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Author Topic:   Peanut Gallery Comments on Great Debate
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6180
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.3


Message 61 of 89 (845710)
12-19-2018 1:15 AM
Reply to: Message 57 by AZPaul3
12-18-2018 12:56 PM


Re: Birds Of A Feather
Hi Paul

AZPaul writes:

So there are two judgement days? One for individuals and one for nations? How about one for atheists, one for Iowa alumni and one for rotarians? Can we have these too?

There are three judgments.

The judgment of the saved will take place first. This is the judgment seat of Christ.

The judgment of the nations will take place shortly before the second coming of Christ. This is the judgment of the nations. It fulfills a promise made to Abraham concerning the nations.

quote:
Genesis 12:1 Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will show thee:

12:2 And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:

12:3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.



The nations that support Israel in their battle with the anti-Christ will be allowed to enter the 1000 year reign of Christ on earth in His earthly kingdom.

The judgment of those who refused to believe God will be last at the Great White throne Judgment.

The atheist fit in this category, as wells as some of the Iowa alumni and some of the rotarians. But hopefully some of the Iowa alumni and some of the rotarians will be at the judgment seat of Christ. Some might even be lucky enough to be living in a nation that helps Israel in their battle with the anti-Christ. Even some atheist might be in this bunch by living in the right country.

That would be a great way for an atheist to meet Jesus. I wonder if he/she would then believe in Him. Probably not the Religious Jews didn't accept Him.

God Bless,


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 57 by AZPaul3, posted 12-18-2018 12:56 PM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply

    
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6180
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.3


Message 62 of 89 (845711)
12-19-2018 1:50 AM
Reply to: Message 55 by Phat
12-18-2018 11:18 AM


Re: The Good Samaritan Remix
Hi Phat

Phat writes:

One interesting argument that we have around here is whether this whole "saved" and "blood-bought" impartation from God makes believers a sheep category rather than a goat category.

Let me address this a little and if you want to discuss it more bring it up in the debate.

There is very little difference between me and Tangle.

We are both sinners.

But there is a difference. Tangle is a lost sinner and I am a saved sinner.

I did not get a glorified body that did not commit sin when I was born again only my spirit was born again and sealed by the Holy Spirit until the day of redemption

Neither of us was condemned because we sinned. Mankind was condemned because the man formed from the dust of the ground disobeyed God and ate the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

Tangle is still condemned because he does not believe in God and therefore has never trusted God to save him from the bondage he was sold into.

I on the other hand believe in God and have trusted Him to save me and give me eternal life. So I received a full pardon and am justified before God. But I am still a sinner. That is a battle I have to fight on a daily basis. I just have to try to get better every day.

God Bless,


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 55 by Phat, posted 12-18-2018 11:18 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 83 by GDR, posted 12-23-2018 6:43 PM ICANT has not yet responded

    
Tangle
Member
Posts: 6497
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.5


(1)
Message 63 of 89 (845727)
12-19-2018 1:14 PM


ICANT writes:

You apparently did not understand the quote this statement follows.

A person is condemned because the man formed from the dust of the ground disobeyed God and ate the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. That disobedience separated God and mankind and also brought with it physical death.

At that point the universe and everything in it or would ever be in it was condemned (separated from God).

A way had to be made to bridge that gap or all would remain condemned.

God took on the form of man and came down to earth in the form of a man we call Jesus and died on the cross to make a way mankind could be reunited with God, as the first man was before he ate the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. He should have been call Emmanuel (Mat 1:23) which means God with us but men just refuse to obey God.

So all mankind is condemned.
Mankind continues to be condemned because he has not trusted God to give him eternal life receiving a full pardon for that condemnation.

So when a man/woman accepts God's offer of the free full pardon he/she is no longer condemned.

If they do not receive that free full pardon they remain condemned for eternity.

How can any adult read this and think that it's not a work of total fiction?

It's also utterly immoral, it condemns almost all humanity that's ever lived and will ever live to eternal suffering for no other reason than being born in the wrong time, the wrong place or to the wrong people. Trillions of souls. What a steaming pile of manure. An obvious fabrication.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


Replies to this message:
 Message 70 by Phat, posted 12-22-2018 4:33 PM Tangle has responded
 Message 72 by Phat, posted 12-23-2018 2:58 AM Tangle has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 15986
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.4


(1)
Message 64 of 89 (845735)
12-19-2018 2:37 PM
Reply to: Message 60 by ICANT
12-19-2018 12:29 AM


Re: Birds Of A Feather
ICANT writes:

When Jesus comes back to earth where do you think He is going to return too?


Earth. Why would He be limited to one locale?

ICANT writes:

Why would Matthew mention Jerusalem?


Indeed. Why would he? Which is why it makes no sense to assume Jerusalem.

ICANT writes:

For that matter why would you? Especially when you seem to know so little of what the Bible actually says.


You're funny. I have quoted what the Bible says and I have pointed out where you have twisted it.

ICANT writes:

I am a joint heir with Jesus that makes Him my big brother.


Sez you. Since Jesus was the Son of man, He was by definition the brother of all other sons of man.

ICANT writes:

If a person has not accepted the offer of a free full pardon offered by God through the death on the cross being born into the family of God they are not Jesus brother.


But of course that is not how brotherhood works. Brothers are brothers by birth. They can also be nominal brothers, for all intents and purposes the same as biological brothers. But what you can not do is exclude biological brothers.

ICANT writes:

The US spends between 700 and 800 billion per year on poverty in the US.

The US spends 50 billion per year around the world.

Sure seems to me our country is trying to feed and clothe a lot of people.


You missed the word "prisons". How many people does the US visit and comfort in prison?

ICANT writes:

The part of the quote I changed to green says this meeting takes place in the air. Jesus does not touch the earth so it is not the second coming. When His feet touch the Mount of Olives Zec. 14:4, that is the second coming.


It doesn't say that Jesus doesn't touch the earth. It just says that the living meet Him in the air.

ICANT writes:

The large capital white text says the dead in Christ shall rise first.


Touché.

ICANT writes:

This will take place a maximum of 7 and a minimum of 3 1/2 years before Jesus will set His feet on the Mount of Olives.


That part is entirely made up, 100% fiction, without a germ of truth to it.

ICANT writes:

But what you are doing is not even close to debating. It is not even close to arguing a point. You do not seem capable of reading and understanding what you read and being able to discuss it.


If you're such a master debater, you should understand that the debater (you) doesn't get to decide who's winning.

ICANT writes:

I do not have time to be wasting trying to discuss something with someone who is being dishonest and not interested in the truth.


YOU'RE dishonest, as many people besides me have pointed out. I DO have time to point out your dishonesty and your abuse of the scriptures and I will continue to do so.

ICANT writes:

So if your next post is as daff at the one I am responding too you will not have to worry about me answering another of your posts.


I couldn't care less if you ever answer one of my posts but you can count on me answering your nonsense. You can run but you can't hide.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 60 by ICANT, posted 12-19-2018 12:29 AM ICANT has not yet responded

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 1921
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.7


(1)
Message 65 of 89 (845742)
12-19-2018 3:22 PM


I thought the Peanut Gallery was for non-participants in the Great Debate to comment about the Great Debate.

Why are Phat and ICANT carrying on debates here?


What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


Replies to this message:
 Message 66 by AZPaul3, posted 12-19-2018 4:01 PM Tanypteryx has responded
 Message 69 by Phat, posted 12-21-2018 2:56 PM Tanypteryx has acknowledged this reply

    
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 3633
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 3.6


Message 66 of 89 (845745)
12-19-2018 4:01 PM
Reply to: Message 65 by Tanypteryx
12-19-2018 3:22 PM


Because it's interesting.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by Tanypteryx, posted 12-19-2018 3:22 PM Tanypteryx has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 67 by Tanypteryx, posted 12-19-2018 4:37 PM AZPaul3 has responded

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 1921
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.7


Message 67 of 89 (845746)
12-19-2018 4:37 PM
Reply to: Message 66 by AZPaul3
12-19-2018 4:01 PM


Ok if you say so.

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 66 by AZPaul3, posted 12-19-2018 4:01 PM AZPaul3 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 68 by AZPaul3, posted 12-19-2018 5:41 PM Tanypteryx has not yet responded

    
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 3633
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 3.6


Message 68 of 89 (845749)
12-19-2018 5:41 PM
Reply to: Message 67 by Tanypteryx
12-19-2018 4:37 PM


Ok if you say so.

So let it be written.

So let it be done.

Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 67 by Tanypteryx, posted 12-19-2018 4:37 PM Tanypteryx has not yet responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 11882
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.4


Message 69 of 89 (845880)
12-21-2018 2:56 PM
Reply to: Message 65 by Tanypteryx
12-19-2018 3:22 PM


The Great Peanut
Why are Phat and ICANT carrying on debates here?
It's our way to carry on our debate with you included...without disrupting the actual thread. The idea is that you comment here about what is said there and we also can reply to you here.

Or something like that. (Moose trademark)

Edited by Phat, : spell


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. –RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." –Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by Tanypteryx, posted 12-19-2018 3:22 PM Tanypteryx has acknowledged this reply

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 11882
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.4


Message 70 of 89 (845921)
12-22-2018 4:33 PM
Reply to: Message 63 by Tangle
12-19-2018 1:14 PM


Oh What A Tangled Web We Weave
Awaiting your response to my mention of you (and ringo) in the Great Debate. I know you will tell me that I don't understand that you have no vendetta...you simply don't give it all much thought. Yet note how hostile you get towards ICANT when you rant about his arrogance. Would you be the same way towards God if he, in fact, existed according to all of the "ridiculous made up myths?"

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. –RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." –Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 63 by Tangle, posted 12-19-2018 1:14 PM Tangle has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 71 by Tangle, posted 12-22-2018 5:38 PM Phat has responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 6497
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 71 of 89 (845923)
12-22-2018 5:38 PM
Reply to: Message 70 by Phat
12-22-2018 4:33 PM


Re: Oh What A Tangled Web We Weave
Phat writes:

Awaiting your response to my mention of you (and ringo) in the Great Debate.

I'm not reading that thread anymore Phat, I'm afraid it makes me feel physically sick.

I know you will tell me that I don't understand that you have no vendetta...you simply don't give it all much thought.

I don't know what this refers to so If you want me to answer your questions you'll have to bring them here

Yet note how hostile you get towards ICANT when you rant about his arrogance.

I've explained that I consider ICANT to be a charlatan, selling his primitive superstitions to the vulnerable.

Would you be the same way towards God if he, in fact, existed according to all of the "ridiculous made up myths?"

You do ask the weirdest questions. I expect I would behave the same way that everyone else would. Including the 16th century fake pastor.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 70 by Phat, posted 12-22-2018 4:33 PM Phat has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 73 by Phat, posted 12-23-2018 3:02 AM Tangle has responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 11882
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.4


Message 72 of 89 (845930)
12-23-2018 2:58 AM
Reply to: Message 63 by Tangle
12-19-2018 1:14 PM


Why So Many?
Trillions of souls
. I don't see why. If all that anyone needs to do is trust that God is and is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him it only starts with trust. Why would trillions of souls never think about this in some way?

My point is that it is highly unlikely that so many would refuse a simple consideration.

it condemns almost all humanity that's ever lived and will ever live to eternal suffering for no other reason than being born in the wrong time, the wrong place or to the wrong people.
From what I understand, there is nobody who was born in the wrong time or place. How many people do you know who have never heard of Jesus or the concept of forgiveness? Nobody can honestly say they didnt know. What they can say is that they gave it little thought. If they died without getting around to thinking about it, I believe that they would have one more opportunity before eternity. Your problem seems to be in insisting that "the product" is worthless.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. –RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." –Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 63 by Tangle, posted 12-19-2018 1:14 PM Tangle has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 74 by Tangle, posted 12-23-2018 3:40 AM Phat has responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 11882
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.4


Message 73 of 89 (845931)
12-23-2018 3:02 AM
Reply to: Message 71 by Tangle
12-22-2018 5:38 PM


Re: Oh What A Tangled Web We Weave
tangle writes:

I consider ICANT to be a charlatan, selling his primitive superstitions to the vulnerable.

From what I see, everything he is saying is free. And why are you worried about people being vulnerable to that and not worried about the thousands of other influences?

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. –RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." –Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 71 by Tangle, posted 12-22-2018 5:38 PM Tangle has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 75 by Tangle, posted 12-23-2018 3:47 AM Phat has not yet responded
 Message 76 by ringo, posted 12-23-2018 2:06 PM Phat has responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 6497
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 74 of 89 (845932)
12-23-2018 3:40 AM
Reply to: Message 72 by Phat
12-23-2018 2:58 AM


Re: Why So Many?
Phat writes:

I don't see why. If all that anyone needs to do is trust that God is and is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him it only starts with trust. Why would trillions of souls never think about this in some way?

Because trillions of people have never even heard of your bloody Christ let alone thought the simple-minded story is true!

My point is that it is highly unlikely that so many would refuse a simple consideration.

But it's a simple fact.

According to your pagan pastor everyone that isn't born again (whatever that means) is going to hell. That means all the people born before Christianity was invented and all the people not born to Christian parents and all the people not born in Christian societies and all the people that hear the immoral evils spouted by so-called Chistians and reject them, are going to hell. As if! What crap.

From what I understand, there is nobody who was born in the wrong time or place.

Oh Phat, are you another American that doesn't own a passport?

How many people do you know who have never heard of Jesus or the concept of forgiveness? Nobody can honestly say they didnt know. What they can say is that they gave it little thought. If they died without getting around to thinking about it, I believe that they would have one more opportunity before eternity.

You can believe anything you like, I'm simply reporting the beliefs of your beloved pastor.

Your problem seems to be in insisting that "the product" is worthless.

It's worse than worthless, your pastor's product is revolting and dangerous. If you must buy a product at least buy it off GDR, he's another fantacist but at least his product has decent moral values.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 72 by Phat, posted 12-23-2018 2:58 AM Phat has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 77 by Phat, posted 12-23-2018 2:26 PM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 6497
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 75 of 89 (845933)
12-23-2018 3:47 AM
Reply to: Message 73 by Phat
12-23-2018 3:02 AM


Re: Oh What A Tangled Web We Weave
Phat writes:

And why are you worried about people being vulnerable to that and not worried about the thousands of other influences?

Who says I'm not worried about other influences?

ICANT is here, now, writing unbelievable crap so he's the one I'm currently posting about.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 73 by Phat, posted 12-23-2018 3:02 AM Phat has not yet responded

  
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