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Author Topic:   The Tension of Faith
Percy
Member
Posts: 17359
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 1471 of 1540 (826311)
12-28-2017 2:17 PM
Reply to: Message 1467 by Faith
12-28-2017 1:45 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
I'll answer all your replies in this post.

Replying to your Message 1463:

Faith writes:

Why would I turn on him? I wouldn't support a wedding but I wouldn't end a friendship if he pursued it.

So when this friend with bad eyesight needed help picking out a wedding cake, you'd be there for him?

Defining murder as having control over your body is insane.

Defining love as telling other people what to do is what is insane.

Helping the refugees where they are is the best we can do and it is loving them. The situation is NOT the same as with the Jews. We wouldn't refuse the Muslims if their ideology weren't murderous.

Ah, yes, I can just feel the love. Glad you're not the judgmental type.

No idea what "mikey" refers to.

The Life cereal "Mikey hates everything" commercials from a half century ago. That's why I called you the Mikey of Life.

Moving on to your Message 1464:

Faith writes:

Percy writes:

You never answered the question of how you know you're not the one being manipulated by Satan.

I have answered that evil accusation. I know God, I know the Bible, I understand Christian theology and I know how Satan works.

How would you know whether you've been communing with the great deceiver?

Moving on to your Message 1466:

Faith writes:

Percy writes:

Yes, I know what you were saying, and I explained why it was wrong. Others have put even more years into studying their theologies, and if the number of years spent in study is the yardstick by which the truth of a theology is measured, then your theology loses.

Obviously you DON'T know what I was saying. I said it proves I didn't make it up, nothing about whether it is true.

Well, if it isn't true then it must be made up or wrong or mistaken or something along those lines.

But of course it is in any case.

You have faith that your theology is true, not evidence.

Moving on to your Message 1467:

Faith writes:

Percy writes:

The real end days are billions of years off.

Interesting. Yesterday a headline said Stephen Hawking believes we have 100 years left on this planet.

Interesting indeed. In a May, 2017, Newsweek article Stephen Hawking was quoted as follows:

quote:
“Although the chance of disaster to planet Earth in a given year may be quite low, it adds up over time, and becomes a near certainty in the next 1,000 or 10,000 years,” Hawking told the Oxford University Union in November.

Seems a rather strange thing for him to say, given that life has existed on this planet for billions of years and survived scores of disasters. Anyway, the end days I was referring to was when our Sun becomes a red giant and incinerates the Earth, estimated to happen about 5 billion years from now.

Gee, your Message 1465 is empty - nothing to say in reply to my Message 1459?

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1467 by Faith, posted 12-28-2017 1:45 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1472 by Faith, posted 12-28-2017 2:25 PM Percy has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 28587
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 1472 of 1540 (826313)
12-28-2017 2:25 PM
Reply to: Message 1471 by Percy
12-28-2017 2:17 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
How would you know whether you've been communing with the great deceiver?

Well, I know YOU have. That ought to be a clue.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1471 by Percy, posted 12-28-2017 2:17 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1475 by Percy, posted 12-28-2017 3:04 PM Faith has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 14020
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 1473 of 1540 (826314)
12-28-2017 2:33 PM
Reply to: Message 1468 by Faith
12-28-2017 1:48 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
quote:

I've argued every point made against me, there's nothing to admit.

Refusing to accept the evidence and railing against it hardly helps. Especially when you are reduced to calling observed facts “hallucinations” without explaining how that is even possible.

quote:

It's just a matter of time before the evidence of the Flood gets perfected and comes together.

Because two hundred years of utter failure isn’t enough ? There is no reasonable hopes that the real evidence will “come together” and support the Flood. The very idea is a ridiculous fantasy.

quote:

The gross facts themselves really should be enough to prove it anyway

Sure, blame the “gross facts” for failing to do their job.

quote:

I'm not talking about "winning." That's never going to happen in hidebound EvC. It will have to be acknowledged by more honest people a bit at a time until you can't ignore it.

And the usual false accusations. From one of the least honest - and most hidebound - person on the board, no less.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1468 by Faith, posted 12-28-2017 1:48 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1474 by Faith, posted 12-28-2017 2:45 PM PaulK has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 28587
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 1474 of 1540 (826316)
12-28-2017 2:45 PM
Reply to: Message 1473 by PaulK
12-28-2017 2:33 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
Strata and fossils. Nice straight flat strata just aren't going to form over millions of years, but water does form such layers; and fossils don't just lie down and die in families, and fossilization needs special conditions to occur, which the Flood would have provided. Those simple obvious facts require rethinking the fossil order since it can't possibly reflect billions of years of evolution.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1473 by PaulK, posted 12-28-2017 2:33 PM PaulK has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1476 by PaulK, posted 12-28-2017 3:16 PM Faith has not yet responded
 Message 1478 by Percy, posted 12-28-2017 3:28 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
Percy
Member
Posts: 17359
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 1475 of 1540 (826317)
12-28-2017 3:04 PM
Reply to: Message 1472 by Faith
12-28-2017 2:25 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
Faith writes:

How would you know whether you've been communing with the great deceiver?

Well, I know YOU have. That ought to be a clue.

You're ignoring the question. How would you know whether you or anyone else had been communing with the great deceiver?

And you left a whole lot up in the air:

  • Would you help your gay friend with bad eyesight pick out a wedding cake?
  • Is it really love that causes you to label the entire religion of Islam murderous? Are you sure you're not judgmental?
  • Theologies don't have evidence. They're all based on faith, on what people want to believe. No one can claim, "I've studied more years, therefore mine is true."
  • Declarations such as you've made like, (sic) "I know my theology is true," are statements of faith, not fact.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1472 by Faith, posted 12-28-2017 2:25 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1479 by Faith, posted 12-28-2017 4:21 PM Percy has responded
 Message 1480 by PaulK, posted 12-28-2017 5:25 PM Percy has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 14020
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 1476 of 1540 (826318)
12-28-2017 3:16 PM
Reply to: Message 1474 by Faith
12-28-2017 2:45 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
quote:

Strata and fossils

Great evidence against the Flood. You might as well go around shouting “the Flood’s a stupid lie!”

quote:

Nice straight flat strata just aren't going to form over millions of years, but water does form such layers

Well that’s contradictory for a start - since most strata are marine in origin anyway, why wouldn’t they be flat? You don’t get strata laid down on mountains for obvious reasons.

Then there are all the other features of the strata that contradict an origin in the Flood, such as evaporite deposits. You can’t honestly claim ignorance of these.

quote:

and fossils don't just lie down and die in families, and fossilization needs special conditions to occur, which the Flood would have provided.

I’m not sure how the first point is meant to help you at all. The second is easily answered. Plenty of things can provide those conditions - anoxic lakes are great. Sandstorms can do it too - and have done it. Are you really telling me that you need a global flood to have sandstorms ?

quote:

Those simple obvious facts require rethinking the fossil order since it can't possibly reflect billions of years of evolution

The order of the fossil record is a fact. Facts do not require rethinking because you reject their implications.

Moreover, your facts - in so far as they are facts - do nothing to even encourage us to reject those implications, let alone the fact. That the Flood could produce conditions conducive to fossilisation is not evidence - the more so since there are fossils that were not produced by any sort of flood. And we have already discussed much evidence that the strata were not produced by the Flood - which you have yet to deal with.

So, this answer only shows more facts that you should admit to, but do not,


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1474 by Faith, posted 12-28-2017 2:45 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
Percy
Member
Posts: 17359
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 1477 of 1540 (826319)
12-28-2017 3:23 PM
Reply to: Message 1465 by Faith
12-28-2017 1:03 PM


Re: Does True Christian Faith Mean Loving All?
Well, what do you know, a formerly null message suddenly pops up with text with not so much as an AbE. Well, you're nothing if not consistent.

Ah, I see, you weren't being judgmental when you said we'll be sorry on judgment day. You weren't being judgmental when you said gays should be discriminated against. You weren't being judgmental when you called Islam a murderous religion.

Well, as usual you DON'T see anything at all.

I'm talking about the dictim to "judge not lest ye be judged" which refers to accusations of PERSONAL sins.

No it doesn't, but even if it did, what is a religion but a group of persons who you are labeling murderous. That's pretty personal.

I didn't mention anyone's personal sins in reference to judgment day, just the general hatred of God you all express.

You sure are resourceful at finding excuses for your expressions of hate.

I said nothing about discriminating against gays,...

Really? You never said anything about discriminating against gays. Then how do you explain this is from your Message 1351:

Faith in Message 1351 writes:

Yes and he's right to discriminate against gay marriage...there are some situations where we discriminate and gay marriage ought to be one of them.

Seems like you have some pretty strong feelings about your right to discriminate against gays.

I don't condemn them for their personal sins either, we're all sinners.

But you really work at it.

And just as I said I don't judge Muslims personally either, their personal sins are none of my business. But Islam is an ideology and I certainly DO judge murderous ideologies.

No, you judge Muslims personally. To you they're followers of a murderous ideology and therefore unfit to enter our country. That's a pretty personal judgment.

I don't understand why you keep denying the obvious. You have lots of rules people have to follow before they're acceptable to you, and until they follow your rules you judge them unworthy and deserving of whatever consequences you decide should be doled out.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1465 by Faith, posted 12-28-2017 1:03 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
Percy
Member
Posts: 17359
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 1478 of 1540 (826320)
12-28-2017 3:28 PM
Reply to: Message 1474 by Faith
12-28-2017 2:45 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
If you want to discuss the flood then I suggest you resume participation in one of the many flood threads you abandoned. "The Flood" deposits as a sea transgressive/regressive sequence ("Walther's Law") would be a good one. You have 76 unanswered messages.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1474 by Faith, posted 12-28-2017 2:45 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 28587
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 1479 of 1540 (826321)
12-28-2017 4:21 PM
Reply to: Message 1475 by Percy
12-28-2017 3:04 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
I know by their DOCTRINE.

And I know right doctrine from the BIBLE as interpreted by hundreds of excellent preachers and theologians.

Your doctrine is totally unbiblical and in fact evil.

If Muslims never learn that their ideology is murderous and evil they will never be able to be saved, so certainly informing them of that fact is loving them.

I've studied for decades, thereforeI know I am not making up my theology, and in fact I know it is pretty standard Protestant evangelical theology.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1475 by Percy, posted 12-28-2017 3:04 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1481 by dwise1, posted 12-28-2017 8:59 PM Faith has responded
 Message 1483 by Percy, posted 12-29-2017 7:06 AM Faith has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 14020
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 1480 of 1540 (826322)
12-28-2017 5:25 PM
Reply to: Message 1475 by Percy
12-28-2017 3:04 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
Faith’s God loves lies and slander, hates the very idea of people understanding the Bible and doesn’t want her to acknowledge her sins, let alone repent.

Does that sound like Satan to you ?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1475 by Percy, posted 12-28-2017 3:04 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1484 by Percy, posted 12-29-2017 7:40 AM PaulK has not yet responded

    
dwise1
Member
Posts: 3160
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 3.0


Message 1481 of 1540 (826323)
12-28-2017 8:59 PM
Reply to: Message 1479 by Faith
12-28-2017 4:21 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
Yet again, I would like to thank Faith for her presentation of what her CHRISTIANITY is. And for why it should be shunned by every single thinking and believing and moral person in existence.

Thank you, Faith, for your service to all of humanity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1479 by Faith, posted 12-28-2017 4:21 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1482 by Faith, posted 12-28-2017 10:51 PM dwise1 has not yet responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 28587
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 1482 of 1540 (826324)
12-28-2017 10:51 PM
Reply to: Message 1481 by dwise1
12-28-2017 8:59 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
It is intended as service.

Please detail your objections.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1481 by dwise1, posted 12-28-2017 8:59 PM dwise1 has not yet responded

    
Percy
Member
Posts: 17359
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


(1)
Message 1483 of 1540 (826328)
12-29-2017 7:06 AM
Reply to: Message 1479 by Faith
12-28-2017 4:21 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
Faith writes:

Percy writes:

You're ignoring the question. How would you know whether you or anyone else had been communing with the great deceiver?

I know by their DOCTRINE.

Then look at your doctrine. It's causing you to hate whole classes and religions of people, and to support a crass, crude, lying, divisive miserable-excuse-for-a-human-being president. Most people find you the most hateful person on this entire board. Your doctrine labels you the most unChristian person here. Look inside yourself and let the hate go. Then the deceiver will be defeated, and you'll be able to perform these expressions of love:

  • Help your gay friend with bad eyesight pick out a wedding cake.
  • Welcome refugees to this country regardless of religion.
  • Co-exist peacefully and acceptingly with many different theologies.
  • See everyone as a human being deserving of your love and indifferent to their religion, if any.

What you've done is let your mistaken version of Christianity close you off from all but a small segment of humanity. That's not what Jesus wanted.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1479 by Faith, posted 12-28-2017 4:21 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1487 by Faith, posted 12-29-2017 9:11 AM Percy has responded

    
Percy
Member
Posts: 17359
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 1484 of 1540 (826330)
12-29-2017 7:40 AM
Reply to: Message 1480 by PaulK
12-28-2017 5:25 PM


Re: Tension from Faith
PaulK writes:

Faith’s God loves lies and slander, hates the very idea of people understanding the Bible and doesn’t want her to acknowledge her sins, let alone repent.

Does that sound like Satan to you ?

There used to be a group called the Jesus Seminar that attempted to identify which of Jesus' actions and words described in the gospels were actually true. They tended to reject Jesus' most hateful and vengeful words as unauthentic, such as this passage that Faith likes to quote:

quote:
Matt 23:33-35 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell? Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city: That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

They say it represents a time before the fall of Jeruaslem when Jewish synagogues were beginning to excommunicate Christian members, and Christians retaliated by heaping scorn on their Jewish rivals. This process only worsened after Jerusalem's fall.

But Faith latches onto to these unlikely Jesus passages and uses them as excuses for her own hateful attitudes. I don't believe in Satan, but there are many who are divisive forces in our society who want only to sow discord and dissension because they fear anyone who isn't like themselves, and the want the power to force their views on others.

--Percy

Edited by Percy, : Grammar.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1480 by PaulK, posted 12-28-2017 5:25 PM PaulK has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 1485 by jar, posted 12-29-2017 8:20 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply
 Message 1486 by Phat, posted 12-29-2017 8:21 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply
 Message 1490 by Faith, posted 12-29-2017 9:45 AM Percy has responded

    
jar
Member
Posts: 30430
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 1.5


(1)
Message 1485 of 1540 (826332)
12-29-2017 8:20 AM
Reply to: Message 1484 by Percy
12-29-2017 7:40 AM


Re: Tension from Faith
Remember, Christianity historically never met a religion it could not hate. And based on the evidence, that included all the other Christians. In every nation state where Christianity rose to power all the other religions were either destroyed. And until very recently that included all the other Chapters of Club Christian.

Islam historically has been far more tolerant of other religions, allowing them to continue, protecting their presence and respecting their traditions as long as they did not try to market their position as dominate and paid their taxes.

Judaism is the outlier since it did not practice recruiting or trying to market its position until fairly recently. Historically the only way to become a Jew was to be born as a Jew like Jesus.


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
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