Understanding through Discussion


Welcome! You are not logged in. [ Login ]
EvC Forum active members: 114 (8796 total)
Current session began: 
Page Loaded: 10-23-2017 10:18 PM
338 online now:
Chatting now:  Chat room empty
Newest Member: jaufre
Upcoming Birthdays: DrJones*, willietern
Post Volume:
Total: 821,118 Year: 25,724/21,208 Month: 1,351/2,338 Week: 108/364 Day: 59/49 Hour: 0/1

Announcements: Reporting debate problems OR discussing moderation actions/inactions


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
RewPrev1
...
2021
22
2324
...
64NextFF
Author Topic:   The Totalitarian Leftist Tactics against the Right
jar
Member
Posts: 29473
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 316 of 960 (802199)
03-13-2017 7:13 AM
Reply to: Message 315 by Faith
03-13-2017 5:48 AM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
Faith, learn to read what you quote. Note the weasel wording and innuendo instead of stating facts.

quote:
"Well, if you look at some people connected with Hillary Clinton during her campaign, you would probably see that he had lots of meetings of that kind," Dmitry Peskov told CNN "GPS" host Fareed Zakaria.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 315 by Faith, posted 03-13-2017 5:48 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 318 by Faith, posted 03-13-2017 12:01 PM jar has responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 16041
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.0


Message 317 of 960 (802200)
03-13-2017 7:37 AM
Reply to: Message 315 by Faith
03-13-2017 5:48 AM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
Faith writes:

This story might belong better on a thread about the election...

You mean like The 2016 United States Presidential Election?

The relevance is that the Left has been pushing hard on the fake news...

Fake polls, fake news would also have been a good thread for your post, but Adminnemooseus dropped it into summation mode for being hopelessly off-topic, suggesting that another thread for the topic be opened for discussing fake news.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 315 by Faith, posted 03-13-2017 5:48 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 319 by Faith, posted 03-13-2017 12:02 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 26455
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 318 of 960 (802206)
03-13-2017 12:01 PM
Reply to: Message 316 by jar
03-13-2017 7:13 AM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
And here I thought if I got it from Yahoo news rather than a conservative site it would be more acceptable. Now it's clear that if I'm the one posting it, nothing will be acceptable.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 316 by jar, posted 03-13-2017 7:13 AM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 320 by jar, posted 03-13-2017 12:26 PM Faith has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 26455
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 319 of 960 (802207)
03-13-2017 12:02 PM
Reply to: Message 317 by Percy
03-13-2017 7:37 AM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
I forgot about the earlier election thread and I knew about the fake news thread being closed, but I didn't want to start a new thread. I didn't think there would be that much to debate.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 317 by Percy, posted 03-13-2017 7:37 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply

    
jar
Member
Posts: 29473
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 320 of 960 (802208)
03-13-2017 12:26 PM
Reply to: Message 318 by Faith
03-13-2017 12:01 PM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
Faith writes:

And here I thought if I got it from Yahoo news rather than a conservative site it would be more acceptable. Now it's clear that if I'm the one posting it, nothing will be acceptable.

It's not the source Faith but rather the content. What you posted is a classic example of innuendo, weasel wording, attempts to misdirect attention while the pea is palmed, goal post moving, all of the classic conman tactics.

If you like we can step through the quote line by line.


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 318 by Faith, posted 03-13-2017 12:01 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 321 by Faith, posted 03-13-2017 3:07 PM jar has responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 26455
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 321 of 960 (802218)
03-13-2017 3:07 PM
Reply to: Message 320 by jar
03-13-2017 12:26 PM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
No I don't want to go through it with you, but I would like to know what you are concluding: the story is made up, totally, partially, what?

Interesting that The Hill turns out to be "Left-Center" on this ranking:

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-hill/

...which would lead me to expect it to be skewed in the direction of implying the usual allegations about Trump's supposedly having unacceptable Russian connections. Instead the whole point seems to be that he didn't.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 320 by jar, posted 03-13-2017 12:26 PM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 322 by jar, posted 03-13-2017 3:48 PM Faith has not yet responded
 Message 323 by xongsmith, posted 03-13-2017 5:05 PM Faith has responded

    
jar
Member
Posts: 29473
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 322 of 960 (802220)
03-13-2017 3:48 PM
Reply to: Message 321 by Faith
03-13-2017 3:07 PM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
Faith writes:

No I don't want to go through it with you, but I would like to know what you are concluding: the story is made up, totally, partially, what?

My conclusion is that it is classic damage control propaganda. It is of no value since it really says nothing.


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 321 by Faith, posted 03-13-2017 3:07 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
xongsmith
Member
Posts: 1813
From: massachusetts US
Joined: 01-01-2009
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 323 of 960 (802224)
03-13-2017 5:05 PM
Reply to: Message 321 by Faith
03-13-2017 3:07 PM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
Faith deluded spouts:

Interesting that The Hill turns out to be "Left-Center"...

According to RAZD's chart in Message 443 they are Right-Center.


- xongsmith, 5.7d

This message is a reply to:
 Message 321 by Faith, posted 03-13-2017 3:07 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 325 by Faith, posted 03-13-2017 10:21 PM xongsmith has acknowledged this reply

    
nwr
Member
Posts: 5538
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 3.9


(4)
Message 324 of 960 (802227)
03-13-2017 5:56 PM
Reply to: Message 315 by Faith
03-13-2017 5:48 AM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
According to this Russian representative there were meetings between the Russian ambassador and both Trump's and Clinton's people, and none of it had anything to do with the election.

This isn't particularly relevant.

Everyone understands that there are legitimate reasons to talk to the Russians. If Trump had legitimate reasons, he could have said so, and indicated the reasons. Instead, he lied. He denied meeting them. The problem is this pattern of lying that looks like a cover up, and looks as if he has something hide.

And the pattern of lying has continued.


Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity

This message is a reply to:
 Message 315 by Faith, posted 03-13-2017 5:48 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 326 by Faith, posted 03-13-2017 10:23 PM nwr has acknowledged this reply

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 26455
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 325 of 960 (802240)
03-13-2017 10:21 PM
Reply to: Message 323 by xongsmith
03-13-2017 5:05 PM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
Well, follow my link: Fact Checker says Left-center.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 323 by xongsmith, posted 03-13-2017 5:05 PM xongsmith has acknowledged this reply

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 26455
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 326 of 960 (802241)
03-13-2017 10:23 PM
Reply to: Message 324 by nwr
03-13-2017 5:56 PM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
There is no lie where the question was understood to be about the campaign. That was the same thing Sessions was accused of. He answered truthfully according to the question as he understood it.

Liberals know all this, know that it's common to meet with Russians and others, for them and Republicans both. This is just the Left on its witch hunt as usual, trying to drum up something against Trump even if they have to make it out of thin air. They can make it look like a cover up to people who don't know anything about this stuff, when it's nothing of the sort.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 324 by nwr, posted 03-13-2017 5:56 PM nwr has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 327 by Rrhain, posted 03-14-2017 3:35 AM Faith has responded

    
Rrhain
Member
Posts: 6182
From: San Diego, CA, USA
Joined: 05-03-2003
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 327 of 960 (802247)
03-14-2017 3:35 AM
Reply to: Message 326 by Faith
03-13-2017 10:23 PM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
Faith writes:

quote:
There is no lie where the question was understood to be about the campaign. That was the same thing Sessions was accused of. He answered truthfully according to the question as he understood it.

That's a lie, Faith, and you know it because I posted the video of the interaction between Franken and Sessions here in Message 523. Here it is again:

Here is the exact exchange between Franken and Sessions:

Franken: "CNN just published a story alleging that the intelligence community provided documents to the president-elect last week that included information that quote, ‘Russian operatives claimed to have compromising personal and financial information about Mr. Trump.’ These documents also allegedly say quote, ‘There was a continuing exchange of information during the campaign between Trump's surrogates and intermediaries for the Russian government.’

"Now, again, I'm telling you this as it's coming out, so you know. But if it's true, it's obviously extremely serious and if there is any evidence that anyone affiliated with the Trump campaign communicated with the Russian government in the course of this campaign, what will you do?"

Sessions: "Senator Franken, I'm not aware of any of those activities. I have been called a surrogate at a time or two in that campaign and I didn't have — did not have communications with the Russians, and I'm unable to comment on it."

Here's video of it:

The hearing where Sessions denies contact with Russia

You will note that Franken wasn't asking about "casual contacts" but whether or not there was any contact of any kind.

To which Sessions flat out denied having any communication with the Russians.

That was a lie. He now admits to having talked to them twice. And those only because we found evidence of them.

He now claims that he doesn't remember what he talked about. Again, as Franken pointed out, if he doesn't remember what he talked about, then he certainly doesn't remember what he DIDN'T talk about.

Take a good look at what Franken asks, Frank.

Notice how he isn't asking if Sessions had any contact with Russian agents. He's asking what Sessions would do if he discovered that members of the Trump campaign had contact with the Russians.

Sessions then volunteers on his own that he never had any contact with the Russians.

So how on earth can you claim that he "answered truthfully according to the question as he understood it"? He wasn't asked if he had contact with the Russians. He was asked what he would do if he found out someone else had contact with the Russians.

So when we find out that he did have contact with the Russians at least two times (and once during the Republican National Convention around the time that the Republican platform was being altered to remove their statements about the Ukraine and thus become more friendly to Russia...and remember that Sessions was Trump's foreign policy advisor), to claim that he "answered the question" is simply false. He was never asked if he had contact with the Russians.

He volunteered that information on his own.

quote:
Liberals know all this, know that it's common to meet with Russians and others, for them and Republicans both.

Yep.

Which is why it's so odd for someone who has legitimate reasons to talk to Russians to claim that he's never talked to them. If you know you've talked to the Russians and you know that your contact with them was in your capacity as a Senator, why lie about it? That's why Trump's attempt to tar Schumer fell so flat: The pictures were of a public meeting between Schumer and Putin regarding the selling of a gas station that was owned by a Russian company...which Schumer did not deny. They were in physical proximity, but there was no conversation between them and any words they did share were recorded by the press.

And Schumer didn't lie about it. He didn't say that he never met Putin. And he certainly didn't make that claim when asked an unrelated question.

This is just you on your foolishness as usual, trying to dumb up everything, even if you have to lie. You try to make it look like nothing happened to people who don't know anything about this stuff, when it's nothing of the sort.


Rrhain

Thank you for your submission to Science. Your paper was reviewed by a jury of seventh graders so that they could look for balance and to allow them to make up their own minds. We are sorry to say that they found your paper "bogus," specifically describing the section on the laboratory work "boring." We regret that we will be unable to publish your work at this time.

Minds are like parachutes. Just because you've lost yours doesn't mean you can use mine.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 326 by Faith, posted 03-13-2017 10:23 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 328 by Faith, posted 03-14-2017 7:05 AM Rrhain has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 26455
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 328 of 960 (802256)
03-14-2017 7:05 AM
Reply to: Message 327 by Rrhain
03-14-2017 3:35 AM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
Put it in a brief sentence or stick to one link with a brief sentence of commentary. Not only do I find most of what you say stupid and irrelevant, you write too much.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 327 by Rrhain, posted 03-14-2017 3:35 AM Rrhain has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 329 by Theodoric, posted 03-14-2017 8:50 AM Faith has not yet responded
 Message 330 by Rrhain, posted 03-14-2017 8:52 AM Faith has not yet responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 5772
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 9.3


(1)
Message 329 of 960 (802264)
03-14-2017 8:50 AM
Reply to: Message 328 by Faith
03-14-2017 7:05 AM


Faith. Enough of the attacks and insults.
Not only do I find most of what you say stupid and irrelevant, you write too much.

Maybe it is time for you to take a break. I know you get a lot more leeway from the Admins than anyone else, but you have devolved to nothing more than personal attacks.

I send my 7 year old off to school everyday with the telling him to think before he does things. To not get in trouble for something he does that if he just took a moment to think he wouldn't do.

I implore you to do the same thing. I have said I would no longer feed the troll. I just have one thing to say Stop acting like child and think before you post. If your post has a personal attack do not post it. Do not respond unless you have something substantive to say. The level of the discourse has dropped to the lowest denominator. Faith, you, are responsible for that.

Edited by Theodoric, : No reason given.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 328 by Faith, posted 03-14-2017 7:05 AM Faith has not yet responded

    
Rrhain
Member
Posts: 6182
From: San Diego, CA, USA
Joined: 05-03-2003
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 330 of 960 (802265)
03-14-2017 8:52 AM
Reply to: Message 328 by Faith
03-14-2017 7:05 AM


Re: Russian ambassador talked to both Hillary and Trump, not about election
Faith responds to me:

quote:
Put it in a brief sentence or stick to one link with a brief sentence of commentary. Not only do I find most of what you say stupid and irrelevant, you write too much.

Read: You're absolutely right, but I can't think of any way to deny it, so I'll just ignore it all and claim that it's "stupid and irrelevant."

Franken didn't ask Sessions if he met with the Russians.

Sessions volunteered that information on his own. And it turns out that it was a lie.

Thus, any claim that Sessions "honestly answered the question" is a lie.

Follow the link, Faith, and watch it for yourself. It's been presented to you twice. Why do you refuse?


Rrhain

Thank you for your submission to Science. Your paper was reviewed by a jury of seventh graders so that they could look for balance and to allow them to make up their own minds. We are sorry to say that they found your paper "bogus," specifically describing the section on the laboratory work "boring." We regret that we will be unable to publish your work at this time.

Minds are like parachutes. Just because you've lost yours doesn't mean you can use mine.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 328 by Faith, posted 03-14-2017 7:05 AM Faith has not yet responded

    
RewPrev1
...
2021
22
2324
...
64NextFF
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2015 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.0 Beta
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2017