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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Gay Marriage as an attack on Christianity | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
To continue from the Fake News thread where it was off topic,
Except for the fact that the punishment is mild compared to torture, beheading, being eaten by lions and buried alive, there is nothing in principle different between a Christian's being required to worship Caesar or Nebuchadnezzar and being required to do something that to the Christian conscience implies acceptance of anything else that God has absolutely forbidden, such as gay marriage. Rrhain in Message 699 is claiming there is nothing special about catering a wedding so Christians can't claim there is, we have to believe him instead of the Bible and our conscience. There's probably nothing that will get the point across to him, but just to repeat it: A wedding cake is usually a custom affair made especially for the occasion, according to specifications given by the customer, it's not a generic cake you can buy from the display case. It's also not like a birthday cake since Christians have no reason to object to gays or anybody else celebrating a birthday. They can have all the custom features on their birthday cake they want. What they can't have from a Christian baker is a special order for a gay wedding because that puts the baker in the position of treating the wedding as legitimate, and nothing rrhain has to say about it makes one iota of difference to that fact. God has decreed what marriage is, and has told us that homosexual acts are sin; that makes gay marriage a slap in God's face, which we will not participate in. Where there is a law requiring us to accept gay marriage we simply cannot obey it and must take the punishment. The same is true for a florist asked to design arrangements for a gay wedding. They can buy all the flowers they want and do the arrangements themselves, but a Christian florist cannot do it for them because that puts him or her in the position of treating the wedding as legitimate. The florist could of course design arrangements for them for any other kind of event. Same for a Christian photographer. Again, the photographer could take pictures for any other kind of party, just not a gay wedding. This has been discussed over and over at EvC but I guess no subject here ever reaches an actual finale. In Message 700 RR continues:
rr writes: Faith writes: You are entitled to your view of it, but so are the Christians who won't perform certain actions because they understand them as legitimizing something the Bible condemns. Nope.The law doesn't care what your "point of view" is. Do you think you have a religious exemption to the law? Why is this so hard to understand? Are you unaware that we were a Christian society up until very recently, which would never have dreamed of legalizing something as antichristian as "gay marriage?" Now that the west is regressing to paganism we have increasingly pagan laws which eagerly shove Christianity off the map. SO we now do NOT have religious freedom, we are subject to paganism, and in such a legal circumstance we have no choice but to obey God rather than man and take the consequences. Capiche?
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
How amazing that nonChristians believe they can tell us what it means to be obedient to God or not. What chutzpah. At least five different Christian business owners independently understood that it was forbidden by God to use their business to cater a gay wedding, but any old unbeliever can tell us they're wrong.
Just proof that paganism rules I guess. But who cares, we'll follow our conscience whether you get it or not and take the punishment. Sheesh. No it is not about general "discrimination," it's specifically about gay marriage. And again, who are you to tell us what it's about?
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Oh yeah, we have to hear about that old canard again too.
That's one of the laws specifically given to Israel and nobody else to teach them spiritual truths and to set them apart from the heathen nations. They apply to nobody but ancient Israel. Other laws were fulfilled by Christ.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
No it doesn't. It's one of the moral laws, which applies to everyone everywhere in all time, because it's of the Moral Law that runs the universe. It's usually included in preaching about the Ten Commandments under the prohibition of adultery. It is not one of the "ceremonial" laws which apply to Israel only.
Who cares what "sounds silly" to you? The spiritual meaning of some of the ceremonial laws applies to everybody too but it would be ridiculous to try to discuss that with you. ABE: Consider it symbolic of adultery. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Great. So we'll obey God anyway and you can punish us for it.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Ah well, so more sophistry, more word magic, more illogic in the service of not only making sure we get punished for denying gay marriage but can't even have our own beliefs about it.
As I pointed out on the other thread, it is for "breaking the law" that Christians got thrown to the lions in Rome, and in ancient Babylon, and beaten to a pulp by the KGB (such as for meeting with other Christians to worship and pray), and great men were put to the stake by Rome for translating the Bible. Yet you go on with this craziness about how it's not about obeying God? I wonder when the English language is just going to dissolve into total word salad under the Left? Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I see, so I'm NOT allowed to have my beliefs, I have to have yours.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
No prosecutions? The Oregon bakery had to close their doors and would have had to pay a huge fine except some nice gays stepped in and took care of the fine.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Why do you keep asserting the obvious? Not free for this that and the other, yes we know that.; It's because the law says we are not free to follow our Christian conscience that we expect to be punished. What else is new?
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Good for them. They were also implying that they know the law is an ass.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
We KNOW it's illegal. Why is this being repeated? We know it is illegal and we know if we follow our conscience we will be punished. Good grief, how many times do you have to repeat this?
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
The reality is we get punished for obeying God.
I looked up the Colorado case too: Masterpiece cakeshop. They were sued for denying a gay couple a wedding cake and the court decided for the gay couple and they took it to the supreme court. Last news is that the owner of the business decided not to make any more wedding cakes. Is that punishment enough for you?
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
The law says absolutely nothing about your beliefs. Nor did the law requiring worship of Caesar, nor the one requiring worship of Nebuchadnezzar, nor the law forbidding the translation of Bibles. Why do you keep going on in this utterly idiotic way?
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Again, apparently we are not allowed to have our own beliefs, we are required to have yours.
Anyway, I looked up another of the businesses that refused to cater to a gay wedding, the florist in Washington, Baronelle Stutzman. She lost her case too of course and was fined $1000. I don't know where things stand at the moment. The photograph in New Mexico also lost her case: N.M. Supreme Court: Photographers Can't Refuse Gay Wedding...... | News & Reporting |
Christianity Today I think there was another bakery in the same situation. Maybe I can find it.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Logically you live in la-la land like most Leftists, and the irrationality and illogic of it all are maybe the hardest part of being attacked by anti-Christian laws. The denial, the silly word twisting.
Anyway, although there's lots of news out there that might be pursued on this thread, I can't find the other business I was looking for, which I think was also a bakery.
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