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Author Topic:   Newsweek: Hillary Clinton Robbed Bernie Sanders Of The Democratic Nomination, Accordi
LamarkNewAge
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Posts: 1024
Joined: 12-22-2015
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(1)
Message 1 of 53 (822861)
11-02-2017 4:02 PM


The news is lighting up. I can't even find stories that were at the top of the list just an hour ago. I wanted to find the fist one I saw but can't.

Here is one.

Hillary Clinton Robbed Bernie Sanders Of The Democratic Nomination, According to Donna Brazile

By Greg Price On 11/2/17 at 9:09 AM

http://www.newsweek.com/...robbed-sanders-dnc-brazile-699421

Wow.

What an admission.


Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by AdminPhat, posted 11-02-2017 4:12 PM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded
 Message 3 by AdminPhat, posted 11-02-2017 4:46 PM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded
 Message 5 by RAZD, posted 11-02-2017 5:49 PM LamarkNewAge has responded
 Message 8 by ringo, posted 11-03-2017 11:56 AM LamarkNewAge has responded
 Message 23 by Rrhain, posted 11-04-2017 5:13 PM LamarkNewAge has responded

    
AdminPhat
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Joined: 12-03-2004
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 2 of 53 (822862)
11-02-2017 4:12 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by LamarkNewAge
11-02-2017 4:02 PM


deleted

Edited by AdminPhat, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by LamarkNewAge, posted 11-02-2017 4:02 PM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded

    
AdminPhat
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Posts: 1829
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-03-2004
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Message 3 of 53 (822863)
11-02-2017 4:46 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by LamarkNewAge
11-02-2017 4:02 PM


ok lets go with coffee house. You dont need PNT to put these topics in coffee house, by the way.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by LamarkNewAge, posted 11-02-2017 4:02 PM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded

    
AdminPhat
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From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-03-2004
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Message 4 of 53 (822865)
11-02-2017 4:46 PM


Thread Copied from Proposed New Topics Forum
Thread copied here from the Newsweek: Hillary Clinton Robbed Bernie Sanders Of The Democratic Nomination, Accordi thread in the Proposed New Topics forum.
    
RAZD
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(4)
Message 5 of 53 (822868)
11-02-2017 5:49 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by LamarkNewAge
11-02-2017 4:02 PM


Wow.

What an admission.p

Indeed, and in light of the recent purging of the DNC of Bernie supporters, it will be interesting to see how this plays out.

It is time for Hillary to go. It is time for the DNC "elite" to go.

It is time for neolib democrats to go

It is time for DINO's to go

It is time for the superdelegates to be relegated to the history of bad ideas ... preventing a popular candidate from winning the primary process ...

It is time for either the democrat party to die or to be reborn in a progressive mode, representing working people again.

Or it will be replaced.

And they better get their act together ... 2018 is just around the corner.

Progressives are winning primaries, local elections, filling democrat town committees, Working Families Party is winning local level positions -- mayors etc. The Democratic Socialist party membership has exploded with new members.

People are looking for alternatives.

It is coming.

Enjoy


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This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by LamarkNewAge, posted 11-02-2017 4:02 PM LamarkNewAge has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by LamarkNewAge, posted 11-03-2017 11:43 AM RAZD has responded

  
LamarkNewAge
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Posts: 1024
Joined: 12-22-2015
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 6 of 53 (822906)
11-03-2017 11:43 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by RAZD
11-02-2017 5:49 PM


"If you had told me this during the primary... I would have called you a conspiracy
Razd:

quote:

It is time for the superdelegates to be relegated to the history of bad ideas ... preventing a popular candidate from winning the primary process ...

I think I was called a conspiracy nut (by NoNukes?) during the debate over the DNC deck stacking.

From Vox

quote:

Donna Brazile’s bombshell about the DNC and Hillary Clinton, explained

During the 2016 election, Sanders allies alleged that the DNC did not act as a neutral arbiter of the Democratic primary, favoring Clinton in its selection of debate times and fundraising. Their suspicions were only heightened when leaked emails published by WikiLeaks, and now reported to have been hacked by the Russians, appeared to show DNC staffers deriding Sanders and plotting ways to help Clinton. The accusations grew so heated that Wasserman Schultz resigned, which is when Brazile took over.

But now Brazile has provided explosive new evidence for the initial allegations. "The shocking news here is this idea they were exerting a level of control over DNC affairs that we didn't know about," said Kenneth Pennington, who served as digital director for the Sanders campaign. "If you had told me this during the primary — that they're using the joint fundraising committee to get veto power over DNC functions — I would have called you a conspiracy nut."

http://www.msn.com/...d-hillary-clinton-explained/ar-AAun9Hc


There has been near total confirmation of the fears from "conspiracy nuts" like myself.

Sanders not only was robbed of the Democratic nomination, but all this crap laid the groundwork for an election that eventually got us Donald Trump.

And that wasn't all that happened in the end.

The same exact November 2016 day that saw Trump defeat Hillary also came with a monumental day for Republican Senate candidates. Don't forget that the basic arithmetic of the (33) seats up in 2016 demanded that there would be enough victorious Democrats so that there was at least an even 50 to 50 breakdown in the larger body of 100 in the Senate. Instead we got a 52 to 48 GOP majority.

Don't forget the Senate.

Now we need to rely on an increasingly radical GOP Senate to refuse the policies of Trump.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by RAZD, posted 11-02-2017 5:49 PM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by Taq, posted 11-03-2017 11:51 AM LamarkNewAge has responded
 Message 13 by NoNukes, posted 11-03-2017 3:57 PM LamarkNewAge has responded
 Message 29 by RAZD, posted 11-06-2017 11:23 AM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded

    
Taq
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Posts: 7271
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 7 of 53 (822907)
11-03-2017 11:51 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by LamarkNewAge
11-03-2017 11:43 AM


Re: "If you had told me this during the primary... I would have called you a conspiracy
LamarkNewAge writes:

Sanders not only was robbed of the Democratic nomination, but all this crap laid the groundwork for an election that eventually got us Donald Trump.

Those are some rather large assumptions. I don't see how Sanders was guaranteed to beat either Clinton or Trump on a level playing field.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by LamarkNewAge, posted 11-03-2017 11:43 AM LamarkNewAge has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by LamarkNewAge, posted 11-03-2017 12:02 PM Taq has responded

  
ringo
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Posts: 13965
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 8 of 53 (822910)
11-03-2017 11:56 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by LamarkNewAge
11-02-2017 4:02 PM


LamarkNewAge writes:

What an admission.


What a joke.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by LamarkNewAge, posted 11-02-2017 4:02 PM LamarkNewAge has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by LamarkNewAge, posted 11-03-2017 11:59 AM ringo has responded

  
LamarkNewAge
Member
Posts: 1024
Joined: 12-22-2015
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 9 of 53 (822911)
11-03-2017 11:59 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by ringo
11-03-2017 11:56 AM


Forget something Ringo?
quote:

What a joke.


I missed the punch line.

Care to elaborate.?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by ringo, posted 11-03-2017 11:56 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by ringo, posted 11-03-2017 12:09 PM LamarkNewAge has responded

    
LamarkNewAge
Member
Posts: 1024
Joined: 12-22-2015
Member Rating: 1.1


(1)
Message 10 of 53 (822912)
11-03-2017 12:02 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Taq
11-03-2017 11:51 AM


Re: "If you had told me this during the primary... I would have called you a conspiracy
quote:

Those are some rather large assumptions. I don't see how Sanders was guaranteed to beat either Clinton or Trump on a level playing field.

He was already declared defeated (from the start) due to the big Super delegate lead Hillary Clinton began with.

He didn't get media coverage that described him as anything but a small nuisance.

And the debate calendar was designed to keep him "dead" in the water.

(debates are really important due to the massive voting audience)

He still won 22 states.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Taq, posted 11-03-2017 11:51 AM Taq has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Taq, posted 11-03-2017 12:18 PM LamarkNewAge has responded

    
ringo
Member
Posts: 13965
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 11 of 53 (822914)
11-03-2017 12:09 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by LamarkNewAge
11-03-2017 11:59 AM


Re: Forget something Ringo?
LamarknewAge writes:

I missed the punch line.

Care to elaborate.?


As Taq pointed out (and I'll put it more bluntly), Sanders wouldn't have won the nomination even if Hillary had vanished off the face of the earth. He was one of Trump's greatest assets but he was no asset to the Democratic Party.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by LamarkNewAge, posted 11-03-2017 11:59 AM LamarkNewAge has responded

Replies to this message:
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 Message 15 by LamarkNewAge, posted 11-03-2017 4:01 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
Taq
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Posts: 7271
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 12 of 53 (822916)
11-03-2017 12:18 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by LamarkNewAge
11-03-2017 12:02 PM


Re: "If you had told me this during the primary... I would have called you a conspiracy
LamarckNewAge writes:

He was already declared defeated (from the start) due to the big Super delegate lead Hillary Clinton began with.

He didn't get media coverage that described him as anything but a small nuisance.

And the debate calendar was designed to keep him "dead" in the water.

(debates are really important due to the massive voting audience)

He still won 22 states.

The debate calendar kept him from winning? Seriously?

Super delegates are part of the nomination process, and Sanders was responsible for his own public image. Those would all be present with a level playing field.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by LamarkNewAge, posted 11-03-2017 12:02 PM LamarkNewAge has responded

Replies to this message:
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NoNukes
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Posts: 10115
From: Central NC USA
Joined: 08-13-2010
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 13 of 53 (822925)
11-03-2017 3:57 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by LamarkNewAge
11-03-2017 11:43 AM


Re: "If you had told me this during the primary... I would have called you a conspiracy
I think I was called a conspiracy nut (by NoNukes?) during the debate over the DNC deck stacking.

Why don't you cite the exact conspiracy statements that resulted in in me calling you that?


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

I was thinking as long as I have my hands up … they’re not going to shoot me. This is what I’m thinking — they’re not going to shoot me. Wow, was I wrong. -- Charles Kinsey

We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World.

Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by LamarkNewAge, posted 11-03-2017 11:43 AM LamarkNewAge has responded

Replies to this message:
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LamarkNewAge
Member
Posts: 1024
Joined: 12-22-2015
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 14 of 53 (822926)
11-03-2017 4:00 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by ringo
11-03-2017 12:09 PM


Re: Forget something Ringo?
quote:

As Taq pointed out (and I'll put it more bluntly), Sanders wouldn't have won the nomination even if Hillary had vanished off the face of the earth. He was one of Trump's greatest assets but he was no asset to the Democratic Party.

Forget about the last sentence. (I can't argue against your great point that Sanders wasn't able to do much to help with Hillary's atrocious reputation & issue stances during the general election)

But it is the point that "Sanders wouldn't have won the nomination even if Hillary had vanished off the face of the earth" that I want to look at (more of a glance).

The fact of the matter is that he did win general elections in Vermont. He lost his first statewide congressional race (well the 1988 open House seat might not have been his very first) to a moderate Republican by a few points (about 51% to 48% which was less than the 54% to 45% loss that Dukakis lost to Bush) and he was actually so popular that the Democratic party supported him.

Vermont had never elected a Democratic congressman in over 200 years when Sanders won the rematch 2 years later in 1990. He won 56% to 40% but it had a lot to do with the fact that his 1 term Republican opponent was at odds with the Republican party on abortion, gun control, and taxes (He actually felt Bush didn't raise taxes on the wealthy enough, while the party felt he shouldn't have raised taxes at all).

Again, he had the support of the Democratic party.

He joined the Democratic caucus in the House after he was sworn in during January 1991.

The first ever Democratic congressman.

Bill Clinton won Vermont 46% to 33% in 1992 but Sanders won by a wider margin in both 1990 and 1992.

Sanders did only win 47% to 44% in the 1994 GOP tidal wave but he and Clinton both won by 23% in 1996.

Gore only won by 10% in 2000 but Sanders won by over 30% in 1998 and 2000.

Kerry won 62% to 37% in 2004 but Sanders won the open Senate seat in 2006 by over 30%.

NOW THE DEMOCRATIC PRIMARY IN 2016

He did loose to Hillary in the 2016 delegate race and even with regular delegates. He lost regular delegates 55% to 45%.

Kentucky, Missouri, and Iowa were settled by less than 1% and had he won those three, then he would have won 25 states. Massachusetts was also super close. As was South Dakota (I think).

Hard to argue that he couldn't be considered a strong runner for the nomination.

Now.

Would he have been out of the picture had the toxic Hillary Clinton not been his 1 on 1 opponent?

Was he only strong in the primary because Hillary was his opponent?

We don't truly understand the various dynamics and how the cookie crumbles under vastly different circumstances.

Some think he might have done better among African Americans if Hillary wasn't his opponent. He might not have beat his 22% performance but he wouldn't have lost them by 56% (78% to 22%) and that is especially true if a non-Hillary primary featured a big field of presidential hopefuls.

He wouldn't have lost the Jewish vote by so much in a divided field.

He failed to win 3 chief Democratic constituencies (Black, Hispanic, and Jewish voters).

He won whites, Asians, and Native Americans.

Was his success among the latter simply due to his opponent being Hillary Clinton?

I don't know.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by ringo, posted 11-03-2017 12:09 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by ringo, posted 11-05-2017 1:16 PM LamarkNewAge has responded

    
LamarkNewAge
Member
Posts: 1024
Joined: 12-22-2015
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 15 of 53 (822927)
11-03-2017 4:01 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by ringo
11-03-2017 12:09 PM


duplicate post
.

Edited by LamarkNewAge, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by ringo, posted 11-03-2017 12:09 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply

    
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