08-01-2018 9:14 PM


Re: .50 Cal Jesus Kills for your Sins
marc9000 writes:

In short, I hope every leftist keeps claiming that there is no desire for illegals to vote....


My question is: Why don't you want them to vote? Are you afraid of what they might vote for? Fair treatment, maybe? The kind of things your government is sworn to uphold? Heaven knows you don't want a bunch of people coming in and pressuring the government to do what it's supposed to do.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2291 by marc9000, posted 08-01-2018 9:14 PM marc9000 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2354 by marc9000, posted 08-05-2018 4:57 PM ringo has responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 17584
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 2306 of 2435 (837480)
08-03-2018 7:09 AM


Is the Trump lying getting worse?
Yesterday in Washington National Security Adviser John Bolton said Trump was driving his security team to repel Russian attacks on our elections:

quote:
“President Trump has not and will not tolerate interference in America’s system of representative government … The issue was discussed and in fact President Putin said … the first issue President Trump raised was election meddling.”

At the same time Trump was at a campaign rally in Pennsylvania calling Russian election meddling a hoax:

quote:
“In Helsinki, I had a great meeting with Putin. We discussed everything, We got along really well. By the way, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. That’s a really good thing. Now, we are being hindered by the Russian hoax. It’s a hoax, okay?”

So which is it? Are we taking Russian election meddling seriously, or do we consider that it ever happened a hoax?
Somebody's lying.

Source

--Percy

Edited by Percy, : Grammar.


Replies to this message:
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Percy
Member
Posts: 17584
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 2307 of 2435 (837481)
08-03-2018 7:21 AM


What's going on with the Russian sanctions?
A US Senator, I think Linsey Graham (R-SC), said today on NPR that Trump not only delayed the Russian sanctions Congress imposed earlier this year, which we knew, but that he has not implemented all of them, which we didn't.

Which sanctions is Trump failing to implement? If Trump is truly picking and choosing which sanctions to implement I couldn't find this information. I think knowing which sanctions Trump isn't implementing would tell us a lot about who or what is pulling the presidents strings and causing his obsequious behavior toward Russia.

Graham, or whichever senator it was, was being interviewed at a press conference where a bipartisan group of senators announced the initiation of legislation to put even tougher sanctions on Russia. Whether it makes it through this session is doubtful since there's little time left before the Senate adjourns in November.

--Percy


Replies to this message:
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Percy
Member
Posts: 17584
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 2308 of 2435 (837483)
08-03-2018 7:37 AM


Trump's Complete Abrogation of Responsibility for Family Separation
About 2000 immigrant children have been reunited with their families, but about 500 remain because their parents were already deported. Charged by Judge Sabraw with developing a plan for reuniting the remaining children with their families the government completely abrogated their responsibility. In a completely embarrassing and despicable display of asking others to clean up their mess, the government has asked the ACLU to find missing migrant parents

Locating these parents will be a difficult task. They fled their home countries because of civil unrest or gang violence or domestic abuse, and so once deported home most would naturally go into hiding. They won't be easy to find. But the government created this problem, and it's their responsibility to solve it, not the ACLU. The ACLU has already done their job taking the government to court and forcing action.

Not every parent wants to be reunited with their children. Some see leaving their children behind in the US as the safest and most advantageous for them. But the US has no record of which parents voluntarily separated from their children and which did not. No interviews were conducted. Each parent or parents needs to be located and a thorough interview conducted that includes making sure the parent or parents understand any decisions they make. Documentation must be created. The US government should take a lesson from the Nazis who at least carefully documented all their crimes.

The parties will be in court again today.

--Percy

Edited by Percy, : Typo.


    
jar
Member
Posts: 30717
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 2309 of 2435 (837484)
08-03-2018 8:06 AM
Reply to: Message 2307 by Percy
08-03-2018 7:21 AM


Re: What's going on with the Russian sanctions?
Percy writes:

Which sanctions is Trump failing to implement?

IIRC he eased the sanctions on Russian steel and aluminum giant that is link closely to Putin, Rusal, and also eased the Obama era sanction and will allow US technology products meant for consumers to be exported to Russia. Of course many consumer level technology products can also be used for industrial and military purposes.

AbE: The sanctions mentioned above were eased in April BUT there is more recent evidence as well.

A July 24th. report on the Defense Authorization bill says the House and Senate agreed to allow Trump to waive sanctions on Russia or entities dealing with Russia without even first asking for approval from Congress.

Edited by jar, : see AbE


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
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Percy
Member
Posts: 17584
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 2310 of 2435 (837486)
08-03-2018 3:21 PM


Honest reporting from Fox News! Who woulda thought!
Everyone's heard of Trump lap dog Sean Hannity, but probably few of Shep Smith, who has a 3 PM news show on Fox. In this video Smith debunks one Hannity claim after another. Enjoy:

As the Huffington Post put it, this year's Fox Christmas party might be a bit awkward.

--Percy


Replies to this message:
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