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Author Topic:   Science is Revealed Truth
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19309
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 1 of 150 (807034)
04-30-2017 1:47 PM


Revealed Truth

What is "truth" ... (excerpted from definition below):

  • the quality or state of being true:
  • that which is true or in accordance with fact or reality:
  • a fact or belief that is accepted as true:

synonyms: fact • verity • certainty • certitude • law • principle

What does it mean to be "revealed" ... (also excerpted from definition below):

  • make (previously unknown or secret information) known to others:
  • cause or allow (something) to be seen:

synonyms: show • display • exhibit • disclose • uncover • unveil • uncloak

The process of science (scientific method) is the only known process that we have to find/uncover/reveal new facts/verity/truths.

Enjoy



Definitions:

  1. truth - Oxford University Press)

    [tro͞oTH]
    NOUN

    the quality or state of being true:
    "he had to accept the truth of her accusation"
    synonyms: veracity • truthfulness • verity • sincerity • candor • honesty • accuracy • correctness • validity • factuality • authenticity

    • (the truth)
      that which is true or in accordance with fact or reality:
      "tell me the truth" • [more]
      synonyms: what actually happened • the case • so • the gospel (truth) • the honest truth • fact(s) • reality • real life • actuality
      antonyms: lies • fiction

    • a fact or belief that is accepted as true:
      "the emergence of scientific truths"
      synonyms: fact • verity • certainty • certitude • law • principle

  2. re•veal - Oxford University Press)

    [rəˈvēl]
    VERB
    reveals (third person present) • revealed (past tense) • revealed (past participle) • revealing (present participle)

    1. make (previously unknown or secret information) known to others:
    "Brenda was forced to reveal Robbie's whereabouts" • "he revealed that he and his children had received death threats"
    synonyms: divulge • disclose • tell • let slip • let drop • give away • give out • blurt (out) • release • leak • make known • make public • broadcast • publicize • circulate • disseminate • let on
    antonyms: hide • conceal

    • cause or allow (something) to be seen:
      "the clouds were breaking up to reveal a clear blue sky"
      synonyms: show • display • exhibit • disclose • uncover • unveil • uncloak
      antonyms: hide
    • make (something) known to humans by divine or supernatural means:
      "the truth revealed at the Incarnation"
      synonyms: bring to light • uncover • lay bare • unearth • expose • evince • uncloak

Edited by RAZD, : modified title


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Davidjay, posted 04-30-2017 6:39 PM RAZD has responded
 Message 12 by Taq, posted 05-01-2017 12:12 PM RAZD has responded

  
Davidjay 
Suspended Member
Posts: 1026
From: B.C Canada
Joined: 11-05-2004


Message 2 of 150 (807069)
04-30-2017 6:39 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by RAZD
04-30-2017 1:47 PM


Yes, true scientists test and prove their theories.

True scientists find truths and laws.

True scientists are not swayed by their peers or the belief systems of others, they have open minds and hearts, and just search until they find truths.

And besides all truths have to be connected and joined, no truth stands alone, but leads to other truths.

IHTS

David


.
The Lord is the GREAT SCIENTIST as He created SCIENCE and ALL LAWS and ALL MATTER and of course ALL LIFE. God is the Great Architect, Designer and Mathematician. Evolutioon is not mathematical and says there is no DESIGN but that all things came about by sheer LUCK.

.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by RAZD, posted 04-30-2017 1:47 PM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by Coyote, posted 04-30-2017 6:41 PM Davidjay has responded
 Message 7 by RAZD, posted 05-01-2017 10:40 AM Davidjay has responded
 Message 11 by ringo, posted 05-01-2017 12:08 PM Davidjay has not yet responded

    
Coyote
Member
Posts: 6037
Joined: 01-12-2008
Member Rating: 1.6


(1)
Message 3 of 150 (807070)
04-30-2017 6:41 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Davidjay
04-30-2017 6:39 PM


Are creationists anti-science?
Yes, true scientists test and prove their theories.

True scientists find truths and laws.

True scientists are not swayed by their peers or the belief systems of others, they have open minds and hearts, and just search until they find truths.

And besides all truths have to be connected and joined, no truth stands alone, but leads to other truths.

And none of that science supports your delusions and mathematical sophistry.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.

Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Davidjay, posted 04-30-2017 6:39 PM Davidjay has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by Davidjay, posted 04-30-2017 6:51 PM Coyote has responded

  
Davidjay 
Suspended Member
Posts: 1026
From: B.C Canada
Joined: 11-05-2004


Message 4 of 150 (807072)
04-30-2017 6:51 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by Coyote
04-30-2017 6:41 PM


Re: Jay sips on his coffee..and chats amicably
Thats not a nice thing to say in a coffeeshop, Coyote.

I was just being nice to Raz and agreeing with him completely, and adding one more turth to his.

Control your emotions from losing elsewhere and just learn to chat over coffee and focus on things we agree on.

Im a scientist and love science and truths and laws. I dont like theories that are unproven and bogus. I like laws

SEE Thread on LAWS did not evolve.

Jay sips on his Columbian coffee, and continues chatting with Raz about their agreements and about new people entering into the Coffee Shop. The sun is shinning outside and all is well inside the coffee shop.

Edited by Davidjay, : No reason given.


.
The Lord is the GREAT SCIENTIST as He created SCIENCE and ALL LAWS and ALL MATTER and of course ALL LIFE. God is the Great Architect, Designer and Mathematician. Evolutioon is not mathematical and says there is no DESIGN but that all things came about by sheer LUCK.

.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by Coyote, posted 04-30-2017 6:41 PM Coyote has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by Coyote, posted 04-30-2017 6:58 PM Davidjay has not yet responded
 Message 6 by Davidjay, posted 04-30-2017 6:59 PM Davidjay has not yet responded

    
Coyote
Member
Posts: 6037
Joined: 01-12-2008
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 5 of 150 (807075)
04-30-2017 6:58 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by Davidjay
04-30-2017 6:51 PM


Re: Jay sips on his coffee..and chats amicably
Control your emotions from losing elsewhere...

Lose elsewhere?

I have been posting evidence that disproves your "exact" date for the flood, as well as the flood itself, and you have spent weeks ducking, dodging, and weaving to avoid addressing that evidence.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.

Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by Davidjay, posted 04-30-2017 6:51 PM Davidjay has not yet responded

  
Davidjay 
Suspended Member
Posts: 1026
From: B.C Canada
Joined: 11-05-2004


Message 6 of 150 (807076)
04-30-2017 6:59 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by Davidjay
04-30-2017 6:51 PM


Re: Revealed truth is thrilling just like revealed beauty
Jay notices a beauty walk through the door, and mentions it to Raz... they both take a long look and imaginations soar.

They take a deep breath and then relate how science revealed is just like a beauty revealed, step by step, one piece of clothing at a time until the final revealment and final total unveiling.
Now thats exciting and thrilling and reproductive and entrancing, as science does the same thing.

Finding truths is exciting and yet it takes some time and deciation to get beneath the layers. We can imagine but we have to slowly reveal one precept after another until we finnally disover what has always been there, the original..... and glorious was the beauty thereof and awesome truth thereof.

SEE What is beauty

http://davidjayjordan.com/Whatisbeauty.html


.
The Lord is the GREAT SCIENTIST as He created SCIENCE and ALL LAWS and ALL MATTER and of course ALL LIFE. God is the Great Architect, Designer and Mathematician. Evolutioon is not mathematical and says there is no DESIGN but that all things came about by sheer LUCK.

.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by Davidjay, posted 04-30-2017 6:51 PM Davidjay has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by RAZD, posted 05-01-2017 11:07 AM Davidjay has responded

    
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19309
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.2


(1)
Message 7 of 150 (807180)
05-01-2017 10:40 AM
Reply to: Message 2 by Davidjay
04-30-2017 6:39 PM


And besides all truths have to be connected and joined, no truth stands alone, but leads to other truths.

Indeed, knowledge leads to knowledge, and science builds on previous science.

True scientists are not swayed by their peers or the belief systems of others, they have open minds and hearts, and just search until they find truths.

Open minds but also skeptical, hence testing against reality (objective empirical evidence) to see if it is supported or invalidated. Also why replication by others is important, to ensure your conclusions are not based on personal bias\opinion.

What is your paradigm for judging the validity of statements?

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Davidjay, posted 04-30-2017 6:39 PM Davidjay has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by Davidjay, posted 05-01-2017 11:26 AM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

  
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19309
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 8 of 150 (807186)
05-01-2017 11:07 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by Davidjay
04-30-2017 6:59 PM


Re: Revealed truth is thrilling just like revealed beauty
Jay notices a beauty walk through the door, and mentions it to Raz... they both take a long look and imaginations soar.

They take a deep breath and then relate how science revealed is just like a beauty revealed, step by step, one piece of clothing at a time until the final revealment and final total unveiling.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, male and female, but there are also evolutionary implications -- this is part of mate selection, and thus an evolved "mate template" is applied.

There are the implications of Sexual Selection, Stasis, Runaway Selection, Dimorphism, & Human Evolution in that our intellect is a result of selection for creativity (dance, face painting, evolving into arts and entertainment) and that our bodies are also a result of sexual selection, particularly the apparent hairless appearance of females, in order to look younger.

SEE What is beauty

http://davidjayjordan.com/Whatisbeauty.html

When we look at certain elements of attraction we find that they are generally median values within the population, health, physical fitness, apparent ability to provide basic elements for living. This focus onto the median values shows population selection for success in survival and reproduction, tending towards stasis around the median values.

But when desired values depart from the median, then we see sexual selection in action, the things that result in costly adaptations to get a mate, like the peacocks tail.

Human brain size has increased to the point where it impacts mother survival of childbirth, and would likely be selected to continue without this barrier.

Male penis size is much larger than all the other apes, likely due to female sexual selection, even though some (Bonobos) are more sexually active than humans.

Apparent hairlessness of women is so that they appear more childlike, as the number of hairs is not changed so much as the type of hair, retaining vellus hair instead of the normal progression to terminal hair, as seen in men.

Now thats exciting and thrilling and reproductive and entrancing, as science does the same thing.

Indeed, uncovering the inner workings of the universe is exciting and thrilling.

Enjoy

Edited by RAZD, : .


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by Davidjay, posted 04-30-2017 6:59 PM Davidjay has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Davidjay, posted 05-01-2017 11:30 AM RAZD has responded

  
Davidjay 
Suspended Member
Posts: 1026
From: B.C Canada
Joined: 11-05-2004


Message 9 of 150 (807194)
05-01-2017 11:26 AM
Reply to: Message 7 by RAZD
05-01-2017 10:40 AM


My paradigm is testing, I dont like people who talk about things they have never tested and who have closed minds about ideas they have neither studied nor tested mushc less proven. I like laws and truths not theories and mere words. I like people with guts and courage and those that have experienced real life and real people and tested real principles to see if they work and are valid.

I dislike gutless people who deny everything> Real scientists study and test and verify.


.
The Lord is the GREAT SCIENTIST as He created SCIENCE and ALL LAWS and ALL MATTER and of course ALL LIFE. God is the Great Architect, Designer and Mathematician. Evolutioon is not mathematical and says there is no DESIGN but that all things came about by sheer LUCK.

.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by RAZD, posted 05-01-2017 10:40 AM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

    
Davidjay 
Suspended Member
Posts: 1026
From: B.C Canada
Joined: 11-05-2004


Message 10 of 150 (807196)
05-01-2017 11:30 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by RAZD
05-01-2017 11:07 AM


Re: Revealed truth is thrilling just like revealed beauty
Nah, beauty is the Phi template of creation, as all societies because of our common Creator all have the same ratios of beauty.

https://www.google.ca/search?hl=en-CA&source=hp&biw=&bih=...

Our common Creator used our beauty to our mates to help us be attracted so we would reproduce. He/she created sex.... and beauty and attractions. Evolutionists believe in randomness rather than ratios and mathematics, and think our attractions just happened by luck and chance.

Nevertheless, we should start a new thread on this once we get out of this coffee shop. SEE Proposed New Topics..

Look at that beauty that just walked in, now thats what I call a figure, a PHI figure, Look at those ratio's.... I gotta have a cold shower....

Edited by Davidjay, : No reason given.


.
The Lord is the GREAT SCIENTIST as He created SCIENCE and ALL LAWS and ALL MATTER and of course ALL LIFE. God is the Great Architect, Designer and Mathematician. Evolutioon is not mathematical and says there is no DESIGN but that all things came about by sheer LUCK.

.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by RAZD, posted 05-01-2017 11:07 AM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by RAZD, posted 05-02-2017 10:30 AM Davidjay has not yet responded

    
ringo
Member
Posts: 13982
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


(1)
Message 11 of 150 (807209)
05-01-2017 12:08 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Davidjay
04-30-2017 6:39 PM


Davidjay writes:

And besides all truths have to be connected and joined, no truth stands alone, but leads to other truths.


That's how we know what you're saying isn't true.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Davidjay, posted 04-30-2017 6:39 PM Davidjay has not yet responded

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 7282
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 3.9


(1)
Message 12 of 150 (807211)
05-01-2017 12:12 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by RAZD
04-30-2017 1:47 PM


RAZD writes:

The process of science (scientific method) is the only known process that we have to find/uncover/reveal new facts/verity/truths.

Science really isn't interested in philosophical truths or metaphysics. Science is much more practical in that we use science because it appears to work. While philosophers and theologians argue over truths and the meaning of true, scientists are just busy figuring out how the universe works. Paraphrasing Steven Weinberg, the only good thing that philosophers have done is point out bad philosophy. Otherwise, science really doesn't give a hoot about Truth, with a capital T.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by RAZD, posted 04-30-2017 1:47 PM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by Davidjay, posted 05-01-2017 10:27 PM Taq has responded
 Message 20 by RAZD, posted 05-02-2017 1:11 PM Taq has not yet responded

  
Davidjay 
Suspended Member
Posts: 1026
From: B.C Canada
Joined: 11-05-2004


Message 13 of 150 (807272)
05-01-2017 10:27 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by Taq
05-01-2017 12:12 PM


Real scientists go behind the scenes because they know from sceince and physics, that the EMF is 70 times bigger than the mere human spectrum we humans can see. They dont deny what they haven't tested just because they cant seen it or haven't experienced it.

Real scientists go beyond the forced indocrination they get from followers. They venture forth with courage and guts and foresight, searching for more truths. They are not intimidated by the masses, they are pioneers, and demand answers rather than just being negative and deniers.

Real scientists demand proofs for themselves, and dont stop til they find out one way or the other. They do not follow as dumb sheep, for the slaughter. They go where others dare not go.

They can explain what they have found out, and know the subject matter backwards and forwards, and go step by step or precept by precept..... one truth leading to another.

They do not rely on luck and chance as their means of solving mysteries. They want to test things out personnally themselves....and they do.

Metaphysics is just the invisable and is no barrier to a real scientist. Only the closed minded ones that closed their eyes or demand to see only with their eyes. They miss 69/70 percent of all truths.

They understand not the macro-cosm or the micro-cosm.

Jay sips more of his coffee........ for he has them right where he wants them..... evolutionists and atheists and blind scientists are so dumb and so easily defeated....


.
The Lord is the GREAT SCIENTIST as He created SCIENCE and ALL LAWS and ALL MATTER and of course ALL LIFE. God is the Great Architect, Designer and Mathematician. Evolutioon is not mathematical and says there is no DESIGN but that all things came about by sheer LUCK.

.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by Taq, posted 05-01-2017 12:12 PM Taq has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by Coyote, posted 05-01-2017 10:43 PM Davidjay has responded
 Message 15 by Tanypteryx, posted 05-01-2017 10:55 PM Davidjay has responded
 Message 19 by Taq, posted 05-02-2017 10:43 AM Davidjay has not yet responded

    
Coyote
Member
Posts: 6037
Joined: 01-12-2008
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 14 of 150 (807274)
05-01-2017 10:43 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by Davidjay
05-01-2017 10:27 PM


Real scientists...
Real scientists demand proofs for themselves, and dont stop til they find out one way or the other. They do not follow as dumb sheep, for the slaughter. They go where others dare not go.

They can explain what they have found out, and know the subject matter backwards and forwards, and go step by step or precept by precept..... one truth leading to another.

They do not rely on luck and chance as their means of solving mysteries. They want to test things out personnally themselves....and they do.

You are describing just exactly what I do as an archaeologist.

In doing so, my "demanding proof" and "finding out" and "going where others dare not go" and "knowing the subject matter" and "testing things personally" have led me to conclusions that show you are wrong in several respects.

The main one that I've been posting in these threads, and trying to get you to respond in some meaningful way to, is the disproof of the global flood ca. 4350 years ago. I have posted my "personal" evidence several times and nudged you to respond several more times but you have been dodging, ducking and weaving.

What, got no evidence for your claims?


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.

Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by Davidjay, posted 05-01-2017 10:27 PM Davidjay has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 16 by Davidjay, posted 05-01-2017 10:58 PM Coyote has responded

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 1592
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 4.9


(1)
Message 15 of 150 (807277)
05-01-2017 10:55 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by Davidjay
05-01-2017 10:27 PM


Real scientists go behind the scenes because they know from sceince and physics, that the EMF is 70 times bigger than the mere human spectrum we humans can see. They dont deny what they haven't tested just because they cant seen it or haven't experienced it.

So, are you trying to say that they follow the evidence where ever it leads?

the EMF is 70 times bigger than the mere human spectrum we humans can see.

What does this even mean? Bigger by what measurement? Communication is your strength, is it?

Metaphysics is just the invisable and is no barrier to a real scientist. Only the closed minded ones that closed their eyes or demand to see only with their eyes. They miss 69/70 percent of all truths.

So you measured it huh? 69/70 percent of all truths... Are you just spit-balling it here or do you have hard numbers?

They understand not the macro-cosm or the micro-cosm.

Jay sips more of his coffee........ for he has them right where he wants them..... evolutionists and atheists and blind scientists are so dumb and so easily defeated....

So, is your fantasy world, where you are sipping your Folger's in the macro-cosm or the micro-cosm? Or maybe it is behind the scenes with the "real scientists"?


What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by Davidjay, posted 05-01-2017 10:27 PM Davidjay has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by Davidjay, posted 05-03-2017 8:38 AM Tanypteryx has responded

    
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