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Author Topic:   The Law Of Contradiction
Annafan
Member (Idle past 4579 days)
Posts: 418
From: Belgium
Joined: 08-08-2005


Message 151 of 177 (340503)
08-16-2006 12:31 PM
Reply to: Message 150 by robinrohan
08-16-2006 11:59 AM


Re: Welcome to EvC
Robinrohan writes:
quote:
Considering the existence of a diety simply doesn't have a place in my life, to put it simply.
How very odd. "Considering" it seems to me like something very natural.
I can honestly say that I've never taken the possibility serious, or found a reason to take the possibility serious or worth considering. I feel absolutely not emotionally connected to the possibility. So obviously I might ask myself the question "What if He truly exists?" But I don't feel anything when I ask that question. I seem to be so utterly convinced of the fact that it is "unknowable", that the question is meaningless for all practical purposes.
The only reasonable reason that I see someone could possibly have, is being uncomfortable with the idea that you have unanswered questions. So instead of saying that you don't know, you attribute it to "God". But I absolutely have no trouble with the idea that there are things that I will never know.
It's very hard to imagine anything that would actually convince me. Maybe a sudden complete worldwide peace or something. All I can say is that I will probably only know it, if and when it actually happens, lol.

This message is a reply to:
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DominionSeraph
Member (Idle past 4754 days)
Posts: 365
From: on High
Joined: 01-26-2005


Message 152 of 177 (342898)
08-24-2006 2:25 AM
Reply to: Message 99 by Hyroglyphx
08-12-2006 12:11 AM


Re: Welcome to EvC
nemesis_juggernaut writes:
Anyone that spends gobs of time attempting to refute a Deity seems counter-intuitive and ultimately pointless to me.
"Emperor Palpatine wants me to kill your family. As I don't want a Star Destroyer to pay me a visit, I'm gonna have to abide."
Give me a good reason why I should reconsider.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 99 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-12-2006 12:11 AM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 153 by Rob, posted 11-03-2006 12:30 PM DominionSeraph has replied
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Rob 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5848 days)
Posts: 2297
Joined: 06-01-2006


Message 153 of 177 (361118)
11-03-2006 12:30 PM
Reply to: Message 152 by DominionSeraph
08-24-2006 2:25 AM


Re: Welcome to EvC
"Emperor Palpatine wants me to kill your family. As I don't want a Star Destroyer to pay me a visit, I'm gonna have to abide."
Give me a good reason why I should reconsider.
Well, it appears that you do understand...

"If we cut up beasts simply because they cannot prevent us and because we are backing our own side in the struggle for existence, it is only logical to cut up imbeciles, criminals, enemies, or capitalists for the same reasons." (C.S. Lewis)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 152 by DominionSeraph, posted 08-24-2006 2:25 AM DominionSeraph has replied

Replies to this message:
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tudwell
Member (Idle past 5978 days)
Posts: 172
From: KCMO
Joined: 08-20-2006


Message 154 of 177 (361294)
11-03-2006 9:00 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Ender
08-11-2006 11:07 AM


Maybe God is omni-contradictory.

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Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 155 of 177 (361471)
11-04-2006 12:26 PM
Reply to: Message 152 by DominionSeraph
08-24-2006 2:25 AM


Re: Welcome to EvC
"Emperor Palpatine wants me to kill your family. As I don't want a Star Destroyer to pay me a visit, I'm gonna have to abide."
Give me a good reason why I should reconsider.
Because I'm rockin' like Dokken!!!

This message is a reply to:
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DominionSeraph
Member (Idle past 4754 days)
Posts: 365
From: on High
Joined: 01-26-2005


Message 156 of 177 (361778)
11-05-2006 3:01 AM
Reply to: Message 153 by Rob
11-03-2006 12:30 PM


Rob writes:
Well, it appears that you do understand...
Yeah, it's not hard to understand why someone faced with such a belief would spend time trying to point out that the Empire doesn't exist.

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 Message 153 by Rob, posted 11-03-2006 12:30 PM Rob has not replied

  
foxjoe 
Inactive Member


Message 157 of 177 (362236)
11-06-2006 7:43 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by PurpleYouko
08-11-2006 12:48 PM


Re: Welcome to EvC
PurpleYouKo said:
quote:
Any Scientist, atheist or theist, is well aware of the fact that science has absolutely nothing to say about God whatsoever. You are right that we cannot disprove him and that the theist cannot prove him.
Actually you are incorrect.
Science says that if God is irriduciply complex, it is necessary that God can't exist. (depends on your concept of God). If you believe what the cargo cults believe that God is a man that brought cargo and shipped it out (as those cults are in Indonesia), then God does exists. Its just still man made.
Edited by foxjoe, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by PurpleYouko, posted 08-11-2006 12:48 PM PurpleYouko has replied

Replies to this message:
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 Message 160 by PurpleYouko, posted 11-07-2006 8:59 AM foxjoe has replied

  
nwr
Member
Posts: 6408
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 158 of 177 (362246)
11-06-2006 8:15 PM
Reply to: Message 157 by foxjoe
11-06-2006 7:43 PM


Re: Welcome to EvC
"Irreducibly complex" isn't really a scientific term. It's a term that creationists and ID proponents have attempted to inject into science. Your argument is really one that the ID proponents should be using against themselves
And a welcome to evcforum for you, too, foxjoe.

Regime change in Washington - midterm elections, Nov 7

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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foxjoe 
Inactive Member


Message 159 of 177 (362262)
11-06-2006 8:56 PM
Reply to: Message 158 by nwr
11-06-2006 8:15 PM


Re: Welcome to EvC
Yes, I realize it wasn't a scientific term. However after reading "the God delusion" I would have to say that when we speak of scientific philosophy, or scientifically we know that God only exists in the minds of the believers (as a concept, like a circle only exists as a concept).
In fact, as many God's exists as their are believers of IT, if you think about it with purity. Because each molecule in each brain is differe, there can be no true agreement on a concept of God within the the bounds of Christianity, or any other nity. This is plainly demonstrated through the multiplicated denominations, sects, non-denominations in the USA alone.
Just something to think about.

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PurpleYouko
Member
Posts: 714
From: Columbia Missouri
Joined: 11-11-2004


Message 160 of 177 (362384)
11-07-2006 8:59 AM
Reply to: Message 157 by foxjoe
11-06-2006 7:43 PM


Re: Welcome to EvC
foxjoe writes:
Science says that if God is irriduciply complex, it is necessary that God can't exist.
Hmm. And there I was thinking that science doesn't actually recognize the existence of "Irreducable Complexity".
The point is that if God exists then he does it in a way that science cannot test, measure or even hypothesize about. Even the creationist term "Irreducable complexity" has nothing to say about God. We can't possibly know if he would fit the criteria unless we could test, measure etc. him/her, so we are back to saying nothing aren't we/

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Replies to this message:
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foxjoe 
Inactive Member


Message 161 of 177 (362500)
11-07-2006 7:47 PM
Reply to: Message 160 by PurpleYouko
11-07-2006 8:59 AM


Re: Welcome to EvC
Excuse me, but science is has a basis in Logic. Can God create a rock he can't life, are logical conundrums. And based on these philosophies, science\logic\ and philosphy says simply that this particular type of God cannot exist.
So back to reality, God only exists in the thoughts of humans, and maybe other lifeforms that haven't yet been seen.
I mean if you can build a spaceship, you can surely have a concept of God. But we americans don't believe in God with 100% certainty even if we do believe. However some Iraqians do demonstrate their belief with 100% certainty. Even as they are wrong.
thoughts?

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Replies to this message:
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jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 162 of 177 (362501)
11-07-2006 7:49 PM
Reply to: Message 161 by foxjoe
11-07-2006 7:47 PM


gotta ask the right questions
So back to reality, God only exists in the thoughts of humans, and maybe other lifeforms that haven't yet been seen.
The Map is not the Territory.
Edited by jar, : No reason given.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

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foxjoe 
Inactive Member


Message 163 of 177 (362502)
11-07-2006 7:51 PM
Reply to: Message 161 by foxjoe
11-07-2006 7:47 PM


Re: Welcome to EvC
You don't need to test God's non-existense. It is demonstrated every day as many millions of African children die each year of many different afflictions.
So proving the absense of a concept, is not too difficult. It just depends on how you define the concept.
A really good question would be, do you wish to believe in or worship a God that allows such abominations to exist EVERY DAY.
So really where are we now?

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Replies to this message:
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PurpleYouko
Member
Posts: 714
From: Columbia Missouri
Joined: 11-11-2004


Message 164 of 177 (362604)
11-08-2006 8:59 AM
Reply to: Message 163 by foxjoe
11-07-2006 7:51 PM


Re: Welcome to EvC
You don't need to test God's non-existense. It is demonstrated every day as many millions of African children die each year of many different afflictions.
Excuse me.
Are you saying that science doesn't need to test something in order to make a determination?
A really good question would be, do you wish to believe in or worship a God that allows such abominations to exist EVERY DAY.
yes that would be a really good question to ask. However it would NOT be a scientific one.
All you have here is a big old "Argument from incredulity". A logical falacy.
I re-iterate, Science says NOTHING about the existence or non-existence of God. It can't! He doesn't fit into its framework.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 165 by DominionSeraph, posted 11-15-2006 6:02 AM PurpleYouko has replied

  
DominionSeraph
Member (Idle past 4754 days)
Posts: 365
From: on High
Joined: 01-26-2005


Message 165 of 177 (363858)
11-15-2006 6:02 AM
Reply to: Message 164 by PurpleYouko
11-08-2006 8:59 AM


PurpleYouko writes:
I re-iterate, Science says NOTHING about the existence or non-existence of God. It can't! He doesn't fit into its framework.
Anything real would fit.
Science says nothing about the existence or nonexistence of God because science only deals with things that are relevant.
Edited by DominionSeraph, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 164 by PurpleYouko, posted 11-08-2006 8:59 AM PurpleYouko has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 166 by PurpleYouko, posted 11-15-2006 8:47 AM DominionSeraph has replied

  
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